Sandra Bland death ruled a suicide by hanging, Texas prosecutor says

[spanone]

wait a minute, i thought texas wanted a do-over on the autopsy?????? this gets weirder and weirder.

Medical examiners ruled the death of Sandra Bland a suicide by hanging, and the autopsy uncovered no evidence of a violent struggle, a Texas prosecutor said Thursday.

Warren Diepraam, the first assistant district attorney of Waller County, released the findings at a press conference.

Bland was found dead in her Texas jail cell on July 13, three days after she was stopped for failing to signal a lane change. Authorities concluded that she hanged herself in her cell — but her family and friends expressed suspicion about the official account.

Diepraam said there were no defensive injuries on Bland’s hands. He said there were about 30 cuts on her wrists, and that the scarring suggests they were made two to four weeks ago, well before her arrest.

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sandra-bland-death-ruled-suicide-hanging-texas-prosecutor-says

[luvspeas]

1. good old swift Texas justice! Now for a quick cremation!!!! n/t

[WillowTree]

6. Her body has already been returned to Illinois.

[hlthe2b]

2. the family needs a Cyril Wecht (or similar) to repeat the autopsy and review all previous

findings.

[Igel]

28. They said days ago that's what they'd be doing.

Whether they do or don't the county officials have no say in and no official opinion about. Not their business, whatever they may think privately.

[ruffburr]

3. Now that is a-

Total crock of shit, be the first time any one got a large amount of marijuana into jail while just being picked up, And then she smoked it? or ate it? really now, do tell

[LiberalArkie]

4. That is very plausible for Arkansas and Texas.

There was a man found close to me that had his hands, feet and head removed and bullet holes and knife wounds in torso. Ruled suicide.

[brush]

5. Just heard that she was pretty tall, nearly 6 feet . . .

and the only pipe in that cell where she could've hung herself is only 5 ft off the floor.

And then there is the issue of that HUGE garbage can with the plastic bag liner inside that cell.

They expect us to believe that little cell had a garbage can the size of the ones we put by the curb?

This stuff is also shady.

I hope they don't get away with this.

[mythology]

9. It's possible to hang yourself with your feet on the ground

http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/Hanging.aspx

By itself her height isn't proof of anything.

[FSogol]

13. Sadly, some people "hang" themselves from the grab bars/hand rails in ada bathrooms.

They make suicide-proof hand rails that fit securely to the wall to prevent that (nothing can be looped around them). We had to spec those for a probation home we did a few years ago.

[brush]

19. You think that's likely?

And I don't if you saw the picture of the inside of that cell. It was posted on an earlier thread.

That big ass garbage can with the plastic bag liner stuck out as so out of place (and a humongous plastic bag liner in a jail cell — come on! We maybe stupid but not that stupid).

That little cell would only warrant a trash can the size of one you put in a bedroom, after all, how much trash is one prisoner generating?

And they want us to believe that a garbage can big enough for a whole house is in that little cell.

[jberryhill]

30. "after all, how much trash is one prisoner generating?"

How many drunks do they pick up on a weekend?

[Igel]

32. Likely?

In the sense that a lot of prison/jail hangings are done that way, perhaps more than half, sure. Them's the stats.

In the sense that this woman committed suicide that way? Harder call.

Do you believe the intake report, where she said she'd tried to commit suicide by taking pills? Or the report she filled out saying she wasn't thinking of suicide at the time?

Do you believe the coroner's report of the wrist cuts?

Do you believe the video with her self-diagnosis?

Or the family, who said that she'd never do anything like this. But also says she didn't have epilepsy.

Even if Sandra Bland, on video, said she did and her intake reports are ambiguous: one worker said she was taking Keppra, but the form she filled out and signed said she was taking no medications.

The stories aren't lining up. Now, some discrepancies are to be expected; if none, I'd say there's some creative fiction at work. But this many also tells me something's wrong. I just don't know where the slippage in stories is--among the police or between Sandra and her family.

[XemaSab]

49. My mom had a client successfully commit suicide with a pay phone cord.

n/t

[Rex]

7. Why was she in jail for three days for a minor traffic stop?

So many questions will be buried by that DA and the PD. I hope the FBI can get to the bottom of this and fast.

[mythology]

12. She was in jail for resisting arrest

Granted the cop is the instigator, but she wasn't arrested for a minor traffic violation. There's plenty wrong with how the cop acted while still being accurate about what happened.

[sharp_stick]

14. What I find interesting about that

the only charge against her was resisting arrest. If she was resisting arrest shouldn't she have been charged with a crime that she resisted arrest from?

[6chars]

37. that is a good point for our leadership to dig into

maybe some national level clarification on the issue would help (although more after after there is one more democratic appointee on the supreme court).

Relevant article here:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/07/23/sandra-bland-and-the-lawful-order-problem/

[Rex]

16. What was she resisting arrest about? How can that be the only charge against a person?

The article says she was in jail for a lane violation change, so according to the article she was in jail for 3 days for a minor traffic violation. Not what you said.

[Igel]

21. That's muddled.

She was pulled over and a warning was being issued. Things went badly.

By the end she got a ticket for failing to signal a turn (or lane change, depending who you talk to) and was in jail for assaulting a police officer.

[Rex]

24. So why do they keep changing the story from 'resisting arrest' to 'assaulting an officer'.

Their alibi is falling apart before our very own eyes. 'Things went badly'? Interesting way of putting it. How about the cop issued unlawful orders and then abused his authority without a second thought?

FIRST she was found hanging, THEN it was she killed herself with a trash bag.

[Igel]

20. Because she didn't make $5000 bail.

Which would have required $500. Bondsman, reports are, was contacted Friday evening (or late afternoon).

[Rex]

25. A 5000 dollar bail for a minor traffic violation?

The bullshit story just gets better and better...

[COLGATE4]

40. Not for a minor traffic violation - resisting arrest and assaulting an officer nt

[malaise]

8. More like death by lynching

Fugg 'em!

[luvspeas]

10. I heard her on the tape tell the cop she couldn't wait to sue his ass...

something to that effect. That's his motive right there.

[madville]

11. They didn't want another autopsy

They requested the family preserve the body in case they needed to run more toxicology tests after the first one came back with what they determined "a substantial amount of marijuana". Whatever that means or has anything to do with this I have no idea.

[spanone]

17. the family lawyer last night stated the state wanted another autopsy...live on lawrence o'donnell show

he may have misstated it, but that was exactly what he said.

[Igel]

23. And the Waller County folk deny that they requested it. n/t

[spanone]

27. there ya go!

[sharp_stick]

15. It's possible that she committed suicide

but she should never have been in that jail in the first place. Even if she did kill herself I still blame the Sheriffs office for her death.

[Capn Sunshine]

48. If she was suffering from depression...

It wouldn't take much abuse to put her over the edge. My theory is they mentally abused her, perhaps even raped her, let her know she was NEVER getting out, and let nature take its course.

[Positrons]

51. One would expect evidence of a sexual assault to remain...

... to be found by the new autopsy.

[udbcrzy2]

18. The civil attorney said that not the prosecutor

"We have not asked for nor do we intend to ask for a second autopsy," Warren Diepraam, First Assistant District Attorney, Waller County said. However, Diepraam said additional tests could be run.

http://abc7chicago.com/news/sandra-bland-jail-records-shed-new-light-on-mental-history/874337/

[Warren DeMontague]

22. well, that settles that.

[LittleBlue]

26. 30 cuts on her wrist?

Jesus.

Still it would be nice to have an independent autopsy

[hamsterjill]

39. This part is suspicious to me.

Where had Ms. Bland been in the days before she was arrested? If these cuts were "scabbed over", surely there is someone that saw her in the days before her arrest that might have noticed these? A friend? A coworker? Someone at church? A significant other? Someone who could corroborate this assertion by the police???

She didn't have on long sleeves in that video, so she wasn't trying to hide any cuts on her arms IMHO.

[jberryhill]

47. "so she wasn't trying to hide any cuts on her arms"

Hide them from whom? She was traveling alone.

[hamsterjill]

50. Respectfully, you've missed my meaning

My intent was to show that if Ms. Bland had "scabs" on self-inflicted wounds, that those wounds would have been there for a while. People's bodies heal at different speeds, but if the wounds were scabbed over, they would not have been fresh.

My point is that IF this were the case, someone close to Ms. Bland would have seen this. People who intentionally cut themselves (which is what the police are alluding to) sometimes try to hide the wounds by wearing long sleeves.

In the video when she is arrested, she looks to me to be wearing a sundress type of garment with her arms fully exposed. So she was obviously not trying to hide marks on her arms.

Does that make my post more clear?

[jberryhill]

53. It makes your post clear

...but it does not make your post any more sensible.

I don't think the police are "alluding" to anything, unless they wrote the autopsy report.

Yes, you are correct in that young women who cut themselves often wear long sleeves to conceal that from friends, family and coworkers.

Then you mention that, on this day, when she was traveling alone hundreds of miles away from any family, friends or coworkers, she was wearing short sleeves.

You conclude that her wearing short sleeves is inconsistent with cutting.

My question to you is why would she wear long sleeves to conceal cutting marks from people who are hundreds of miles away, and she is expecting to remain alone?

[PotatoChip]

29. This better not end the investigation.

Because even if the medical examiner is correct, I still don't buy the suicide thing.

If someone is going to commit suicide, why the hell would they do it in jail, when they are not looking at some long sentence? I can see perhaps someone who is facing many years in jail, or a life sentence. But Sandra shouldn't have been in there in the first place. And even the Texas authorities wouldn't legally be able to keep her there much longer, although I'm sure they wanted to.

She may have been suicided but I don't believe for a second that she did this to herself.

[jberryhill]

31. "It's just common sense"

Suicide is a leading cause of death. In what instances does a suicide follow "common sense"?

[PotatoChip]

34. Ok, that was placed awkwardly within the paragraph.

You are a smart person jberryhill. I'm sure you knew what I meant, and that summation you posted wasn't it.

But I'll edit the sentence out.

[jberryhill]

36. I'm not sure what you meant

Whether she committed suicide or not is entirely irrelevant to the fact that she shouldn't have been there in the first place.

But suicide is a leading cause of death. Because of social taboos around it, there is no family in the world that says, "Oh, yeah, no surprise that happened" when a family member commits suicide.

Other than terminal debilitating illness, in which case ending things before they are certain to get worse is more or less rational, there is no 'logic' or 'common sense' to suicide. People of all walks of life do it every day with zero warning whatsoever.

A common misconception is that someone gets really, really depressed and commits suicide. People who are deeply depressed are more often unmotivated to do much of anything. It's just when they start feeling and acting "better" that they commit suicide. Why? Because they aren't depressed anymore and can actually motivate themselves to do stuff - like committing suicide. (This, by the way, is the source of the accusations that anti-depressant medications make people commit suicide. They don't. But they do get depressed people up and around and doing stuff - like killing themselves.)

99% of what most people think about suicide is horseshit. And that, in itself, is why it remains a leading cause of death. We put a lot of effort into other "top ten" things like cancer and heart disease. You'd think "getting people not to kill themselves" is simpler than curing cancer but, year-in, year-out, suicide remains a leading killer. It's common. But, and yet again, because of the social nonsense about it, people don't even realize how common it is. It's 'impolite' to tell people that someone killed themselves.

Now, I have absolutely no idea how this woman died. A person under a lot of stress - and here was someone confined in a locked room over a traffic stop on her way to her new job, her new life - all of which got flushed down the toilet because she was going to stay there until someone came up with $5000 - might react in any of a number of ways. And nobody knows how they are going to react to something like that until it happens to them. Period.

[COLGATE4]

42. When I practiced in Michigan I heard from

some APA (Prosecutor) friends on the phenomenon of young people who were arrested for what most of us would consider minor, mundane infractions who then attempted suicide. Most jails make a point of asking the detainee at booking whether '(s)he wants to harm him/herself' and if any positive (or equivocal) answer is received, the prisoner is put on suicide watch. Suicide by inmates being held on relatively minor charges isn't as rare as some might think.

[Positrons]

52. Maybe she thought the arrest would cost her the new job...

[SummerSnow]

33. Here is my question..

If they knew she had attempted suicide in the past, why was a plastic garbage bag in her cell?

[ghostsinthemachine]

38. Trash bags? IN a jail Cell? BWAAAAAAH!

really, does anyone believe that? In jails everything is nailed down tight and a trash bag could be used as a weapon by suffocation. NO FUCKING WAY there is trash bag in the jail cell. NO FUCKING WAY.

Then they replaced the trash bag in the photo of her taken right after they found her (So they say)

then they say it was a black industrial size one, unlike the white one shown in the photo and no way could that hold a body.

The partition she was to have hanged herself from is SHORTER THAN SHE IS! (The partition is 4 feet tall and she is 5 feet tall)

NO bruising or marks consistent with hanging.

This was murder and everyone can see it.

[Rex]

43. Notice that is all being ignored by the cop apologists!

They are such EXPERTS...yet fail to say a single word about the trash bag inconsistency inside a jail cell. Or the FACT that they only changed their story, the moment the family wanted to do their own autopsy and the DA asked for the body back to do a second one!

Everyone can see this was murder, some just have an agenda to deny the truth at all costs.

[ghostsinthemachine]

45. Cops know this too.

You cannot tell me differently. A trash bag is weapon in a jail facility. Put it in your pocket and suffocate a cop and make an escape. Suffocate another inmate. Start a fire. NO WAY there was a trash bag in the jail cell, no way.

[stage left]

41. How come I'm not surprised?

[KitSileya]

44. If you imprison a diabetic, refuse him his medication, and only give him sugar to eat,

You can rule it a suicide when he eats the sugar, goes into diabetic coma, and dies. After all, he knew the sugar was bad for him. Likewise, Ms. Bland explicitly told them she had epilepsy - the two arresting officers acknowledge it on the video, but she was not given her necessary medication in jail. Abrupt cessation of said medicine may cause suicidal impulses. If indeed she did perform the physical actions of killing herself unaided, is it still suicide when their actions most likely directly caused her to do them?

[Horse with no Name]

46. They also said they found her suffocated....wonder what really happened? n/t

[Thinkingabout]

54. Suicide is smoething many do not understand, myself included. There are those who are able to work

Their way to seeing a different picture for their future and others who are completers. In the cases I was really close to had tried more than one time and one had tried many times. Sometimes the family sees a problem and tries to take action and other times push the signs in the background thinking it will go away. I dont know what happened in the jail cell and perhaps no one else does.

[sub.theory]

55. Still at Fault

She should have never been arrested to begin with. They may not have directly killed her, but they certainly set off the chain of events that did. Still at fault, imo.

[RandySF]

56. First they said hanged, then suffocated, now back to hanged.

I'm having trouble with this,