'It's sexist and it's ageist and it's bulls**t' - Madonna responds to critics who say she's too old

[boston bean]

The 56-year-old Queen of Pop has been condemned by several critics for working like she does, with some attempting to discredit her as someone too old to be a sexy star.

But Madonna is convinced people are fabulous in all epochs of their lives and she despises ageism.

"I feel like it's a form of discrimination that still has not been dealt with and it should be. I think it should be as verboten as making racist remarks or making homophobic remarks, judging somebody by their age," she told Access Hollywood. "It's sexist and it's ageist and it's bullsh*t."

Madonna is mother to four children - Lourdes, 18, Rocco, 14, David, eight, and Mercy, eight.

http://www.independent.ie/style/celebrity/celebrity-news/its-sexist-and-its-ageist-and-its-bullst-madonna-responds-to-critics-who-say-shes-too-old-to-be-sexy-31048692.html

[guillaumeb]

1. do the same critics also level the same charge against:

Sean Connery, Harrison Ford, and other older male movie stars?

[Oktober]

5. If Sean Connery came out in a thong and started gyrating his crotch at the camera....

I don't think it would be appreciated...

Granny needs to hang it up or find a new act...

[NaturalHigh]

8. LOL...

If Sean Connery came out in a thong and started gyrating, my wife would DVR it and watch every day. She would most certainly appreciate it.

[OriginalGeek]

34. My wife's eyes roll back in her head

whenever she just thinks of the time he came into her store at the airport and bought a newspaper from her.

I would also like to take this opportunity to offer Mr. Connery my personal thanks for pretty much doing half my job for life. I had to work much harder BC (Before Connery).

[guillaumeb]

9. gyrating like Jagger?

it is an act, but if she can carry it off more power to her. I do not listen to her but men do get a pass on this and the notion that females older than 25 cannot be sexy is ridiculous.

[Oktober]

64. I guess that's the point... She can't carry it off..

Her body and face are a wreck... Mostly due to surgery...

This isn't about all women or even older women. This is about her....

There are lots of beautiful and sexy older women but they probably aren't doing the exact same thing as when they were 25.

She only has one act it seems...

[bigwillq]

12. I hope to look as good at 56 as Madonna does

and I hope to be able to even WALK, never mind tour worldwide.

She looks fantastic, and she still puts on a decent show.

More power to her.

[SMC22307]

15. This is why people bust on Madonna.

She looks ridiculous, whether 20-something or 50-something. Of course, there are some out there who may find it sexy. But if she keeps up with the plastic surgery, she's going to end up looking like poor Pete Burns, who at one time, was smokin' hot.

?itok=o5JF_0my

There's something to be said about ageing gracefully. Or, as I approach Madonna's age, at least being subtle about the tweaks here and there.

[hifiguy]

20. Jebus, she's about ready for a feature on

Plastic Surgery Disasters.

[SMC22307]

26. Yep, she's not far off...

'cuz you know she'll keep on injecting and implanting and whatever else is out there!

[ND-Dem]

36. what did she do to her mouth? is that a grille? why?

btw, pete burns was never 'smoking hot'

[SMC22307]

45. I have absolutely no idea.

Why did she feel the need to flash her ass yet again, this time at the Grammys? Anything to stay in the spotlight, I suppose.

I'll have to disagree with ya re: Pete. Once-nice face, sex appeal, good moves... and he could really belt out a song. To each his or her own, eh?

[ND-Dem]

46. he sang well, but i never thought he was particularly attractive. yes, to each his own.

[Beaverhausen]

48. Aging gracefully? Way to prove her point.

Why should she "age gracefully?"

What does that even mean?

[SMC22307]

55. Not pumping your face full of fillers and implants?

Helen Mirren -- at 66 -- won best body (beating J-Lo) by some big LA gym. Helen Mirren, wrinkles and all. Perhaps it's not AGE; rather, it's that Madge has been over-exposed for decades and folks are over her schtick.

[awoke_in_2003]

28. I don't care for Madonna's music

but I think I will rec the OP in response to your ageist language.

[Oktober]

66. K...

It's only ageism if you are against all older women...

I'm not, I'm just pointing out that this specific woman is unattractive and untalented and isn't aging well in contrast to some others.

[ND-Dem]

52. how about mick jagger? that's still his schtick, and he's 71, a lot older than madonna.

[progressoid]

58. He was 44 when he did this...

Zardoz: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0070948/

[sabrina 1]

59. Lol, speak for yourself. And though I can't stand her, Madonna is right about this. How about Mick

Jagger eg? I haven't heard anyone say he is too old to be a rocker?

Paul Simon, still doing what he did decades ago.

Paul McCartney? Hasn't stopped doing what he always did.

She is doing what she always did also.

Don't like her, never did, but why should she stop doing what made her famous while her male counterparts are doing the same thing, may older than she is?

[mercuryblues]

7. Mick Jagger

Elton John
Paul McCartney
Ozzy

They are all considered quite able. Never once did I hear about McCartney's bicycle accident that getting injured at his age could lead bigger problems. After Madonna took her fall that is all the AM talk show could talk about. They tripped over themselves with saying like; At her age a fall like that could be serious. Paul is at least 15 years older than Madonna.

[PoliticAverse]

13. They certainly don't get the same roles they got when they were younger,

and do get criticized when they play roles critics think they are too old for.

[etherealtruth]

18. Seems to me Sean Connery played James Bond while in his 50's

Was't the character of James Bond supposed to be a sex symbol?

[DonCoquixote]

23. If Sean Connery was added to the BOND franchise

perhaps as a former James Bond that became an "M", the nets would squeal with glee

[etherealtruth]

24. :-)

[Dr. Strange]

30. I don't know about the critics, but...

http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/star-wars-teaser/2832821

[kwassa]

2. She is right.

[enough]

3. Right on. Reminds me of some of the stuff that got thrown at Cher. (nt)

[dsc]

4. she had twins at 48?

that is amazing in and of itself. Add in the fact she is still on point as a dancer and musician and she deserves kudos.

[bigwillq]

14. She adopted the two youngest (nt)

[NaturalHigh]

6. I've never been a Madonna fan...

but she's hardly too old to be a music star. Even though I never personally found her "sexy" I can't see that age has affected her at all.

If one likes her music, she's as great as ever. For those of us who don't necessarily care for it, I think we can still agree that she has always been an exceptionally talented artist and remains so.

[2naSalit]

42. I never saw her as

anything but raunchy and almost talented but that's my opinion. I have been and still am, at an age greater than the topic of this thread, a performing artist. Never saw what she does as talent.

[Drahthaardogs]

49. In her heyday she was brilliant.

She was a good Catholic school girl who knew just how much and how far she could push the envelope. I never saw her as raunchy, more edgy. I compare that to Miley Cyrus who just seems completely insane. There is no boundary she is trying to push, it is just shock-jock exhibitionism. I dunno. I am getting old, so that could be it too.

[PoliticAverse]

10. She's just realizing she's benefited from 'attractiveness-privilege' all these years? n/t

[SMC22307]

11. Madge, let me introduce you to Helen Mirren.

Julie Christie. Susan Sarandon. Angela Davis. Alfre Woodard. Raquel Welch. Sophia Loren.

A little Madonna goes a long way... she's overexposed, a parody. Same with Kim Kartrashian. And Chelsea Handler and her nipple campaign. Whomever Corporate America crowns "sexy."

Ageism *is* bullshit, but my gripes with Madonna were the same in the 1980s as they are now: Mediocre talent, but keen business acumen.

[Bluenorthwest]

16. I give you Tina Turner, 2009, born 1939. You do the math....

[DonCoquixote]

21. Tina turner has more talent at 20 percent

then most have at 100 percent, more than if they coudl achieve 200 percent!

[hifiguy]

27. Eeyup! nt

[valerief]

22. Wow!

[tabasco]

31. The Private Dancer album alone made her a legend

She is a bigger superstar in Europe.

[Drahthaardogs]

50. I love Cose Della vita with Eros Ramazzotti.

Fantastic!

[tabasco]

70. Thank you!

Just listened to it for the first time. Sweet music. Really got the Tina feel to it.

Cute video too:

[Drahthaardogs]

71. Italian Rock is great. Reminds me of top 40 in the late 80s.

If you have not listened to Zucchero, I suggest you give him a listen. He is an amazing artist who has recorded albums in italian, english, and spanish. Try Baila Moreno, which has lyrics in all three languages. Just a great song.

[2naSalit]

43. Tina Turner is highly talented

and does not suffer the "raunch is what sells" attitude. She has always been very talented and will be in perpetuity.

There's no comparison between her and madonna.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

56. As a lifelong musician and music fan, I agree.

Madonna is not that good a singer. I never liked her or her music. She kept changing her performing persona to keep her fans. Lady Gaga wears strange outfits too, but Lady Gaga has a lot more talent, if you listen to her sing and ignore the weird costumes. A lot of people did not realize she was so good until they saw her in a normal long dress at the Oscars singing a "Sound of Music" medley. They must have been distracted by her weird costumes.

Tina is still amazing. There are plenty of older women who are still attractive and doing well in the arts (like Annie Lennox, Helen Mirren, Judi Dench).

If you realize what attractiveness is about, it's not about the outside. It's about brains, personality, talent, wit and the lights being on in the brain. As I've gotten older, I've realized even moreso that point. Maturity is attractive when I myself am mature. As I get older, fewer people impress me. Men, in particular, since I am a straight female. Please see my avatar for a 67-year-old man who still impresses me with his brains and talent.

That said, Madonna's point about sexism and older women stands. She has had too much bad plastic surgery.

[2naSalit]

61. Agreed.

AI said somewhere upthread, I too am a musician and fan of music well written and well performed, madonna never impressed me in a positive way.

I do agree that ageism and sexism are stupid. Unfortunately for her, she's not doing it gracefully at all. And she set a really low bar for the women who cam after her who are actually talented but had to go the route of the scantily clad/nothing left to the imagination, cringe-worthy displays of pelvic over emphasis to be noticed. I don't care for the modern dance as presented in these music venues.

One I really don't like is that Minage woman... and that's all I'm going to say about that.

I'm not sure I can tell who that is in your avatar but I can tell it is someone who was popular when raunch wasn't part of the entertainment scene, mostly by the hairdo. (Who is that anyway?)

Kind of telling, I went to the big city, a hundred miles away, to go the nearest music store to buy a mandolin. It's not a fancy or expensive one - I'm a beginner. Never played an instrument other than my vocal chords before... been doing that for over half a century but I don't get complaints, just compliments and invitations on occasion. My remote location kind of makes it hard to go perform much. I got an instrument so I can accompany myself when I do want to do something with friends and when I do my "workout" at home. The moose and an occasional bear come into the yard sometimes to see what that sound is all about.

Yeah, aging gracefully in itself can take talent even for non-performing persons but if you go on stage, better have the talent to back it up. Someone I think has been doing that really well is Emmylou Harris among others. I think her voice is getting feeble though, wonder how long she can stay with it... I have always loved her.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

62. That is Brian Harold May, Ph.D.

Guitarist in Queen. All four of the guys in Queen wrote hits and all are recognized by the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame as songwriters.

Also earned a Ph.D. in astrophysics and built his own guitar, the Red Special.

Truly an excellent guitarist. Shreds but is tasteful with his distortion and effects and is always noodling within the chord he's on, or running scales as at the end of "Breakthru".

His hair is still curly but gray now and he now looks sort of like Isaac Newton. I saw him and Roger Taylor (drummer in Queen) last summer with Adam Lambert (a kid) singing and they still rock out amazingly well. They were billed as Queen + Adam Lambert.
He is my personal idol as a celebrity who is a decent person, modest, extremely thoughtful, still an excellent musician, and he also works for animal rights and against the badger culls in Britain.





This is the original image that some kind DU member made an avatar out of for me:



This is Petula Clark, pop star who had her first hit in 1964, "Downtown", who is now EIGHTY-TWO. She performed with Julie Andrews during World War II:



My background is classical lessons for many years on piano and violin and voice. Fell in love with the Beatles in '64 when I was a kid, kept up with rock' n' roll until about the late Eighties. My favorite rock bands are The Beatles, The Who, The Kinks, Queen and The Police.

I also listen to classical, opera, chamber music and jazz.

Good for you for getting a mandolin! It should be easy if you can think in fifths.

[2naSalit]

65. I really liked Queen!

And Petula Clark and all the others you just mentioned as well as others. I started singing as soon as soon as my voice was capable of phonating... about 3.5 years old. I sang along with everything I heard on the radio and TeeVee back then. I remember learning Patsy Cline songs, and Del Shannon and all those. When the Beatles showed up on Ed Sullivan Show, I was as smitten, at that age, as my older sister who was my "provider" for music my parents probably would have let me listen to otherwise. At nine I started studying classical voice, left it in my early teens - we moved and I didn't have anything but school choir and plays but that was okay, at least I could sing. I was always the soloist in every school play that I tried out for. And the same in college (in my thirties) when I returned to classical voice.

I have orthopedic strangeness in my hands, a rare deformity in my thumbs - both - called triple-jointed trigger thumbs - makes playing instruments a little awkward. But I am NOT deterred completely. I have a friend who wants to teach me to play bass so he can play guitar (he's really talented with most stringed instruments and accompanies me sometimes). I had to laugh when he suggested that and told him, "Ha, you might teach me to play but I don't know if I'd ever pass an audition!" With vocals, I've never not been selected for any vocal part I ever auditioned for.

As the choir director for the London Symphony Orchestra Choir once told me when I did a residency with him told me, "Never quit singing." Never quit singing.

I hope I can learn to play this little thing well enough to do it in public without embarrassing myself! The guys at the music store were really sweet. One, a guy who didn't work there and was joking with me when I was playing different mandolins trying to pick one. He came up and grasped banjo and looked at me and said, as though he didn't know anything, "I wonder what this is.." As was speculatively saying that, "...it looks like a five stringed banjo to me.." He started playing some really complex riffs. I made a face and called him a wise guy, then we laughed. Had a really nice conversation and he gave me some tips on playing and chords. It was a lot of fun. So I am having a little afterglow while cleaning up my little prize and tuning it with the new strings. I think I made a good selection.

I need to get some rest though, I have a lot of chores that didn't get done today added to those thta need to be done tomorrow. Log cabin life... it's not just a place to live, it's a lifestyle.

Have a good night... and thanks.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

68. Cool!

London Symphony Orchestra choir director....very cool!!

Speaking of British groups, I've seen the Tallis Scholars, the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra with Lawrence Foster conducting, and the Chieftains when they came through Houston. Oh, and Jacqueline du Pre, The Who, The Kinks, and The Police. I wish I could see Joe Jackson, as he is the pop music person who is classically trained that I can relate to the most as far as his piano playing is concerned. He does a version of the Pachelbel Canon called "My Hometown" that is cool. I can jam along to his CDs and really get into it, in other words.

I auditioned for the Houston Grand Opera Chorus about ten years ago. I thought I did a wonderful job. They had a rehearsal room that was probably as big as a football field and three stories high...I filled it up. I did Cherubino's fast number from The Marriage of Figaro, "Non so piu cosa son" which was my audition number. I was a mezzo with three octaves, once I got my voice trained, learned how to project from the gut and found my passagio. They didn't take me, but they do have a lot of people who work full time day jobs and do the singing at night. I don't have that much energy but I think I was good enough. I needed a job of some kind. And they have a union.

I have since lost all my head tone due to age. I used to be able to sing tenor, alto and soprano as needed. Choir directors loved me for this. Now I've gone down four notes and now could sing baritone, tenor and alto.

Speaking of playing bass, I have an electric Fender jazz bass tuned in fifths like a cello, CGDA. Being a fiddler I cannot learn guitar because I can't think in fourths. I can read bass clef because I'm a pianist so the jazz bass works. No frets either. As famous jazz bass player Jaco Pastorius said, "Frets are like speed bumps". He played with Pat Metheny who is my favorite jazz guitarist.

The former Universalist minister at the first UU church I went to, Rolf Gerhardt, is a mandolin maker. That was in San Antonio but he's moved to New England now and still making mandolins.

Thanks to you too!! Music is one of the subjects I'm "cracked" on....could talk about it all day.

[progressoid]

60. Tina for the win.

And she and Ervin finally got married.

[DonCoquixote]

17. my beef is not with her age

It is that her music is, was and very likley wil be crap. I felt that way when she was young, and saldy, with maybe "ray of light" she has proven it is possible to have a long career and still never be able to mature.

Try replacing Lady gaga's performace at the Grammy's with Madonna. For that matter, the harm Madonna did to music is that those who ACTUALLY HAVE GOOD VOICES, the Beyonces, The Mileys, The gaga's, The Mariah Careys, athe Katy Perries, the Adeles and the Lordes, all have to follow that same stupid template Madonna did for hit making.

[valerief]

25. I could even take the subpar voice if she exuded some likeability. She ain't got it. nt

[romanic]

41. As a fan of her music

I'd have to say she always had talent, but in the past few years that talent has stagnated to mediocrity. MDNA (her past album) imo was her worst to date because it came across like 'following trends" instead of being a trend setter like Madonna used to be. Of course we all hear music differently and have our opinion, but Madonna always delivered some great pop tracks ("Like A virgin", "Hung Up", "4 Minutes", "American Life" - yes even with her rapping about palates and soy lattes :lol: ) and deep whimsical songs ("Frozen", Nothing Fails", "Forbidden Love - the Confessions version) and on and on.

Yes I'm fanboying here I can't help it. lol

But I think Madonna needs to stop trying to compete with the younger pop stars and pull off a Ray of Light 2.0 or something, she's too good to follow others imo.

[DonCoquixote]

51. I like that we can agree to disagree

Though to be fair, what she needs to do is fire her producers, and give it to someone like a Rick Rubin or a Kanye West, someone that cvan actually polish stuff without pulverizing it.

[Warpy]

19. When she can no longer get out on stage and strut her stuff, she'll be too old.

I have a feeling she'll be out there at 70 like Tina Turner.

I didn't like much of her bubble gum stuff but she grew into a great talent. Most bubble gum performers peak by 20 and do a fast fade into booze and drugs. She didn't.

[ND-Dem]

38. Tina turner has been semi-retired since 2000, when she was 61.

2008 was the last time she toured, & she hasn't performed in public since to my knowledge.

The Twenty Four Seven Tour became her most successful concert tour to date.. Later, Guinness World Records announced that Turner had sold more concert tickets than any other solo concert performer in music history.

Afterwards Turner announced a semi-retirement...

In 2007, Turner gave her first live performance in seven years, headlining a benefit concert for the Cauldwell's Children Charity at London's Natural History Museum...

In October 2008, Turner embarked on her first tour in nearly ten years with the Tina!: 50th Anniversary Tour.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tina_Turner#Mainstream_success_2

[Triana]

29. It is true IMO that we have not fought against sexism and ageism to the same extent

that we have fought against racism and homophobia. At least in regards to sexism, we seem to be sliding backwards.

[tabasco]

32. She should have stopped singing bubblegum music about 30 years ago.

Shtick gets stale.

[2naSalit]

44. +1

[ND-Dem]

37. mick jagger = 71.

[Omaha Steve]

39. Cher's retirement tour lasted over 10 years

Cher: The Farewell Tour (2003) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0381083/

Cher, on yet another farewell tour, revives hits and shows she’s ready to move on http://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/music/cher-on-farewell-farewell-tour-revives-hits-and-shows-shes-ready-to-move-on/2014/04/06/9bbf2a34-bda8-11e3-9ee7-02c1e10a03f0_story.html (April 6, 2014)

[silverweb]

40. Good for her!

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]She's doing what she loves, she's in fantastic shape and quite capable, and she still has a huge fan base.

Those who don't like her are welcome to ignore her. Their poisoned-pen ridicule and hatred just make them look petty, jealous, and stupid. F**k 'em.

I've never been a fan, but the older Madonna gets the more I like her attitude - and even some of her music.

[whatchamacallit]

47. She has a right to do her thing, people have a right to reject it

If Madonna was a great artist/composer/musician... I imagine her "contribution" would face less agism. The stuff she does - sexy dance pop - has always been dominated by the young. Sorry, it's biology. That said, good on her for doing what she loves to do.

[Rex]

53. It is all those things, she is 100% correct.

It made me ill watching people GLOAT over her falling off stage in the UK! It reminds me of the Britney zombies that couldn't wait for her to have her first nervous breakdown!

"Spears should be having her first emotional breakdown any moment...stay tuned to CNN news!"

[Beausoir]

54. Simply put...she is a vulgarian.

She has always been an affected creature with no talent who constantly races to the bottom in order to engorged her wallet.

Quite silly.

[SMC22307]

57. That's Kim Kardashian to a T.

I'll at least give Madonna some credit -- she works hard and has a keen business sense -- but I do think she's a mediocre talent at best.

[PoliticAverse]

67. At least she's not a 'short-fingered vulgarian'... n/t

[AndreaCG]

63. I wonder if she'd say the same about fat people

She really seemed to hate us in her Sex book. As for her, I think she peaked with "Borderline".

[steve2470]

69. yep Madonna nailed it nt