Why isn't state revealing identities, locations of people monitored for Ebola in Pa?

[uppityperson]

Because they are monitoring them and none are contagious. Science! It is good for you and me.

http://lancasteronline.com/news/local/why-isn-t-state-revealing-identities-locations-of-people-monitored/article_eb341fec-5f9d-11e4-bc4c-0017a43b2370.html

Pennsylvania health officials are not revealing the identities or the locations of 105 people the state is monitoring for the Ebola virus. So we don't know if any are in Lancaster County or not. But that's for our own good, according to the state health department.

"We want the public to feel comfortable going about their daily lives," said Aimee Tysarczyk, a spokesperson at the state health department, in an emailed response.

The state is not releasing the names of the individuals or the counties in which they reside because there is no public health threat at this time, Tysarczyk said. The individuals have no signs or symptoms of Ebola. Monitoring them is just another precautionary measure, she said in her response.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. Because if all the frightened pants-wetters knew

who and where they were, they'd be rioting outside their homes with torches and pitchforks, dressed in hazmat gear, demanding that the not-sick people be locked up in a tent with no running water. So the pants-wetters wouldn't be scared.

[uppityperson]

2. Yup. eom

[arcane1]

3. Exactly. That's how the home of the brave rolls these days.

And considering the continent where Ebola is coming from, quarantine would be the least thing the mob would demand.

[WinkyDink]

4. do you think they should even be monitored?

[seabeyond]

7. sounds like the deal. sounds like what works. seems to be 100% effective. nt

[uppityperson]

15. Not knowing who they are or why they are being monitored, it makes it difficult to have an informed

opinion.

[seabeyond]

6. for real, get this. some poster said it was good that nurse locked up. protected her from rioters.

now. think, just one second. cause i did not even finish teling my son this one before he said... oh ya. the blood and shit from tearing her apart, cause they are fearful of ebola.

brilliant.

[freshwest]

27. There it is. You win the thread!

And prevent people such as:

Todd Kincannon, South Carolina’s biggest Republican troll, wants to execute anyone who has Ebola:

From doing so. Just think, they vote...

[etherealtruth]

5. According to the state of Michigan ...

... there are ten people here that have recently returned from fighting the Ebola epidemic in western Africa .... according to the State of Michigan it is not our (the public's) damned business who these people are. As a resident I agree!

Funny how we haven't had an Ebola epidemic here!

On edit:

The 10 people are required to check in with their local health departments twice a day and report symptoms such as fever or vomiting.

And, Smith says, while the threat from Ebola in Michigan is slight, there are other infectious diseases that kill people in Michigan, such as the flu.
http://michiganradio.org/post/hospitals-prep-possibility-ebola-state-monitors-10-who-ve-traveled-west-africa

[seabeyond]

8. but, there are some to demand locking up the doctor. i wonder if they will insist every person

coming into the country from hot spots be held 21 days, at state expense and financially compensated for the loss of 21 days pay.

or, if it is just medical people that are the ones that are aware of the disease, what it can do and have devoted their life to stopping it.

ya. that makes sense.

[etherealtruth]

10. This is craziness ... clearly they have ....

... no understanding that people have been returning from these areas of epidemic for months and months now. Odd how we haven't had an epidemic ... or even a case.

"We" only recently decided it was A-OK to treat these people like criminals

[jen63]

12. The cognitive dissonance

is really disheartening.

[etherealtruth]

14. Disheartening to say the least! n/t

[jen63]

18. I'm trying to keep my

emotions in check!

[Ms. Toad]

16. Not "a" case, but two.

Duncan and Spencer.

[etherealtruth]

20. What?

Are you insinuating either of these two contracted the disease here?

Actually two nurses did contract it here .... however, they were put into a position by their hospital where BASIC infection control practices were not in place for at least two days.

[Ms. Toad]

22. Not insinuating, flat out stating it. You said we had not even had "a" case.

When we have had two, contracted in the US. Kind of my point. We need to stop acting as if we are invincible with respect to Ebola. We were so sure we were better than those African locations - Ebola could not happen here. And our first Ebola patient infected two others - pretty much the exact same transmission rate they have in Africa.

[etherealtruth]

23. Let me clarify ... we have not had a case of community aquired Ebola

again, neither Duncan, nor Spencer acquired their disease here. sadly, the two cases were (Pham and Vinson) were hospital acquired due to improper infection control practices at the hospital. There is a significant difference.

[uppityperson]

26. There is a huge difference between catching ebola in the community and by taking care of ebola pt in

a hospital.

Unless of course you are caring for someone with ebola at home, a risky thing to be sure. But barring that? Huge difference.

[uppityperson]

21. There has been ebola, but no cases passed on from any returning HCW. It is true that one traveler

infected 2 nurses caring for him. But as far as the general public, no one has caught it from someone in the USA.

[Ms. Toad]

24. Except, except, except...

We blew the first Ebola case - resulting in exactly the same infection rate we see in African countries.

Two of the 3 self-monitoring health care workers blew it, by failing to self-quarantine at the first signs of infection, resulting in costly monitoring of between 160 and 200 people for 21 days.

Far simpler, more effective, and cheaper to impose is supervised self-monitoring for anyone known to be exposed (not just temperature checks, but also reporting of other early warning symptoms, and spot checks to verify compliance), self-quarantine at the first sign of symptoms until they are proven not to be Ebola. Failure to cooperate, vanishing, etc. is treated the same way they did in Nigeria - you lose the right to monitor yourself.

[uppityperson]

25. What you say as "far simpler..." is what they are doing.

Last edited Wed Oct 29, 2014, 10:57 PM - Edit history (1)

"supervised self-monitoring for anyone known to be exposed (not just temperature checks, but also reporting of other early warning symptoms, and spot checks to verify compliance), self-quarantine at the first sign of symptoms until they are proven not to be Ebola."

They are supervising themselves, self monitoring for temps and other symptoms, and self quarantining when symptoms appear. None failed to cooperate, none vanished though if that were to happen, I could see supervised monitoring. For health care workers that is. General public, I would prefer to be monitored by a health care worker.

What "Two of the 3 self-monitoring health care workers blew it"? 1 nurse called CDC for advice, 1 doctor self isolated and called for help before his temp got to reportable level.

There was no need to monitor people on the plane she flew on, or to clean the bowling alley and whatever the restaurant was the dr went to except to try and calm public panic out of an "abundance of caution" which I think more education about it would've been better.

No one has gotten ebola in the USA except for those 2 nurses. None of the HCW returning or travelers coming into the country over the last 5 months have resulted in ANY infections in the community.

[Ms. Toad]

28. Two of the health care workers failed to do it properly.

Both of them experienced fatigue for 3 days prior to running a fever. Both should have self-quarantined at that point - as being diagnosed with Ebola 3 days later confirms. Neither did. Nurse Vinson's errors were even more severe - she boarded a plane with a fever. 13% of people with Ebola do not run a fever, so the magic cut-off point of 100.4 is not a good predictor of when someone is contagious.

Although peer reviewed studies are clear that patients are contagious when they have fevers, diarrhea, and are vomiting. They are far less absolute about the risks of transmission in the early stages of Ebola or transmission via contact with items touched by people with Ebola than people on DU or popular media. They speak in terms of low risk, not zero risk. Ebola has been found on surfaces which are not visibly contaminated with fluids - and the study confirming that suggested that in places other than isolation wards (where the research was conducted) it was likely that more virus would be found. Not much research has been done yet, but there are also a few more than a dozen people who have contracted Ebola without any identifiable contacts with someone with Ebola - suggesting that at least in a small number of cases someone like Vinson or Spencer, without obvious signs of Ebola, passed it on to them.

When my brother was little, he repeatedly stuck a rock in his ear for the fun of it. It always came out, so he kept doing it. Until one time it didn't. The fact that no one has gotten Ebola in the US until now, or that none of the health care workers or returning travelers resulted in ANY infections is not convincing, especially since we now have 4 cases. One from a traveler to this country, one from a returning health care worker, and two infections passed on from the traveler to this country (your assertions to the contrary notwithstanding). As the number of people with Ebola in Africa continues to increase, the odds that we will see more and more cases like the 4 in the last month - up from zero prior to that. Unless we get better at implementing the precautions necessary, we will see an increasing number of except, except, except cases - until people wake up and realize that we are not invincible.

Demanding that anyone with known contact with an Ebola patient treat even vague symptoms as if it was Ebola is the surest way to continue to beat the odds, and 2 of the 3 health care workers failed to do so. That needs to change.

[uppityperson]

29. I read a report earlier, am too tired to go look it up right now, saying they were not sure if what

is in sweat is actually the virus or dead cells.

Fatigue is common, is a sign of flying across the ocean, of working too long, of not getting enough rest, of a lot of things. The Fatigue associated with ebola is commonly knock you down unable to stand type and as far as I can tell, neither of them had that.

Anyone who says "no risk" is foolish, of course "negligilbe or minimal risk" is appropriate. There is minimal risk of a meteroite striking me on the head tonight, but not enough risk for me to be wearing a helmet.

Yes, there will be more ebola in the USA, of that I am very sure.

"The fact that no one has gotten Ebola in the US until now, or that none of the health care workers or returning travelers resulted in ANY infections is not convincing, especially since we now have 4 cases." 2 came to the USA exposed and infected (Duncan and Spencer). 2 were exposed and infected cleaning up Ducan's vomit, diarrhea, highly contagious dead body without adequate protective gear.

We have had ZERO cases of anyone in the USA getting ebola from ANY of the returning health care workers or travelers. ZERO. None. Zilch. 0.

We have NO cases of anyone in the community in the USA getting ebola from any returning health care workers or travelers. Not 4 cases. None.

All 3 health care workers adequately monitored themselves and no one has gotten sick from them. The ONLY people in the USA who have gotten ebola here are 2 nurses working in highly contagious situation. NO ONE in the community. None.

[Ms. Toad]

35. You disagree with the CDC, then.

They consider fatigue to be a symptom requiring hospital isolation unless you fall in a zero risk category.

Recommended actions for symptomatic people with fever or other Ebola symptoms*

High, some, and low risk categories

These people MUST have a medical examination to make sure they don’t have Ebola. They will remain isolated in a hospital until doctors and public health officials are certain that Ebola is not a concern.

*Symptoms of Ebola: Fever, severe headache, fatigue, muscle pain, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, unexplained bruising or bleeding.

http://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2014/fs1027-monitoring-symptoms-controlling-movement.html

Amazing how many people are accusing me of fear mongering, when what I am saying is exactly what the CDC has adopted. If you have any risk for Ebola at all, and you are experiencing fatigue (or any of the other symptoms) it is to be treated as Ebola until proven otherwise.

When I pointed out the deficiencies in the CDC's protective gear protocol shortly after it was linked to on DU following Duncan's death - people ranted that I was being unscientific, and of course the CDC knew better than I did...Then the CDC adopted a policy that fixed each of the deficiencies I had pointed out, exactly as I suggested they should be fixed.

After nurse Vinson flew twice after experiencing fatigue, followed by a low grade fever - and again with Dr. Spencer - I repeatedly said that both of them should have self-quarantined based on exposure + the symptom of fatigue. (Both of them experienced fatigue significant enough that knew when it started and ultimately reported it as a symptom. The fact that it may get worse, does not make it not a symptom in the early stages.) As of Monday, the CDC has adopted that policy.

I'm really getting tired of being told I'm unreasonable, the experts know better, I'm fear mongering, etc - when I have a near perfect track record of predicting the policies that are later implemented to correct prior deficient policies.

[uppityperson]

36. Bears have fur, but not all animals with fur are bears.

Fatigue is a symptom of ebola, but having fatigue does not mean you have ebola. Fatigue is a symptom of flying across the ocean, but does not mean you flew across the ocean. Fatigue is a symptom of many things.

I do not see on that CD. page where theyrequire hospital isolation for having fatigue. Please copy/paste it as I don't see the word anywhere else except for in the list of enola symptoms. And I don't see mandTory hospital isolation anywhere for fatigue. I see "medical examination" but not as you say mandatory hospital isolation.

[Ms. Toad]

37. Reread my post - everything you are asking for is in the excerpt,

already copied directly from the CDC website.

The top line: "Recommended actions for symptomatic people with fever or other Ebola symptoms* " The asterisk means go find the asterisk to see how they define symptoms. Look down four lines below you find that the asterisk gives a list of Ebola symptoms, one of which is fatigue. The use of the word "or" means any one of the list qualifies.

Just below the "Recommended actions" is a description of which categories of people the recommended action applies to - all of the risk categories except "no risk."

Just below that is the line you see the recommended actions for "These people {who have Ebola symptoms}" which include: "medical examination" followed by, "They will remain isolated in a hospital until doctors and public health officials are certain that Ebola is not a concern."

(The action for "These people {who have Ebola symptoms}" in the "no risk" category is that a medical examination might be needed for other diseases.)

Just for completeness, so you don't have to go back to the other post or click a link: http://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2014/fs1027-monitoring-symptoms-controlling-movement.html:

Recommended actions for symptomatic people with fever or other Ebola symptoms*

High, some, and low risk categories

These people MUST have a medical examination to make sure they don’t have Ebola. They will remain isolated in a hospital until doctors and public health officials are certain that Ebola is not a concern.

*Symptoms of Ebola: Fever, severe headache, fatigue, muscle pain, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, unexplained bruising or bleeding.

No risk category

These people might need to have a medical examination for other diseases (not Ebola).

You are correct - fatigue can mean many things. The CDC agrees to you, as long as you haven't been around people or places where Ebola is known to be present.

What I have been saying, and the CDC is saying as of Monday, is that if you have been around people or places where Ebola is known to be present, fatigue (or any of the other Ebola symptoms) should be treated as Ebola until it is proven to be something else. Fatigue doesn't necessarily mean it IS Ebola, but when you combine exposure + fatigue (or anything else on the symptom list), the risk that it is Ebola rises to a high enough level that you need to stop mingling with other people, and potentially exposing them. Like I have been saying all along with respect to Vinson and Spencer - fatigue + exposure should have been a get yourself to quarantine message.

[uppityperson]

30. Excuse me, I missed the last 2 words my previous post, have edited them in

In the community.

[seabeyond]

33. blew it... i tell you, all the way to virus free and contained. fuckin blew it. nt

[Ms. Toad]

34. Glad you can predict the future, since 21 days have not yet passed.

Aside from which, the financial cost of monitoring the 160-200 people who are currently being monitored because one of them did not self-quarantine is significant. Had they self-quarantined, the county I live in would not have had to absorb a significant portion of that cost.

And finally, just because disaster does not result from every (or even most) mistake does not change the fact that it is a mistake, or mean that we will be safe if we continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

9. As has been noted elsewhere:

Ebola has killed fewer Americans than O.J. Simpson.

[Brigid]

11. HIPAA?

Now there is a good reason.

[etherealtruth]

13. That has been my thought ...

... How could Christie divulge anything about this nurse (much less mis-information)?

[Fred Sanders]

17. A wonderful thread, it confirms the science, it has silenced the folks that have rejected science

in favor of hysteria and joining the herd.

The wonderful thing about science is it does not care for your beliefs, the facts never change.

[bmac19gg]

19. even if they were....

....peoples's personal information shouldn't be broadcasted to the public. The only way I should know if you're ill, or gay, or have a gun, or vote whatever, or worship whatever, or hate broccoli, is if you tell me. The only caveat I can think of to that is if you pose an actual danger to society as in the case of sexual predators.

[msanthrope]

31. Because Corbett doesn't have a stake in the sales of duct tape and plastic sheeting?

Seriously..there's no accounting for this outbreak of logic.

[uppityperson]

32. Sorry. I'll try harder next time