Sen. Allen (AZ) would make church mandatory. God help us.

[KamaAina]

http://www.azcentral.com/story/ejmontini/2015/03/26/sylvia-allen-arizona-legislature-mandatory-church/70482802/

Allen, as You know, is a Republican from Snowflake, a Tea Party favorite who wants to pretend Arizona is an independent country rather than a state, and who believes government should stay completely out of people lives -- unless she can use her position to help out a son-in-law who got into some hot water over behavior with some of the inmates he was guarding at a women's prison....

Anyway, Big Guy, they were debating a gun bill at a legislative committee meeting at the State Capitol this week so, naturally, Allen brought up religion....

This was one of those crazy bills in which lawmakers want people to be able to bring concealed weapons into public buildings. Allen got upset because a few people expressed common sense opposition to the idea. Lawmakers here cannot abide common sense.

Allen said, "Probably we should be debating a bill requiring every American to attend a church of their choice on Sunday to see if we can get back to having a moral rebirth," adding "that would never be allowed."

[uppityperson]

1. words fail me

[greatauntoftriplets]

2. ....

[no_hypocrisy]

3. So if this law were enacted, not only would I have to go to "church", but

I'd also be compelled to associate with people bringing concealed weapons into that church.

That's just whack.

[Sheepshank]

18. wasn't an abortion doctor killed in a church with a gun?

somehow this all sounds so surreal

[HassleCat]

4. Not for me

Our local chapter of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster meets on Thursday evenings, so we would be in violation.

[beam me up scottie]

5. Buckle up, folks.

Something lit a fire under the whackjobs' collective holier-than-thou ass and I think this is only going to get worse.

[tanyev]

6. She OK with the manpower and budget it would take to create an agency to track and enforce that?

Party of small government, my ass.

[stone space]

7. Would we be required to pack heat in church? (nt)

[hifiguy]

8. Words are what I do for a living.

I am completely gobsmacked.

[MADem]

9. A church of their choice, eh? I can see a lot of churches springing up in bars!

The entire concept is idiotic, but think about how people would get around such a law! The possibilities are endless!


http://www.refiningtruth.com/alcohol-grow-church-attendance/

http://time.com/3741677/church-naked-slumber-parties-panama-city-beach-tax-exempt/

[KamaAina]

10. Especially wine bars

[RKP5637]

52. Pray and Drink clubs! n/t

[tanyev]

11. I bet it wouldn't take long before churches had to apply to get on an approved list.

[1StrongBlackMan]

12. Yeah ... Maybe a "moral rebirth" ...

would have prevented her daughter's husband from raping (unlawful sexual contact) with the female prisoners under his "care", prompting her to use her legislative status to interfere in the subsequent investigation (to almost got her arrested).

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/arizona/politics/2015/03/19/relatives-job-woes-prompt-senators-bill/25005319/

[KansDem]

13. Works for me!

Probably we should be debating a bill requiring every American to attend a church of their choice on Sunday to see if we can get back to having a moral rebirth.

On Sundays I will have a moral rebirth by attending the The Church of Single Malt of Late-in-the-Day Scotch.

[leftofcool]

15. Preach it brother!

[One_Life_To_Give]

14. Well that was the Law here in the Bay State, once upon a time.

Yes we used to arrest people for not going to the Sunday Meeting House. By law we didn't have churches back then. Had a guy to rap you up side the head for napping too. And it wasn't any of this only couple hour affairs. We owned yer arse for the whole day.
Although going to Church did have one big benefit. If you were a male of age why you could vote. As that was part of the meeting as well, presumably while the wimin folk were cleaning up from lunch.





Includes a fair amount of
I am inclined to believe the First Amendment could have originally been called the Protection from the Church of New England Amendment.

[Lifelong Protester]

28. Didn't they also burn "witches"?

Or did a different group take credit for this?

[Retrograde]

43. That's a viscious slander!

The hanged the suspected witches: burning was so Old World.

They weren't too kind to Quakers, either.

[foo_bar]

48. well, mostly

Only one person died through Peine forte et dure in the history of America, in the person of Giles Corey. It happened at the time of the Salem witch trials. Corey was crushed because he refused to enter a plea, and so on September 19, 1692, stones were placed atop his body in attempt to force him to do so.

https://didoisux.wordpress.com/2013/02/01/death-by-crushing-peine-forte-et-dure/

[One_Life_To_Give]

57. Hung for disobeying clergy as well

Failure to "Honor thy Mother and Father" IIRC. Was interpreted to include Ministers and Church Officials. IIRC In one case a woman repeat offender was hung on Boston Common for this.

[betterdemsonly]

49. Last year I visited colonial Williamsburg in VA

Apparently before the revolution you could be thrown in the stocks and whipped for not attending the Anglican Church. This is why Jefferson authored the VA Statutes on Religious Freedom.

It reads



" An Act for establishing religious Freedom.

Whereas, Almighty God hath created the mind free;

That all attempts to influence it by temporal punishments or burthens, or by civil incapacitations tend only to beget habits of hypocrisy and meanness, and therefore are a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, who being Lord, both of body and mind yet chose not to propagate it by coercions on either, as was in his Almighty power to do,

That the impious presumption of legislators and rulers, civil as well as ecclesiastical, who, being themselves but fallible and uninspired men have assumed dominion over the faith of others, setting up their own opinions and modes of thinking as the only true and infallible, and as such endeavouring to impose them on others, hath established and maintained false religions over the greatest part of the world and through all time;

That to compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions, which he disbelieves is sinful and tyrannical;

That even the forcing him to support this or that teacher of his own religious persuasion is depriving him of the comfortable liberty of giving his contributions to the particular pastor, whose morals he would make his pattern, and whose powers he feels most persuasive to righteousness, and is withdrawing from the Ministry those temporary rewards, which, proceeding from an approbation of their personal conduct are an additional incitement to earnest and unremitting labours for the instruction of mankind;

That our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions any more than our opinions in physics or geometry,

That therefore the proscribing any citizen as unworthy the public confidence, by laying upon him an incapacity of being called to offices of trust and emolument, unless he profess or renounce this or that religious opinion, is depriving him injuriously of those privileges and advantages, to which, in common with his fellow citizens, he has a natural right,

That it tends only to corrupt the principles of that very Religion it is meant to encourage, by bribing with a monopoly of worldly honours and emoluments those who will externally profess and conform to it;

That though indeed, these are criminal who do not withstand such temptation, yet neither are those innocent who lay the bait in their way;

That to suffer the civil magistrate to intrude his powers into the field of opinion and to restrain the profession or propagation of principles on supposition of their ill tendency is a dangerous fallacy which at once destroys all religious liberty because he being of course judge of that tendency will make his opinions the rule of judgment and approve or condemn the sentiments of others only as they shall square with or differ from his own;

That it is time enough for the rightful purposes of civil government, for its officers to interfere when principles break out into overt acts against peace and good order;

And finally, that Truth is great, and will prevail if left to herself, that she is the proper and sufficient antagonist to error, and has nothing to fear from the conflict, unless by human interposition disarmed of her natural weapons free argument and debate, errors ceasing to be dangerous when it is permitted freely to contradict them:

Be it enacted by General Assembly that no man shall be compelled to frequent or support any religious worship, place, or ministry whatsoever, nor shall be enforced, restrained, molested, or burthened in his body or goods, nor shall otherwise suffer on account of his religious opinions or belief, but that all men shall be free to profess, and by argument to maintain, their opinions in matters of Religion, and that the same shall in no wise diminish, enlarge or affect their civil capacities. And though we well know that this Assembly elected by the people for the ordinary purposes of Legislation only, have no power to restrain the acts of succeeding Assemblies constituted with powers equal to our own, and that therefore to declare this act irrevocable would be of no effect in law; yet we are free to declare, and do declare that the rights hereby asserted, are of the natural rights of mankind, and that if any act shall be hereafter passed to repeal the present or to narrow its operation, such act will be an infringement of natural right. "




I wish this would be taught in history courses in the US but I think history has been polticized by fundy jackles just like Science.

[Zorra]

16. No surprise. She's a Mormon, and her district is heavily Mormon. nt

[Politicalboi]

17. A whole lotta crazy goin on in Az

So more church will help promote safe guns, got it.

[colsohlibgal]

19. Did People Like This Fall Out Of The Dark Ages?

I am agnostic but know Jesus, supernatural or not, would not take kindly to these vindictive bigoted crazies.

I wonder what almost any republican legislator from the 50s-70s would say about these loonies. Actually we have a clue, because Barry Goldwater was still around when the right started going off the rails, and he clearly said he had no use at all for them at all.

[betterdemsonly]

47. Many nuttier Arizona State Reps come from isolated mormon parts

Snowflake is about as isolated as they get. They are like Cliven Bundy.

[freshwest]

20. Great! Will all the workers be guaranteed a day off to go to church? BTW,

I think I can organize a ragtag army of the Meh Cat Brigade for a church. Over time, we will evolve. We may adopt the Ceiling Cat brand and use the Lolcat Bible as our Holy Writ.



Translation of the entire Bible are complete and can be read at:

http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Main_Page

At first, we can meet at each other's homes and elaborate on how we don't give a rat's ass about organized religion, but nonetheless will seek a tax exemption for OUR organized religion. We'll begin with mandatory recitation of the Ceiling Cat Prayer:

http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Ceiling_Cat_Prayer

Eventually, we will be won over by greed and authoritarianism, and anyone who deviates from our faith by failing to believe in the existence of Ceiling Cat will be tossed out:

http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Proof_of_Ceiling_Cat

When we've gathered up enough money we'll buy a mega mansion as our base of operations. With high walls to stop people from viewing our cult initiations, where there will be much caterwauling while the resident fat cats reproduce.

Through donations from the guileless public, we'll have kitty litter delivered several times a week along with lots of kibble for vegetarian kittehs and tuna and salmon for fundamentalists who insist on carnivorism. Serving pickled rat's asses will be part of our Sunday service.

Then we'll start killing each other, no doubt, as most religions do. I think Arizona might become a good base for our worldwide operations. They have no gun laws at all and have given the green light to force people who don't want traditional church. In time we will be one, but no matter.

[beam me up scottie]

23. I for one welcome our new kitteh overlords...

GREAT post!

[vankuria]

21. What about Jewish People?

May-be she would she round them up and put them into prison camps?

[KamaAina]

22. Arbeit macht frei

their new state motto.

[NaturalHigh]

24. "(R)equiring every American to attend a church of their choice on Sunday"?

Man, that's just out there.

I remember being forced to go to church as a kid and how resentful I was. It wasn't until I was older and made the choice to go that I appreciated the experience.

Then throw in the fact that doing such a thing is kind of (like blatantly) unconstitutional.

I can't think of a single person of faith whom I personally know that would ever endorse such an idea.

[panader0]

26. "probably we should be debating a bill..."

There is no such bill, thank goodness, and said politician is an idiot, but don't let that get in the way of the anti_Az outrage.

[NaturalHigh]

45. I know. My disdain is not directed toward Arizona...

which I think is a beautiful state, but at any politician who would even muse out loud about such a bill.

[atreides1]

54. I use to live in Arizona

And it's not a bad place...it's the idiots who vote for the brain dead that are the problem!

People voted this crazy loon and the others like her into office...and they keep doing it, why? It seems that the majority of voters are either as batshit crazy as Michelle Bachmann, or possess the brain activity of the Walking Dead...not sure which is worse!

Are the people of Arizona really so stupid that they can't see that what they're doing is going to hurt the weakest in the state...or do they actually enjoy watching people suffer?

Maybe that's what it is...voters like those in Arizona and other states are nothing more then a bunch of sick, sadistic, inhumane animals, who get an orgasmic charge from knowing that people they consider to be less then human will suffer and possibly even die?

[panader0]

55. All of those old farts who vote R are retirees from back east.

[hifiguy]

25. I would only go to the Pastafarian church

or St. Looney Up The Cream Bun and Jam

[SummerSnow]

27. And the lawmakers there will decide which church you will go to.

If you don't comply you will be detained.

[hifiguy]

34. The real world is starting to look far too much like

Terry Gilliam's masterpiece Brazil.

[SummerSnow]

35. Hmm, never heard of it. I'm going to look it up. Curl up with a good book time.

[hifiguy]

40. It's a movie.

Gilliam was the American in Monty Python and responsible for the weird animations. He turned into a damn fine director and it's a hell of a movie. But don't bother with anything but the full director's cut of 2 hours 20 minutes, which was shown all around the world. The edited version is a travesty. There's a Criterion Collection three-disk set with both versions and Gilliam's story of his battles with the US distributor over the film.

[Binkie The Clown]

29. 1963, Air Force boot camp at Lackland AFB church attendence WAS mandatory. n/t

I sat way in the back and read science fiction novels. One form of fantasy is as good as another, I guess.

[rurallib]

30. what day of the week would they arrest people?

Sunday? what if the church you don't go to meets on Saturday? If they don't get you on Saturday, are you ok for the week? What if next week you decide not to go to church on Friday?

What if the church you don't go to meets 2X per week? What about holy days? Could you be arrested on holy days and whatever other day you don't attend?

And what of the police that will be so busy that they will be unable to attend church?

[flobee1]

31. we can gather at his office

Every sunday and do this

Who's with me?

[KamaAina]

33. He is a she

but HELL YEAH!!

[Archae]

32. 5 years ago she said the Earth is 6,000 years old.

What a loon.

[LisaL]

36. I am an atheist.

Where would this genius send me?

[hifiguy]

42. She'll send the atheists like us to Joe Arpaio's boot camp

for some 'christianizing'. Thankfully I do not live in AZ, but have an atheist friend who does.

[Paulie]

50. Church of Pokemon!

We would use our tracts (cards) and battle different forces while pray to Arceus in loud voices to let us flip heads on that dice roll.

[muntrv]

37. Another idiot who has not read the 1st Amendment.

[KamaAina]

38. Probably can't count to 1

[valerief]

39. But she'd be the first to say that making voting mandatory is "threatening

mah freedumb and libertea!!!"

[LiberalElite]

41. Making church mandatory

is keeping government out of our lives? Do these people even listen to themselves?

[RKP5637]

53. Amazing, isn't it. All they speak of is more and more government intrusion with no government.

We have considerable mental illness in this country IMO, much of it centered on some abhorrent belief structures.

[Retrograde]

44. There are people who believe "Freedom of Religion"

means you can be any kind of Protestant. Hence, no allowance for Jews, Muslims, or anyone else who observes a different worship schedule.

Wait a minute - where does the leave Seventh Day Adventists? Their Sabbath is Saturday!

[Jamaal510]

46. Because, you know, "freedom" means being forced to

go somewhere that you may not believe in.

Just another way that the GOP has bastardized religion and freedom.

[RKP5637]

51. Words fail to describe the lunacy! n/t

[jmowreader]

56. Someone apparently hasn't read 1 Timothy 2