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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums"In a white supremacist society…"
In a white supremacist society, white people are permitted to make even criminal, murderous errors without paying for them with their lives.
In a white supremacist society, only beneficiaries of Whiteness deserve a second chance.
In a white supremacist society, when black people make errors, especially criminal ones, it's because they are genetically, intellectually, and morally inferior.
In a white supremacist society, white children are loved, cherished, and revered, and black children are feared, despised, and pitied."
http://sonofbaldwin.tumblr.com/post/23290193450/in-a-white-supremacist-society-black-people-must-be
Therein lies the strategy to smear Trayvon Martin and earn an acquittal for George Zimmerman.
http://news.yahoo.com/evidence-mixed-zimmermans-self-defense-claim-073928701.html
mactime
(202 posts)ignorant black power ramblings as their defense?
Solomon
(12,319 posts)Wow. There's definitely some ignorance going on. Whew!
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)It seems spot-on to me, based on my experience and observations. We're seeing it right now regarding the Trayvon case. At least, those of us who are paying attention.
Uff da!
marmar
(77,106 posts)You're just embarrassing yourself now.
Robb
(39,665 posts)One admin, however, disagreed.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=274300&sub=trans
Bye. Door, ass, etc.
Paging MIRT...
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)Odin2005
(53,521 posts)Taverner
(55,476 posts)Dude, the Klan rally is over on Stormfront. Make haste.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Right?
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)The mere fact that he's held to a different standard than any of his white predecessors proves that's that what it actually is.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)While I won't disagree that a significant portion of the population is, I can't go along with anything approaching most.
And which standard is Obama being held to that's different from his white predecessors?
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)Particularly, the fact that Trayvon needed to be beatified in order to receive the same amount of justice that would be available to any white victim in his shoes. That the first thing that the racist supporters of Zimmerman did to smear Trayvon was to use a form of "niggerfication" to justify his death.
That's something that usually won't happen to whites in this country, because to be white means that you're on the top of the hill.
And in regard to the current President, how many of his predecessors had to put up with this:
One of the Breitbart dopes has a SCOOP: Some sort of ancient press release says Barack Obama was born in Kenya. IMPEACH. Retroactively install John McCain, we have so much Iran bombing to make up for.
This particular dope Ben Shapiro, former boy-pundit Joel Pollak, some guy says he is totally not a birther, at all, whatever gave you that idea, but it is very important that this forgotten old publicity pamphlet from a literary agent for a book project that never happened be unearthed and heavily hyped now, because the president was not properly vetted in 2008. (The idea that the president is a secret radical whose secret radicalism was not properly explored by the mainstream media is a stupid conspiracy theory that is almost as ridiculous as birtherism, by the way. We have proof that the president is not a secret radical leftist, and it is his entire political career including his first term as president of the United States.)
or this:
http://www.salon.com/2012/05/03/republican_fear_factor_salpart/singleton/
I've been around since the Kennedy administration and I don't ever recall any white president ever having his very citizenship questioned, do you?
Or the fact that membership in white supremacist organizations have gone way UP since the election of a black president. That's no coincidence.
These are the very issues that make of the discussion of white privilege in America.
It still exists.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)The things you mentioned come from the very extreme and from people who are very much in the minority in this country.
Birthers?
Never polled higher than 20% as far as I know, and out of that 20%, how many are white supremacists and how many just hate any Democrat in the White House regardless of race?
So since as many as 20% of the population are dumber than a rock, this somehow means we are a White Supremacist Society? Still not sure how you connect the dots on that one. Clinton suffered a $100 million criminal investigation that failed to so much as indict him for a parking ticket. There are always going to be a good percentage of GOPhers who are going to try to usurp democracy in this country any way they can. You might as well get used to that because I don't see it changing anytime soon.
And what is the population rate of people who belong to white supremacist organizations?
.001% of the population?
So let's say their numbers doubled (which is certainly liberal), and now we have .002% of the population who belong to white supremacist organizations. That somehow makes us a white supremacist majority?
While I'll certainly give you that the percentage of bigots and racists in the GOP is high, I can't agree that the US is a "White Supremacist Society". Seems more than a bit over the top to me.
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)THAT should tell you everything you need to know. Birther BS is racist code for "blacks are not REAL Americans".
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)to the views of KKK-types -- segregation, no black people in any position of power, etc?
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)I have taken issue here with straight white male collective guilt threads here but I think this article is pretty much on the money.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Here's the definition I get for 'society':
noun
1.
an organized group of persons associated together for religious, benevolent, cultural, scientific, political, patriotic, or other purposes.
Even if you could somehow tilt your head and accept the implication you're mentioning, who are these organized group(s) of white supremacist persons who are controlling everything? Last time I checked, white supremacist organizations had about 50,000 members which includes those who are part of prison populations. Do you really think these people are driving public policy?
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)white power groups are running the country, but is using intentionaly inflamatory (and yes, hyperbolic) language to describe the definite higher bar that is set for african americans in our culture. unlike the "straight white male lowest setting" nonsense.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)You can't have a "white supremacist society" unless organized white supremacist groups are running the country. Hyperbole means the exaggeration was intentional and I didn't get that from reading it.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)i have seen administrators at schools punish kids of lower socioeconomic classes harder than they would those from wealthy, well-connected families. this disproportionately affects minority students more than white ones (though it happens to poor whites as well.) but its effect is still racist because the people more harshly dealt with are overwhelmingly racial minorities.
now, i disagreed strongly with the post on so-called white male hetero privilege because i believe it sent a message to poor white people that they are losers for being poor - after all, if they are so privileged, why are they poor. i personally would not use the term white supremacy to describe they enequities faced by minorities in this country, but i agree with this article's overarching thesis, which i still do not interpret as a claim that skinheads and klansmen run this country.
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)Most white Americans would have the same reaction to three young white males walking toward them on a sidewalk at night to three young black males?
Who the fuck are you kidding?
And which standard is Obama being held to that's different from his white predecessors?
Obama is completely disallowed from showing the least bit of anger. Every other President gets to be righteously angry from time to time with his political opponents. Whenever Obama flashes the slightest bit if anger, he's an irrational, vicious jungle monkey, and everybody damn well knows it.
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)This has been experimentally proven. the vast majority, including racial minorities, subconsciously associate black faces with negative words and white faces with positive words. A person may honestly believe they are not racist, but that does not mean they are not racist.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)First of all, even if the study you're talking about is true, that still doesn't prove one single person is racist. A racist believes in the supremacy of certain races over others. A subconscious positive or negative association among races doesn't even come close to proving racism.
Next, a society implies a group of people organized along common interests. The only people I know that are organized along those interests are white supremacist groups that make up about .001% of the population.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Oh wait a minute, they impeached him. My bad.
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)Or a depiction of him as a "welfare thug"?
Clinton's whiteness was never in question
But it's whiteness itself that is the standard that Obama is held up against today.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Susan Coleman: Rumors were circulating in Arkansas of an affair with Bill Clinton. She was found dead with a gunshot wound to the head at 7 1/2 months pregnant. Death was an apparent suicide.
Larry Guerrin: Was killed in February 1987 while investigating the INSLAW case.
Kevin Ives & Don Henry: Initial cause of death was reported to be the result of falling asleep on a railroad track in Arkansas on August 23, 1987. This ruling was reported by the State medical examiner Fahmy Malak. Later it was determined that Kevin died from a crushed skull prior to being placed on the tracks. Don had been stabbed in the back. Rumors indicate that they might have stumbled upon a Mena drug operation.
Keith Coney: Keith had information on the Ives/Henry deaths. Died in a motorcycle accident in July 1988 with unconfirmed reports of a high speed car chase.
Keith McKaskle: McKaskle has information on the Ives/Henry deaths. He was stabbed to death in November 1988.
Gregory Collins: Greg had information on the Ives/Henry deaths. He died from a gunshot wound to the face in January 1989.
Jeff Rhodes: He had information on the deaths of Ives, Henry & McKaskle. His burned body was found in a trash dump in April 1989. He died of a gunshot wound to the head and there was some body mutilation, leading to the probably speculation that he was tortured prior to being killed.
James Milam: Milam had information on the Ives & Henry deaths. He was decapitated. The state Medical examiner, Fahmy Malak, initially ruled death due to natural causes.
Richard Winters: Winters was a suspect in the deaths of Ives & Henry. He was killed in a "robbery" in July 1989 which was subsequently proven to be a setup.
Jordan Kettleson: Kettleson had information on the Ives & Henry deaths. He was found shot to death in the front seat of his pickup in June 1990.
Alan Standorf: An employee of the National Security Agency in electronic intelligence. Standorf was a source of information for Danny Casalaro who was investigating INSLAW, BCCI, etc. Standorf's body was found in the backseat of a car at Washington National Airport on Jan 31, 1991.
Dennis Eisman: An attorney with information on INSLAW. Eisman was found shot to death on April 5, 1991.
Danny Casalaro: Danny was a free-lance reporter and writer who was investigating the "October Surprise", INSLAW and BCCI. Danny was found dead in a bathtub in a Sheraton Hotel room in Martinsburg, West Virginia. Danny was staying at the hotel while keeping appointments in the DC area pertinent to his investigation. He was found with his wrists slashed. At least one, and possibly both of his wrists were cut 10 times. All of his research materials were missing and have never been recovered.
Victor Raiser: The National Finance Co-Chair for "Clinton for President." He died in a airplane crash on July 30, 1992.
R. Montgomery Raiser: Also involved in the Clinton presidential campaign. He died in the same plane crash as Victor.
Paul Tully: Tulley was on the Democratic National Committee. He was found dead of unknown causes in his hotel room on September 24, 1992. No autopsy was ever allowed.
Ian Spiro: Spiro had supporting documentation for grand jury proceedings on the INSLAW case. His wife and 3 children were found murdered on November 1, 1992 in their home. They all died of gunshot wounds to the head. Ian's body was found several days later in a parked car in the Borego Desert. Cause of death? The ingestion of cyanide. FBI report indicated that Ian had murdered his family and then committed suicide.
Paula Gober: A Clinton speech writer. She died in a car accident on December 9, 1992 with no known witnesses.
Jim Wilhite: Wilhite was an associate of Mack McClarty's former firm. Wilhite died in a skiing accident on December 21, 1992. He also had extensive ties to Clinton with whom he visited by telephone just hours before his death.
Steve Willis, Robert Williams, Todd McKeahan & Conway LeBleu: Died Feburary 28, 1993 by gunfire at Waco. All four were examined by a pathologist and died from identical wounds to the left temple. All four had been body guards for Bill Clinton, three while campaigning for President and when he was Governor of Arkansas.They also were the ONLY 4 BATF agents killed at Waco.
Sgt. Brian Haney, Sgt. Tim Sabel, Maj. William Barkley, Capt. Scott Reynolds: Died: May 19, 1993 - All four men died when their helicopter crashed in the woods near Quantico, Va. - Reporters were barred from the site, and the head of the fire department responding to the crash described it by saying, "Security was tight," with "lots of Marines with guns." A videotape made by a firefighter was seized by the Marines. All four men had escorted Clinton on his flight to the carrier Roosevelt shortly before their deaths.
John Crawford: An attorney with information on INSLAW. He died from a heart attack in Tacoma in April of 1993.
John Wilson: Found dead from an apparent hanging suicide on May 18, 1993. He was a former Washington DC council member and claimed to have info on Whitewater.
Paul Wilcher: A lawyer who was investigating drug running out of Mena, Arkansas and who also sought to expose the "October Surprise", BCCI and INSLAW. He was found in his Washington DC apartment dead of unknown causes on June 22, 1993.
Vincent Foster: A White House deputy counsel and long-time personal friend of Bill and Hillary's. Found on July 20, 1993, dead of a gunshot wound to the mouth -- a death ruled suicide. Many different theories on this case! Readers are encouraged to read our report in Strange Deaths.
Jon Parnell Walker: An investigator for the RTC who was looking into the linkage between the Whitewater and Madison S&L bankruptcy. Walker "fell" from the top of the Lincoln Towers Building.
Stanley Heard & Steven Dickson: They were members of the Clinton health care advisory committee. They died in a plane crash on September 10, 1993.
Jerry Luther Parks: Parks was the Chief of Security for Clinton's national campaign headquarters in Little Rock. Gunned down in his car on September 26, 1993 near the intersection of Chenal Parkway and Highway 10 west of Little Rock. Parks was shot through the rear window of his car. The assailant then pulled around to the driver's side of Park's car and shot him three more times with a 9mm pistol. His family reported that shortly before his death, they were being followed by unknown persons, and their home had been broken into (despite a top quality alarm system). Parks had been compiling a dossier on Clinton's illicit activities. The dossier was stolen.
Ed Willey: A Clinton fundraiser. He died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound on November 30, 1993. His death came the same day his wife, Kathleen, was sexually assaulted in the White House by Bill Clinton.
Gandy Baugh: Baugh was Lasater's attorney and committed suicide on January 8, 1994. Baugh's partner committed suicide exactly one month later on February 8, 1994.
Herschell Friday: A member of the presidential campaign finance committee. He died in an airplane explosion on March 1, 1994.
Ronald Rogers: Rogers died on March 3, 1994 just prior to releasing sensitive information to a London newspaper. Cause of death? Undetermined.
Kathy Furguson: A 38 year old hospital worker whose ex-husband is a co- defendant in the Paula Jones sexual harassment law suit. She had information supporting Paula Jone's allegations. She died of an apparent suicide on May 11, 1994 from a gunshot wound to the head.
Bill Shelton: Shelton was an Arkansas police officer and was found dead as an apparent suicide on kathy Ferguson's grave (Kathy was his girl friend), on June 12, 1994. This "suicide" was the result of a gunshot wound to the back of the head.
Stanley Huggins: Huggins, 46, was a principal in a Memphis law firm which headed a 1987 investigation into the loan practices of Madison Guaranty S&L. Stanley died in Delaware in July 1994 -- reported cause of death was viral pneumonia.
Paul Olson: A Federal witness in investigations to drug money corruption in Chicago politics, Paul had just finished 2 days of FBI interviews when his plane ride home crashed, killing Paul and 130 others on Sept 8 1994. The Sept. 15, 1994 Tempe Tribune newspaper reported that the FBI suspected that a bomb had brought down the airplane.
Calvin Walraven: 24 year on Walraven was a key witness against Jocelyn Elder's son's drug case. Walraven was found dead in his apartment with a gunshot wound to the head. Tim Hover, a Little Rock police spokesman says no foul play is suspected.
Alan G. Whicher: Oversaw Clinton's Secret Service detail. In October 1994 Whicher was transferred to the Secret Service field office in the Murrah Building in Oklahoma City. Whatever warning was given to the BATF agents in that building did not reach Alan Whicher, who died in the bomb blast of April 19th 1995.
Duane Garrett: Died July 26, 1995-A lawyer and a talk show host for KGO-AM in San Fransisco, Duane was the campaign finance chairman for Diane Fienstien's run for the senate, and was a friend and fundraiser for Al Gore. Garrett was under investigation for defrauding investors in Garrett's failed sports memorabilia venture. There was talk of a deal to evade prosecution. On July 26th, Garrett canceled an afternoon meeting with his lawyer because he had to meet some people at the San Fransisco airport. Three hours later he was found floating in the bay under the Golden Gate Bridge.
Ron Brown:. The Commerce Secretary died on April 3, 1996, in an Air Force jet carrying Brown and 34 others, including 14 business executives on a trade mission to Croatia, crashed into a mountainside. The Air Force, in a 22-volume report issued in June of 1996, confirmed its initial judgment that the crash resulted from pilot errors and faulty navigation equipment At the time of Brown's death, Independent Counsel Daniel Pearson was seeking to determine whether Brown had engaged in several sham financial transactions with longtime business partner Nolanda Hill shortly before he became secretary of commerce.
Charles Meissner: died: UNK - Following Ron Brown's death, John Huang was placed on a Commerce Department contract that allowed him to retain his security clearance
by Charles Meissner. Shortly thereafter, Meissner died in the crash of a small plane. He was an Assistant Secretary of Commerce for International Economic Policy.
William Colby: Retired CIA director was found dead on May 6,1996 after his wife reported him missing on April 27,1996. Apparently, Colby decided to go on a impromptu canoeing excursion and never returned. Colby who had just started writing for Strategic Investment newsletter, worried many in the intelligent community. Colby's past history of divulging CIA secrets in the past were well known. Strategic Investor had covered the Vince Foster suicide and had hired handwriting experts to review Foster's suicide note.
Admiral Jeremy Boorda: Died on May 16,1996 after he went home for lunch and decided to shoot himself in the chest (by one report, twice) rather than be interviewed by Newsweek magazine that afternoon. Explanations for Boorda's suicide focused on a claim that he was embarrassed over two "Valor" pins he was not authorized to wear.
Lance Herndon: Herndon a 41 year old computer specialist and a prominent entrepreneur who received a presidential appointment in 1995 died August 10, 1996 under suspicious circumstances. He appeared to have died from a blow to the head. Police said no weapons were found at his mansion, adding that Mr. Herndon had not been shot or stabbed and there was no evidence of forced entry or theft.
Neil Moody: Died -August 25, 1996 Following Vincent Foster's murder, Lisa Foster married James Moody, a judge in Arkansas, on Jan 1, 1996. Near the time Susan McDougal first went to jail for contempt, Judge Moor's son, Neil died in a car crash. There were other reports that Neil Moody had discovered something very unsettling among his stepmother's private papers and was threatening to go public with it just prior to the beginning of the Democratic National Convention. He was alleged to have been talking to Bob Woodward of the Washington Post about a blockbuster story. Witnesses said they saw Neil Moody sitting in his car arguing with another person just prior to His car suddenly speeding off out of control and hitting a brick wall.
Barbara Wise: Wise a 14-year Commerce Department employee found dead and partially naked in her office following a long weekend. She worked in the same section as John Huang. Officially, she is said to have died of natural causes.
Doug Adams: Died January 7, 1997- A lawyer in Arkansas who got involved trying to help the people who were being swindled out of their life savings. Adams was found in his vehicle with a gunshot wound to his head in a Springfield Mo. hospital parking lot.
Mary C. Mahoney: 25, murdered at the Georgetown Starbuck's coffee bar over the 4th of July '97 weekend. She was a former White House intern who worked with John Huang. Apparently she knew Monica Lewinsky and her sexual encounters with Bill Clinton. Although not verified, it has been said that Lewinsky told Linda Tripp that she did not want to end up like Mahoney.
Ronald Miller: Suddenly took ill on October 3rd,1997 and steadily worsened until his death 9 days later. (This pattern fits Ricin poisoning.) Owing to the strangeness of the illness, doctors at the Integris Baptist Medical Center referred the matter to the Oklahoma State Medical Examiner's Office. The Oklahoma State Medical Examiner's Office promptly ran tests on samples of Ron Miller's blood, but has refused to release the results or even to confirm that the tests were ever completed.
Had been investigated by authorities over the sale of his company, Gage Corp. to Dynamic Energy Resources, Inc. was the man who tape recorded Gene and Nora Lum and turned those tapes (and other records) over to congressional oversight investigators. The Lums were sentenced to prison for campaign finance violations, using "straw donors" to conceal the size of their contributions to various candidates. Indeed, Dynamic Energy Resources, Inc. had hired Ron Brown's son Michael solely for the purpose of funneling $60,000 through him to the Commerce Secretary, according to Nolanda Hill's testimony.
Sandy Hume: On Sunday, February 22nd, 1998, Sandy Hume, the 28 year old son of journalist Britt Hume, was reportedly found dead in his Arlington, Virginia home. Aside from the statement that this was an "apparent" suicide, there remains in place a total media blackout on this story, possibly out of concern that the actual facts will not withstand public scrutiny. Worked for Hill magazine, about Congress for Congress.
Jim McDougal: Bill and Hillary Clinton friend, banker, and political ally, sent to prison for eighteen felony convictions. A key whitewater witness, dies of a heart attack on March, 8 1998. As of this writing allegations that he was given an injection of the diuretic lasix has not been denied or confirmed.
Died on March 8, 1998
Johnny Lawhon: 29, died March 29, 1998- The Arkansas transmission specialist who discovered a pile of Whitewater documents in the trunk of an abandoned car on his property and turned them over to Starr, was killed in a car wreck two weeks after the McDougal death.. Details of the "accident" have been sketchy -- even from the local Little Rock newspaper.
Charles Wilbourne Miller: 63, was found dead of a gunshot wound to the head on November 17, 1998 in a shallow pit about 300 yards from his ranch house near Little Rock. Police found a .410 gauge shotgun near Miller's body and a Ruger .357-caliber revolver submerged in water. Investigators concluded the Ruger was the weapon used by Miller to kill himself. Yet, two rounds in the handgun's cylinder had been spent.
He had long served as executive vice president and member of the board of directors for a company called Alltel and was deeply involved in his own software engineering company until the day he died. Alltel is the successor to Jackson Stephens' Systematics, the company that provided the software for the White House's "Big Brother" data base system and that was behind the administration's plan to develop the secret computer "Clipper" chip to bug every phone, fax and email transmission in America.
Carlos Ghigliotti: 42, was found dead in his home just outside of Washington D.C. on April 28, 2000. There was no sign of a break-in or struggle at the firm of Infrared Technology where the badly decomposed body of Ghigliotti was found. Ghigliotti had not been seen for several weeks, commercial cleaning companies may have been contacted in order for the offices to be cleaned.
Ghigliotti, a thermal imaging analyst hired by the House Government Reform Committee to review tape of the siege, said he determined the FBI fired shots on April 19, 1993. The FBI has explained the light bursts on infrared footage as reflections of sun rays on shards of glass or other debris that littered the scene.
"I conclude this based on the groundview videotapes taken from several different angles simultaneously and based on the overhead thermal tape," Ghigliotti told The Washington Post last October. "The gunfire from the ground is there, without a doubt."
Ghigliotti said the tapes also confirm the Davidians fired repeatedly at FBI agents during the assault, which ended when flames raced through the compound. About 80 Branch Davidians perished that day, some from the fire, others from gunshot wounds.
Mark Corallo, a spokesman for the congressional committee chaired by Rep. Dan Burton, R-Ind., said that police found the business cards of a committee investigator in Ghigliotti's office. Corallo said Ghigliotti's work for the committee ended some time ago.
Tony Moser: 41, was killed as he crossed a street in Pine Bluff, Ark on on June 10, 2000. Killed 10 days after being named a columnist for the Democrat-Gazette newspaper and two days after penning a stinging indictment of political corruption in Little Rock.
The right will go after any Democrats, using any line of attack they can think of. It's not always about race.
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)I've never said that the Right didn't find Clinton objectionable for a host of reasons, it's just that they never disputed his race and citizenship in the way that Obama's race and citizenship has been called into question.
That opposition reveals that the questions of race, white supremacy and privilege are very much alive in America. That any flaw in a black child's background could justify his murder in ways that would never be broached, if that child was white. That it's the President's very blackness itself that's a problem.
http://angryblacklady.com/2010/09/24/apparently-theres-a-worthless-nigger-in-the-white-house/
So, what is it that you're trying to convince me of?
Are you saying that race is no longer an issue in America?
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)is not the same as saying that "race is no longer an issue".
But when an intelligent young black man who would have been born into slavery not so long ago gets elected to the Presidency, carrying states such as Virginia and North Carolina, we can confidently say that race is much less of an issue today than it has been in the past.
MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)In spite of incremental gains, race is always lurking in the nation's psyche, correct?
That the fact that we have a black president isn't the harbinger of the end of the image of white supremacy. It's the very fact that he had to excel and succeed in a white supremacist world in order to achieve the office of the Presidency. He had to be twice as good as any white person in order to be considered an "equal".
Still, the ideal exists. It's not going away because a black man had to excel through life, over and above the call of duty to earl the Oval Office. As a matter of fact, his enemies only consider this a temporary anomaly, to be corrected by the election of the next white male. For them, sooner, rather than later.
Half of what he's done could qualify any white male for the Presidency. Yet he had to prove that he's twice as good as any white male, and still he doesn't even get half the respect in many circles. The opposition to Obama is quantifiable in more ways than any of his predecessors have had to deal with and his race has been a central theme in that opposition. It's not just because he's a Democrat.
There's a definite double-standard when it comes to race and identity in America. It's all over the place, from the criminal justice system, to social injustice, to entertainment and to politics. The election of one black man to the White House doesn't sweep away the rest of the problem. Once you can prove to me that that double-standard no longer exists, then you can convince me that white supremacy no longer hold sway in this country.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)than were enslaved before the Civil War.
There is no reasonable way we can claim race is less of an issue now than it was then.
RZM
(8,556 posts)The total number of slaves in the US at the outbreak of the Civil War was approximately 4 million (maybe a little less). If we say that half of those were men (that includes children), then that number (2 million) would be roughly equal to the total number of people of any race or sex who are behind bars in the US today. Also the black population today is about 10 times as large as the slave population back then.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)RZM
(8,556 posts)That article simply repeats what Alexander said at a talk. It cites no sources. It does however cite a figure of 846K black men in prison today.
But the 1850 census showed 3.2 million slaves. Assuming roughly half were men, that's still twice the number incarcerated today. Even if you subtract children, who are typically 25 percent or so of the total population, it still doesn't match up. And that might not work anyway because it's possible the 846K figure includes juvenile facilities, though I'm not sure about that.
http://www.nytimes.com/1860/07/31/news/southern-views-of-the-census.html
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)any kind of judicial control, i.e., parole and probation. That would seem to make up the difference.
It's funny, I remembered the idea but not that it was hers.
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)there are enrolled in institutions of higher education (colleges and universities).
FWIW. That statistic always depresses the fuck out of me.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)because it feels like she's done something really important and worth understanding. I'm sick of hearing of children gunned down in the street or sent away for life for a bit of pot. Sick of it.
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)in power (Dem or Repig) has a problem with it. I'm sick of a society where 10% own 80% of the wealth and no one in power (Dem or Repig) has a problem with it.
The only ones who have a problem with it in this society are Children's Crusaders (Occupy) and ancient hippies. (I'm neither but am closer to the latter than the former.)
So much to be sick of, so little time
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)Last night I was reading posters in Quebec, in Chicago and in Frankfurt along with a couple of folks in Cairo. It was good to see these younger, better heads at work.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)sumpremacist society" unless we're changing the historical meaning of "white supremacist".
Beacool
(30,253 posts)Ditto for his wife. When Obama has a prosecutor after him, his wife and staffers for 5 years, leaving all of them millions of dollars in debt. When Obama is impeached over lying about a sexual act between two consenting adults, then and only then, will I think that he had it worse than Clinton. BTW, Bill paid off not only his and Hillary's legal bills, but also those of his staffers. All $14M. The Republican witch hut cost the taxpayers between $40-70M.
Yes, they go after Obama due to his race, but they went after Clinton for a myriad of other things.
treestar
(82,383 posts)And they had a reason to impeach him. He gave them that.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)XemaSab
(60,212 posts)Then go reread the OP.
Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)Obama's 2 lowest voting rates were among the old white men and the old white women.
Those are just facts.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)So what?
Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)It probably will be closer to 90 to 95% this year once they learn that Mormons believe that Satan was the twin brother of Jesus Christ.
And that they believe they can become gawds themselves with their own universe to rule over after they die, if they are very, very good Mormons.
Shit like that is hard for white people to understand why it is bad.
It totally goes against everything Hispanic people are taught from their childhood days in church.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)Whether it was Obama's in 2008 when some people thought that he was a Muslim and Romney's now. There's plenty to go after politicians, but their religion should not be an issue.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)arely staircase
(12,482 posts)because of their religion and we aren't supposed to bring up their religion.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)younger whites or black people, given the facts of history?
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)I'm just curious as to how that works.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)the election of obama abolished the racist power structure. we did it everybody. congratulations.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)that we are not a white supremacist society. Fiendishly clever and evil.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)A question is neither right or wrong like an assertion, it's an interrogative sentence designed to request information.
Just sayin'
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Otherwise the question begs for an answer.
BOG PERSON
(2,916 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Or don't reply. Saves everyone's time that way.
Just sayin'
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)The elites decide who the two candidates are and the rabble votes.
Of course, in a country with no white supremacist problem, anti-black HATE GROUP activity wouldn't go though the roof as ours did when Obama was elected.
In a country with no white supremacist problem, the flagship city would not be frisking hundreds of thousands of black people every year for no reason as New York is doing.
In a country with no white supremacist problem, it wouldn't take widespread protests to arrest the shooter of an unarmed black teenager killed while walking to his father's home.
In a country with no white supremacist problem, states all across the country wouldn't be considering voter ID laws designed to disenfranchise black voters.
In a country with no white supremacist problem, no one would be claiming the the election of one black man proves there is no white supremacist problem.
Good grief.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)EFerrari
(163,986 posts)if the problem wasn't societal? If it was just a few Lindy Englands behaving badly?
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)A "white supremacist society" used to mean places like the south under segregation, or south africa, where black people lived under de jure restriction and couldn't be elected to dogcatcher, societies where the average white person believed blacks to be genetically inferior and were taught so from the cradle.
That's not the kind of society we live in at present. Why not say "racist society?"
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)Which is that black people are still held to a higher standard just to receive basic respect.
But when the first words are "white supremacist society" and "white supremacist" means "KKK-style law and thought," what's heard is "Nothing has changed since 1910, white people are klansmen."
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)imho it's about f#cking time to stop assuaging the majority's ego and to start pointing out the cradle to prison routing of young black men and ditto for all other *national* programs that increasingly make this country look like 1910.
But, I admit that's my thinking right now. I may learn better or I may not.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)organized to change it. But when they aren't, is telling them they're klansmen the best way to go about it?
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)"But when we talked to you like adults, you didn't listen"?
lol
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)people are aware of the disparities or the underlying mechanisms that create them, I think you're mistaken. I don't see much awareness where I am except for young people re drug sentencing.
I understood the OP and am not personally offended by the rhetoric. But it's a rhetoric that preaches to the already converted. If that's the intent, no problem.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)Imo, though, there is a value in preaching to the converted because the converted are daily flooded with messages that they are mistaken. There is a value in shoring up the support one already has, in that situation.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)though i do a fair amount of it myself, lol. and am not particularly good at preaching to the unconverted.
bhikkhu
(10,725 posts)...as they don't think of themselves as racists, they don't deliberately make choices as racists, and they can have friends and chose leaders regardless of race.
There is an underlying current of white male privilege running through US culture which naturally (or "collectively" reacts against a threat to its continuity, however. The repugs are not unaware of this condition of anxiety, and have played it for all its worth since before the election. Think of all the people who are certain that the country has gone to crap since the election, and that Obama somehow is destroying the country. It could easily be argued that he has done exactly what any other president would have done, and done it well, and that the recovery is slow but steadily moving things in the right direction. Jobs, GDP, stock markets, government spending, taxation, foreign affairs, etc, all have fared well and are trending to the good by any objective measure. Except - by his position he is a threat to white male privilege. Nothing else.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Nobody is saying there isn't racism in this country, even in epidemic proportions. However, making the claim of a "white supremacist society" means that racism is not only mainstream to the majority, but overt and organized. I just can't go along with that.
bhikkhu
(10,725 posts)but thinking of things more along the lines of http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002692549 - "Straight White Male: the Lowest Difficulty Setting There Is".
While things have evened out and gotten much more equal than the past, there is still the underlying current that privilege extends most deferentially to straight white males in our culture, and everyone else has to try harder for less. "Culture" itself is primarily embodied in our language, thought-pattern, prejudices, etc, acquired unconsciously in childhood. Regardless of our deliberate choices we all participate in attitudes and behaviors that we don't agree with.
treestar
(82,383 posts)President Obama has been judged on a harsher standard, including by people who claim they voted for him.
Number23
(24,544 posts)AverageJoe90
(10,745 posts)Beacool
(30,253 posts)he wouldn't even have been elected senator.
Why is is OK to continually bash white people? No race is better or worse than another. There are good people and bad people of all races.
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)with bashing white people.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)How about if instead of whites someone had made a derogatory statement about Hispanics, Asians, etc? Why is it OK, particularly in liberal circles, to always disparage white people?
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)and not the racism in this country that makes those statements accurate on the whole?
That makes no sense to me. The obvious answer to your question is that Asians and "Hispanics" have not developed national programs to disenfranchise white votes or to incarcerate their kids or to defund their schools or to keep them out of certain industry or communities. There is no national Asian or "Hispanic" political party dedicated to stirring up hatred of white people. The closest thing there is, the New Black Panthers, has about seven members.
So, there is no comparison.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)That Hilary lost the primary
EFerrari
(163,986 posts)awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)But it seems that if there is ever an opportunity to say how much harder the Clintons had it, then this one will jump in and let us know how inferior Obama is
Beacool
(30,253 posts)Besides, it's true. I'll feel sorry for Obama the day he's impeached and left millions of dollars in debt. So far, he's had it pretty good.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)I'm far from being the only one who thinks that Hillary was the more qualified candidate in 2008 and now for that matter.
uponit7771
(90,370 posts)fascisthunter
(29,381 posts)Cave_Johnson
(137 posts)... for all the reasons listed above.
Kingofalldems
(38,501 posts)Zax2me
(2,515 posts)Premise dead.
uponit7771
(90,370 posts)krispos42
(49,445 posts)White blood is so weak that a mere ⅛ of non-white blood is enough to make that person not-white.
Think about that...
⅛ of black blood makes you black
⅞ of white blood doesn't make you white.
HiPointDem
(20,729 posts)blood test for "blackness" and "whiteness".
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)This society is biased and unfair against black men, but it is not "white supremacist" for the very obvious reasons posted upthread.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)i agree with the overall thesis (there is a double standard for whites and non-whites) and i even get the hyperbole, but it seems to have obscured said thesis.