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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe little girl whose birth brought "anger, disappointment and fear"
That's when Cramblett learned from a sperm bank employee that she had been inseminated with sperm from the wrong donor, according to a lawsuit filed Monday against Midwest Sperm Bank in Cook County, Illinois.
Cramblett said they had chosen sperm from a man known as No. 380, a white donor. The sperm used for insemination came from No. 330, a black donor, she said.
"How could they make a mistake that was so personal?" Cramblett said during a telephone interview on Wednesday.
According to the lawsuit, her excitement about the pending birth was replaced with "anger, disappointment and fear."
"They took a personal choice, a personal decision and took it on themselves to make that choice for us out of pure negligence," Cramblett said.
http://www.sfgate.com/news/us/article/White-Ohio-woman-sues-over-sperm-from-black-donor-5796296.php#photo-6943129
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gopiscrap
(23,769 posts)I am sure some one would love to love her!!!
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)Read this article.
The lawsuit said they had moved from Akron to Uniontown for better schools and to be closer to Cramblett's family. She said that as a lesbian she has felt the sting of prejudice but doesn't know what it's like to be mistreated because of skin color.
JI7
(89,295 posts)i can understand maybe getting some money from the clinic for messing up but complaining about bigots and how unfair it is as a reason to not want a child of color ?
should people of color never have kids because there are racists ?
TeeYiYi
(8,028 posts)...if you special ordered a BMW from Germany and they sent you a Mercedes.
They're both really nice cars, but, it's not really the car you ordered...is it?
TYY
JI7
(89,295 posts)in many different ways.
...but I believe in holding corporations accountable.
There's no question in anyone's mind that that little girl is the cutest child ever. And, I'll guarantee that both mothers love that child implicitly and wouldn't dream of ever letting her go.
This isn't about the little girl. It's about the incompetence of the corporation that they contracted with.
TYY
JI7
(89,295 posts)they are using the racism of others instead of calling it out itself.
yes, the clinic should be responsible for making a mistake and id on't even care if they are forced to close.
but to go on about oh, because of racism and shit and only look to the clinic but not blame the racists .........
TeeYiYi
(8,028 posts)...or is it the lawyers and the media injecting racism into a touchy landmark case?
I think that the sperm bank should be held accountable, but I'd bet my life that if the mothers were forced to choose between the child and the lawsuit, they wouldn't hesitate to choose their daughter; their beautiful child. It's not even a question.
Don't forget that one of the mothers carried that child to term in a very loving relationship, where the child was extremely wanted. She is still wanted and implicitly loved. Half of that little girl's DNA came from her biological mother.
This is a legal case that has been turned into a media circus. I feel sorry for all involved. All, that is, but the sperm bank. They need to be held accountable.
TYY
Trajan
(19,089 posts)There is something quite unsavory about the messages they are sending ... notwithstanding your steadfast apologia ...
Hmmmm ...
...what do you think it is, Trajan? What do you suppose my nefarious intent is? Now you've got me hooked... 
TYY
840high
(17,196 posts)
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)about their sperm donors. Most of them agonize about this, almost as much as they would if they were picking out a spouse.
They don't say, "hey, agency, I don't care -- you pick for me!"
They realized during the pregnancy that the wrong donor had been used, and then had to make the hard choice of whether to go through the pregnancy or not. They should never have been put in that position.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)and when their children in families where at least one parent looks like them come home with yet the latest racial injury, they come home to someone who has already been through the experience, and who "get it" without the child having give racism 101 explanations or to convince the parent that whatever happened really was about race.
It isn't about complaining about bigots or not having children of color because bigots exist - it is about the very real racial isolation their child will feel because she lives in a home and a family that doesn't look like her, and hasn't had the experience of looking like her, in a world where skin color matters.
I have 3 Native American siblings. Although I was not aware of it while we were growing up, as adults they have shared with siblings and our parents some of racial isolation - and race baiting - they experienced growing up. And that was in a home where our parents were attuned to racial differences and spent a lot of effort on trying to celebrate their communities of origin.
As a lesbian couple who decided to have a child, my spouse and I knew that any child we raised would experience discrimination because of who her parents are. In choosing donor insemination rather than adoption of a non-white infant, the experiences of my siblings played a large role - piling familial racial isolation on top of having two moms, in a community which is at least of average imperfection in the realm of race would not have been in the best interest of the child. If we lived (or wanted to live) in a diverse urban community, being intentional about surrounding ourselves with a community who looked like - and could support - a non-white child in ways we could not, our choice might have been different. But I would not have brought a non-white child into our white family unless I was willing to make that commitment. Whether you agree with our priorities or not, living in a community near our (sometimes unintentionally racially insensitive) family, and having a piece of property large enough for our child to run, play, and climb trees, etc. were higher priorities for us - so we chose donor insemination (with a white donor) over adoption (where the child would almost certainly have been non-white.
For us, it had nothing to do with not wanting a child of color for any other reason than we were not willing to make the kind of changes we felt would be necessary in our lives to fully support a child who does not look like us, who will be discriminated against in ways we would not necessarily even be capable of recognizing as discrimination.
Had our donor turned out to be non-white - our emotional reaction would have been very similar to this couple. We would have made the necessary changes to care for the child who was on the way, but the changes were ones we had already considered and rejected when we chose to use donor insemination rather than adoption to create our family, and even as committed to doing the right thing as we would have been, I know from the experience of my siblings, that the impact of racial isolation even among the most well intentioned family is real and harmful.
JI7
(89,295 posts)maybe instead of outrage over the clinic due to mistake resulting in dealing with racism.
the outrage should be towards the racism itself.
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)That is what they are struggling with - not that they think having a child of color is objectively bad, but with concerns about how having two white parents in a world that is racist will impact that child.
While it is crucial, all the outrage at racism - and work toward ending it - won't work in time to give this little girl parents who understand and instantly recognize the racism directed at her, or eliminate the sense of racial isolation she is likely to experience where she needs most to feel completely at home - within her own family.
It is a bit ironic that after significant focus on keeping First Nation children in First Nation families, and long term struggles to place African American children first with African American families, that when a white couple acknowledges - for the very same reasons - that they expect to struggle with providing the right community and family for their black (as she will be viewed) child - there are accusations of racism against them.
JI7
(89,295 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)Their family - on the other hand - is a concern for them. But still not from the perspective of losing them, but because of the impact their family's unintentional racial insensitivity may have on their daughter.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)And that argument is just as ridiculous. This is THEIR daughter. They should love her no matter what. Quit acting like this daughter will suffer because she has dark skin. She will only suffer if her parents make a big deal about it. Kids get picked on for any number of reasons--being fat, being poor, being nerdy, you name it--if they are so concerned that they're living in klan country they should just move!
Neoma
(10,039 posts)
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)talking with non-white children raised in white homes, or perhaps read this book, so you understand the concern from the child's point of view - as her parents are obviously trying to do.
From the book summary:
. . .
The overriding message of In Their Own Voices is that transracial adoption can work, with one important caveat: Adoptive parents must recognize the importance of their child’s racial history and culture and make that history and culture part of their family life. Adoptee Donna White takes this a step further, saying that white families who live in isolated communities should not be allowed to adopt black children.
“If a black child is placed with a white family, the family needs to go through more than the typical steps in the adoption process,” said Francis, a woman who is interviewed in the book. Her parents worked hard to expose her to her ethnic heritage. “White parents need to understand that they cannot treat a black child like a white child.”
While all 24 adoptees believe their parents tried their best, some said their life might have been easier had their parents learned more about black history, mixed with black families, lived in diverse neighborhoods, and joined black churches.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I always think it's funny when someone who obviously knows nothing starts to lecture me about my life.
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)A friend of mine refused to wear a seat belt because his dad was once hit by a train, wasn't wearing his seatbelt and walked away. I think you can see the idiocy in that. Now, look at how you are applying the same logic.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)This poster is condescending to everyone about how she read some books on the subject. Or how she spoke to some people in her family and now she is a fucking expert, enough to lecture everyone on this thread, including me.
I have lived what this story is about. And like everything, it's as big a deal as you make of it. President Obama had a similar situation in that he was raised in a mostly white family and then sought out his identity as an African American more and more as he grew up. Everyone comes to their identity a different way, they decide where they belong in the world, no matter what your race or upbringing, mixed blood or not. Her parents could be helping her with that instead of arguing that she's damaged goods.
Being black in America is not a disease. Being black is not a mistake. Being black is nothing this little girl or her mothers should be ashamed of. And anyone sitting here arguing that raising a biracial daughter is the worst and hardest thing in the world has some problems with race themselves.
joeglow3
(6,228 posts)Fact is we DO live in a world where a biracial daughter can be a difficult situation in many parts of the country. They may have figured they would face enough challenges being a homosexual couple raising a daughter and they did not want to further complicate things.
NOWHERE did anyone say the challenges they would face are fair. NO ONE said we, as a society, should ignore these. What I did say is it is fucking arrogant of you to demand they personally fight all these battles at once.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I'm not demanding anything. I am telling ignorant people who are making a big deal about her black blood to STFU. This isn't Alabama in the 50s but from listening to everyone here you would think it was. It's a big deal because this woman is making it a big deal.
There are racist, bigoted, hateful people everywhere. There are people who will pick on any weakness and take advantage of it. There are bullies who will tell kids they are fat, stupid, poor, nerdy, etc. No child is immune. So you teach them to love themselves. You teach them you love them no matter what.
Being black is not an affliction. Being black is not a disease. Being black is not something to be afraid of. But from this crazy thread, you would think she was born with two heads.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)and responded to my post, without disclosing anything that might be relevant. I don't go research the background of people who insert themselves into a conversation I'm having with someone else. If you have something relevant to the conversation you're jumping into, take some responsibility for sharing it, rather than expecting me to read the rest of the thread before responding.
FWIW - you were remarkably silent on your father's presence in your life. Assuming he was present in your life, you are not living the life this little girl will lead, because you had a father who lived in skin similar to yours, and who can provide the perspective these women cannot because even the most racially sensitive white person doesn't know what it feels like to live in non-white skin.
This is not, "ooohhh, icky, biracial child." This is, "as a biracial child, our beloved child will have needs we cannot meet directly - at all - and others we cannot meet without major changes in how and where we live. Changes we cannot make without financial assistance from the company that screwed up" That is what the financial request is for - money to be able to move somewhere so that their child will have regular contact with others who share the experiences she will have because of her obvious ethnic background, so she does not feel so isolated.
But - you're so intent on painting these women as evil racists, you're not even listening to what they, or anyone else, is saying.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)But because this thread was so full of ignorance, I did. What you are forgetting is that these people went public with the fact that there was a "mistake". The fact that this mother was "angry, disappointed and fearful" about having a biracial child completely refutes your argument. What I am trying to say is that a child needs love, food, shelter, guidance and support. Those are the true necessities. She needs to know that she is loved absolutely and completely for everything she is. If she is lucky enough to have those things--which many, many children do not have--then she will grow up to be a well-adjusted person. If her moms wanted to help her with her African American identity, all the better, but no doubt she will also seek it out later in life if she so chooses. Just doing the best they can and loving her, I'm sure their daughter will love them for it. If they wanted to give their daughter a more diverse experience, they could have done it without the press conferences, without the interviews broadcasting to the world that their daughter was not what they paid for.
Here is just a sample, always with caveats, but the message is there:
They didn't choose the donor based on intelligence or medical history, they chose him based on the color of his eyes and skin.
'Payton has hair typical of an African American girl. To get a decent cut, Jennifer must travel to a black neighborhood, far from where she lives, where she is obviously different in appearance, and not overtly welcome,' according to the lawsuit.
Ms Cramblett says she grew up in Scio, Ohio - population 762 - and didn't meet a black person until she attended college. She currently lives in Uniontown, population 2,802, and fears Payton will be the only non-white child in class when the time comes for her to attend school.
Ms Cramblett says her family has difficulty accepting the fact that she is gay and encourage her to hide her sexual orientation when she is around them.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2778009/I-t-let-family-White-lesbian-mother-inseminated-black-man-s-semen-sperm-bank-mixup-says-wanted-blonde-hair-blue-eyed-baby.html#ixzz3F7vgcryU
It looks like there are plenty of problems within the family, racism and homophobia being big ones. So obviously, these moms think that having a biracial child is a much bigger problem than it is. Because their daughter "can't hide her race" at the family gatherings of bigots. This is the real issue. I support them suing the clinic for malpractice, but I do not support them making their daughter--and she will--feel unwanted or unloved because she is half black.
karynnj
(59,514 posts)I don't think they are racists. They quite likely knew that there are always risks of a child being physically or mentally challenged which all parents face when they have a baby naturally. Obviously, having the child from donated sperm would still have that risk.
The problem here is that the company did make an error that has a real consequence that these women have articulated. Note they have more than accepted the child, they love her.
I suspect that they faced a dilemma here. There is ample reason to call out the company for its bad practices that could affect others. (In fact, a heterosexual couple in the same situation would have been faced with making public what they obviously would have planned to keep private.) However, the problem is what is happening right here. I hope the little girl never reads the words her mom said. I know the moms can easily handle that by just saying they did love her from the moment she was born.
While I understand her gripe, the direction she's coming from in her argument is pretty fucking ugly...
I don't know if that's on the advice of her attorney or whatever, but she isn't winning people to her side...
And may the gods help that daughter once she's old enough to figure out mommy's angry comments in every national newspaper...
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)disappointed that the girl wasn't blonde with blue eyes so it would like the mother. I find that beyond troubling. There is no guarantee that a child traditionally conceived will look like one parent. It is narcissistic to expect a child will look like you then disapointed that it doesn't.
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)describe how isolated they often feel because they look so different from everyone else in their family, and because their parents don't understand what it feels like to live in their skin? Is that narcissistic, too? It is a human characteristic to look for familiarity in the faces of our children/parents.
Aside from which, matching your partner is SOP in donor insemination - for the very reason that the mom recited. Having been through it, the normal process is to first try to match physical characteristics with the non-biological parent (usually the father), and if they cannot find a donor that matches the non-biological parent, they they match the biological one (height, hair color, hair texture, eye color, talents & interests, religion, etc.)
snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)most of the posters are twisting it from their concern that where they are (and with the family they have) they cannot meet their child's emotional needs to have adults around who look like her, and who have experienced how this world all too often treats people who look like her, and their desire to be able to move to a more culturally diverse area to make sure their daughter's emotional needs are met.
That child centered view (concern for what she will experience - and how best to counter it) has repeatedly been twisted and portrayed as them being racist toward their daughter. Your twisting of the parent's statement about why they chose a blond haired blue eyed donor into disappointment that she was not a blond haired blue eyed daughter is a mild version of what has been going on throughout the threads discussing this.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)They discuss the great inconvenience this child brings into their lives. Inconvenience of her race. There is really no great mysteries involved in learning how to love and take care of a biracial child.
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)It is that they recognize no matter how much they lover her and how well they are taking care of her, she needs a community of people who look like her - who understand what it is like to be non-white in this country. Her parents will never be able to really know that - and that resource does not exist in the community in which they planned to raise their daughter.
This is not about parents who perceive being biracial as bad. It is about white parents who have done enough exploration to recognize the truth of what non-whites have been telling us since at least 70s - that white parents raising non-white children need to be very intentional about becoming an integral part of a community which reflects their child's ethnic heritage or we will do more harm than good.
Frankly, you ought to be cheering the fact that they recognize that their daughter needs more than they can provide her with where they currently live, and are trying to figure out how to meet her needs (beyond those they will be able to meet of loving her and caring for her). Meeting those additional needs involves the expense of relocating - not a trivial thing, particularly since it may also require finding new jobs in a new location, in still challenging economic times. That is part of what the lawsuit is about - the costs they will incur in order to meet their daughter's needs for community are not ones they would have incurred, but for the clinic's screw-up. When you sue for malpractice, or anything else, you ask for the costs which you incurred (or will incur) as a consequence of the screw-up.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)thats all I have to say about this.
The fact they went public with this and subjected their child to this is grotesque. There is no other word for it. However unwanted she is, is forever burned into the public record.
I really don't think it is as impossible as you do to raise a biracial child in this environment, but you live there and probably know better. The issues they complained about are mostly trivial and easily overcome.
I'm glad they are moving to a more suitable environment. The public spectacle they made out of is shameful, in my humble opinion.
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)and as proactive as they were about affirming and supporting my siblings' ethnic heritage, it wasn't enough.
I'll agree that it is white people problems, in sense that white people created and continue to perpetuate a world in which the color of one's skin plays such a large role in how one is treated.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)The US is vastly more diverse in the past 30 years. Things change.
Xipe Totec
(43,895 posts)
Brickbat
(19,339 posts)for. No one doubts that the couple loves the child. But for the purposes of a lawsuit -- which I believe they should prevail in -- I think it's fair to include normal feelings that they had.
ETA: If I had signed up for a medical procedure and the results came back much differently than I expected, you can bet your ass I would feel anger, disappointment and fear.
Kalidurga
(14,177 posts)not test tube children and their dad is Hispanic. But, it hit me one day while I was in Michigan, holy crap I am surrounded by racists. So, I ended up moving to the Twin Cities and there haven't been too many incidents.
There is a real difference between knowing it is out there - and living it. And I can't ever live what a child who is visibly non-white lives. In your family, your children have their father. In this family, this little girl has no one who has experienced what she will experience.
JI7
(89,295 posts)are they doomed for life for not having a parent who is also gay ?
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)but many LGBT kids do feel a similar isolation because of being different from their family of origin, and not having parents who get it when we are discriminated against because they have never experienced it.
It is one of the reasons many older LGBT individuals develop parent-like relationships with younger LGBT individuals - one of the many flavors of our families of choice. This one provides a parent who intuitively knows what our "children" have experienced when their own parents - however well intentioned - simply can't. We have three children who call us moms, in addition to the daughter we raised from birth. Two of the other three had very supportive parents, but they adopted us at times when they needed parental figures who had had similar life experiences. (The third isn't analogous to this discussion, since those parents didn't even make an effort.)
MADem
(135,425 posts)It's not a comfortable feeling to look around and realize that you stick out like a sore thumb--or like "the nail that sticks up" (which the Japanese say should "get hammered down"
.
There are more and more swirly families out there these days, and that's a good thing. Those of us who live in neighborhoods where there's all sorts of people in all colors and ethnicities are often brought up short when we find ourselves in enclaves that are monolithic in their racial make up. For example, if you go to Northern Maine, it's very white up there, save the native peoples -- who live on a reservation. The people are nice enough, sure--but it's noticeable. There are communities in the American southwest that are almost exclusively Hispanic, with a Mexican cultural tradition. Look at Ferguson, MO--that town has been in the news because of an imbalance of power that resulted in a teenager getting shot in the street. Two thirds black, but the minority whites are holding all the power--and they aren't being very nice to people of color, either.
You can't blame parents from worrying that there are bad actors out there, who might not view their swirly kid with the same joy and love and pride that the parents have. That protective instinct kicks in, as it should.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)is very disturbing and makes me quite angry. The apologia on this thread is condescending and sickening.
I am biracial. My mother was a blonde white woman. Many people made assumptions about our relationship. Did it scar me for life? HELL NO. You know what? Having one loving parent, and thank your lucky stars two, means you are far luckier than many, many children. Being biracial or even an adopted child of white parents might be difficult, but there are far worse difficulties such as poverty, alcohol and drug addiction, and abuse. If these women actually love their daughter, they should STFU and raise her as loving parents. If they want to sue the facility, fine. But all this going on that their daughter, who is gorgeous, is somehow crippled for life because she is part black is nothing more than racism. RACISM on the part of these women who think that having dark skin is some kind of affliction. They have made their daughter nationally famous for being a mistake, for being "not what they paid for." It's white yuppie entitlement and it is as low as it goes.
Number23
(24,544 posts)JI7
(89,295 posts)yes , this pretty much says what this is all about.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)smirkymonkey
(63,221 posts)Couldn't have said it better! 
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)I would like to think that if this happened to me, I would count my blessings. And especially not go public with it.
Wait until the child is old enough to google and finds out her existence is a laboratory mistake.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)It would be one thing for them to sue for the mixup, it is an entirely different thing for them to be going on and on about how her life will be so hard because she is biracial and how everyone around her will be racists as a cover for their own racism. Sure, they had some dream of what their lives as parents would be like. A lot of parents have unrealistic dreams because they are sold this disneyfied version of parenthood with blissful pictures trying to sell you something. And obviously because she chose insemination over adoption in the first place, she wanted a copy of herself<--the key to this story.
But that did not happen, because that rarely happens. In this case, the daughter is biracial, but she could have been born with special needs, she could have had below average intelligence, hell I've even seen parents who ignore their children because they don't like the same things like shopping or sports. What about parents who are upset that their child is gay? These women are embarrassed to bring her to family gatherings. She's not the blue-eyed baby of their dreams and so now they are splashing her all over the news complaining about it, trying to project that it's other people who are the problem.
This girl is alive; this little girl is their daughter. If they can't find it in their hearts to love her because she is part black, then perhaps she might fare better with another family. They obviously care nothing for her feelings as this story is everywhere and will follow her for the rest of her life. They didn't love her enough to think of that before they held press conferences and media interviews. They, like the posters above, have been so sheltered that they are acting like she's half alien. And it is disgusting.
Number23
(24,544 posts)You could not have posted a more real, more honest post.
As you said, this child could have been born with any number of ailments. She wasn't. Most people would consider that fact alone a reason to be thankful.
If they had said, "the clinic gave us the wrong sperm and we're suing" most people would have been okay with that. But it's the "well, everyone in our town is so racist and doing her hair is so hard and even though she's been in our life for two years we are now suing the clinic because this shit is just now REALLY starting to get real" that is making me shake my head and my heart break for this little girl.
And she is so precious.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)She's 100% perfect. She's healthy with a big smile on her face. When they're complaining about her hair, they're also complaining about having to drive to a black neighborhood, wink wink. Learn to cut your daughter's hair if it's so difficult!
They could have kept the whole thing private. They could have sued and moved on and the girl would never have known. Now it's impossible that she won't find out.
But let's be honest here, the real complaint is that the daughter makes people think that mom got knocked up by a black guy and we can't have that! The true irony is that these gay parents are using the very same argument that rwnjs use against gay parents: that people from a different background cannot raise a child as well. I would shout just as loudly if anybody said these moms didn't have a right to raise their daughter!!
Number23
(24,544 posts)I had the same reaction while reading this. That their complaints are the mirror image of what many anti-gay marriage/adoption/breathing proponents say. That "won't somebody PLEASE think of the children??!" and how horrible people can be to the children of gay parents and how cruel it is to the children to subject them to this.
Fighting people's God given right to love who they want to love and live how they want to live instead of the true villains -- hatred, ignorance and intolerance.
Gormy Cuss
(30,884 posts)
JustAnotherGen
(32,091 posts)I was having a hard time putting it into words.
I keep thinking some folks have watched a few too many "tragic Mulato" movies.
In terms of opportunities, financial standing, and love - I hit the lottery in life based upon who my parents were.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)+1000
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I have never participated in a thread so much before. I guess I was waiting for others to speak up and take over. It's been illuminating to say the least.
glowing
(12,233 posts)from a catalogue of males and their character traits, "work", grades, schools, medical history, perhaps "matching" as many characteristics they could find to a "husband" if a couple was having male sterility issues. This company offers a service. These women went into the agency, looked through a catalogue of all of these choices, and chose a certain match that they felt would best fit into their family and the area in which they moved to. Having children and living close to family whom you can trust to help take care of their grandchildren is an important factor for many couples deciding to have children. AND it was only when they called the agency later to reserve sperm for the other wife, so that their children would share the same father biologically, they discovered the agency made a mistake. It is only right for that agency to be sued for their errror. AND it wouldn't matter if the alt sperm donor was another white male, that is NOT what the women chose and paid the service for. They should sue no matter what and be compensated for the errror.
Now, as to the topic of the racial aspect of the situation that they find themselves thrust into; that's a conversation that has broad reaching implications. These women are living in a region of the country that is monolithic in regards to race. Part of that decision to move to this area was due to having familial help in being there for this couple as they raise any child; like most couples decide on. On top of the regular parenting aspects of raising a child in today's America and financial stresses, etc, this couple is a lesbian couple. They are already have certain segments of this country who are still extremely discriminatory toward LGBT persons in general. There are still states that refuse marriage equality, or they don't have anti-discrimantory laws in place to protect against discrimination in regards to work, renting, and being able to see one another in the hospital if one is ill because they aren't considered "family". Now, these two white women living in a white area are raising a bi-racial daughter, whom they say they love (and she looks well taken care of and who couldn't love that precious little one and she is 1/2 biologically one of the mother's daughter), saying, as part of the law suit and lawyer speak as to bring this case to light and award beyond re-couping the initial payment for the sperm donation fees, that their family has been harmed due to this companies neglect because they are having to make special additional arrangements to take proper care of this child. AND I'm sorry, but moving to a diverse community away from perhaps free grandma babysitting, is something they really should do. As well as, be able to provide people in their daughter's life that look like her and whom she can relate to and for the Mom's to ask basic questions about things like doing their daughter's hair.
I think everyone would love to live in an equal society where discrimintions didn't exist and acceptence and love were enough. But y'all have read enough nasty comments from the white- right about black people or hispanic people or LGBT or Muslims; they are nasty and disgusting and these are the people that these women are already having to face due to whom they love as a partner in their lives; now, they've got to raise a bi-racial child along with the roadblocks and nastiness the child would have already had to face just due to having 2 Mom's. If anything, I would hope that this family does choose to create a sister or brother from the same donor so that their daughter would have someone in the family that has the same "father" and who looks like her. That would be something these women should think about doing if they decide to have more children, but after this lawsuit, having that happen isn't very likely.
Also, I don't think $50,000.00 is asking that much for help with costs of any therapy and/ or moves they make into a more diverse community.. Moving costs alone from selling and uprooting one home to move to another region, new jobs, and a new home doesn't see like they are being outrageous in their suit.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I have a problem with the fact that they think the worst part of the situation is that the donor was black. There are quite a few objections that could be made to having the wrong donor, including medical history, but instead, their complaint is that their daughter is biracial.
They could have quietly sued for malpractice. They could have been good parents and put the interests of their daughter first and not said anything, because $50k is not a lot of money for the circus they have created. Instead, they chose to have press conferences and media interviews about how having a half black daughter has totally upended their lives and what a hardship it is. They are being entirely selfish, whining about their own mistreatment and at the same time branding their daughter a half-breed mistake. That label will follow that little girl wherever she goes. They say they are afraid of what the white people in their (chosen) all-white community will say. Well, when that little girl grows up to read that when her mother found out she was black her reaction was "anger, disappointment and fear," that will be infinitely worse than what ten million strangers could have said.
Here are a couple of possible scenarios:
1) Mother finds out donor is black, decides she will love her child no matter what, goes on to build happy family.
2) Mother finds out donor is black, cries about it in private or to her partner, but once her daughter is born, tells her every day how much she loves her no matter what because she is special and unique.
3) Mother finds out donor is black, decides to tell the world how "angry, disappointed and fearful" she is because ZOMG blaaaaaaaaaaaaaack! Then she totally overreacts and insists that all of her neighbors are incorrigible racists so she must move and her whole life is ruined.
Which one do you think is the right course of action?
glowing
(12,233 posts)child... (and for all intesive purposes, this country will see her as black or of color). It is a unique challenge for white people to undertake, especially if they have never been all that exposed to divirsity... Which sounds like this may be the case. I'm sure there were people within her own family telling her to get rid of the baby... White people can be down right fowl, especially in their "own" communities... So, there probably were those emotions all the way around when she found out. I certainly would have some negative thoughts and emotions about the issue... On the other hand, I live in a city and its extremely diverse, and I'm the type who is just as likely to be with a black man as a purple man for all that it really matters. If I was in this situation, I would sue, but I would also be in a much better place to raise a mixed child.. Shoot, my area has a lot of beautiful mixing already and its absolutely wonderful, and I know I would be perfectly fine in raising the child because I am surrounded with the right environment to make it as normalized as the situation could be. But not everyone is me, and I have empathy for their situation.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)Once you commit to having a child, you are her parent, whether she be special needs or different or biracial or whatever. For better or for worse. You are the main source of love and care for all of their childhood. I know parents who have had to quit their jobs and go nearly bankrupt to take care of their children. People have to move because of bullies or other circumstances. People make sacrifices for their children because that is what you sign up for. I can't imagine how awful this little girl will feel when she grows up.
In my post #136 in this thread, I linked to an article that shows there IS a lot more going on. The mother grew up in a town that was all white and didn't meet a black person until she was in college; now she has to travel to a black neighborhood to get her daughter's hair cut and that is one of the big hardships (because she can't learn how to cut her daughter's own hair?). She and her partner specifically chose a donor that had blond hair and blue eyes so the child could pass as their own, now she can't because "she can't hide her race." And her family encourages her to hide the fact that she is gay, so I'm sure they have made similar comments about her daughter.
I get it. It's not a walk in the park and not what they signed up for with the clinic. But they are definitely not putting their daughter and her feelings first. That is what I object to. They are acting like love and care isn't enough, as if being even half black means you are a different species or something. They brought all of this down upon themselves when they stood in front of a camera and spoke into a microphone about how a black child has crushed their dreams. If this was something where the court filings were leaked, that would be a somewhat different story. And if the only thing that came out of her mouth was "we are suing for malpractice but my daughter is perfect in every way" I would not be commenting at all.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Two alternatives, adoption or IVF.
and now she has done everything possible to let the world know she is a married gay woman living in a small community in rural America that is probably getting major press for the first time in it's existence.
and now Uniontown is getting known for racial intolerance, though it might only be the projection of this woman.
and I have to commend you for all your commentary in this thread. I agree with you 100%.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)and we found out they weren't the biggest racists on earth? But from the articles, it seems like her family is the problem.
My mother took us to visit an old friend of hers who said something about our dark skin. I remember she stood up and said in a dignified way something to the effect of "We've been friends a long time, but you are not allowed to say anything negative about my children" and walked out. You know what, I thought that woman was an old witch, but what really stands out for me from that incident is that my mother stood up for us. No ifs ands or buts. That's what it takes. It didn't happen often and she usually just said some zinger when someone said something stupid like if we were adopted. I'm sure my mom wishes many things, especially that I wasn't such a difficult teenager, but I'm almost 100% sure she never wishes we were a different color, and for that I will always be thankful. I never really thought about it until this subject came up.
Thank you for your words. I don't normally write this much and certainly not something so personal. I'm sure I'll regret it, but I was actually just surprised that people who call themselves "democrats" were so ignorant. I don't know, today I see mixes of mixes of mixes and the children are all beautiful, unbelievably so. Maybe the next few generations will not have the same prejudice, at least I hope.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)I am white, my wife is African-American, and our adopted daughter is also African-American. She happens to look enough like us that most people never guess about the adoption, but we don't necessarily try to hide it, either.
When just my daughter, who is seven, and I walk into a new social situation, I introduce myself, and then say "and this is my daughter M------" just to head off stupid comments in advance. Just a little strategy. We also live in a area where multi-racial families are fairly common, of all types.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)So helping them out up front just makes things run smoothly. Perhaps part of this story is that at least one of the mothers has reported that she grew up in an all white community and didn't interact with people of different races much. Perhaps that's also true of some of the posters here. There are pockets in rural communities that I'm sure have problems much more than cities where you can't get away from diversity. But I do think that if the parents were willing, just introducing themselves to their daughter's teachers and the parents of their friends would have saved a lot of trouble. She looks like she will charm the socks off of whomever she meets and anyone else is a racist old coot.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)This isn't rocket science. I agree, many more are more open-minded than you would ever think.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)I've been all over the country, living on both coasts. I bet they will find more acceptance if they make it clear that their daughter is exactly perfect just the way she is.
Best wishes for you and your family!
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Tanuki
(14,932 posts)4) Moms realize how perfect the little girl is and ASK FOR THE SAME donor for their next pregnancy! 
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)That was the plan, to have both of their children with the same donor. Then she would have someone who "looks like her" and they can laugh at all the dumb people who don't think their hair isn't beautiful or their skin isn't the right shade (and usually pay a lot of money to have their hair curled, their lips plumped, and fake tans). Just loving on your kids helps protect against whatever some idiot says. It doesn't make the world perfect, but it sure helps your kids to feel strong and cherished.
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)Number23
(24,544 posts)her photo all over the damned Internet.
But they "love" this child and wouldn't change anything about her?
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)These women are lesbians, they have no doubt encountered bigotry at some point in their lives. Does that mean every person they meet will accept their relationship or their child? No. That means you cut those people out of your life and show your daughter she is loved no matter what. But this doesn't seem to be the case. I am quite sure that if she was not the biological child of one woman, they would have returned her to the agency. They're acting like raising a child with more melanin is some kind of hardship. Would they be saying this if their child had special needs? Those parents are goddamned heroes, giving everything to their kids, not some entitled, spoiled brats. Would they have complained if the child's eyes were blue but they always wanted green? These women are plastering their beautiful daughter all over the internet and television, arguing that she is a screw up. I'm sure she's going to be happy to read all about it when she grows up.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)~shaking my head~
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)I also love the "we're not racists but everyone around us is" aspect to it.
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)They learned about the mistake when the woman was 5 months pregnant, and called to reserve more sperm from the same donor for a future pregnancy. That's when they found out she had been given the wrong sperm -- not from the donor they chose.
So then they had four months of going through a pregnancy fathered by a donor who was not the man they had asked for. I don't blame them for being upset. They were expecting a certain person to be the father, not for the paternity to be some random mistake.
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)But the kid is not a mistake. They chose some "random" guy to be the father. They just got a different random guy.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)They chose a donor from within a particular range of options. Not random.
The clinic saw fit to impregnate the woman with a donor from outside that range of options.
Any attempt to characterize this as an "oh well, it's the luck of the draw" is an insult to both women and to the child.
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)You make the best decision possible (sometimes fueled by outside agents) and deal with the consequences.
They chose a random donor from a "range". The got a random donor from outside that range. Either way it's random.
If they don't want or can't love that kid they should give her up for adoption. But accusing everyone else around them of being racists when they are the actual racists is ironic.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)And your final paragraph indicates that you're not really familiar with the story.
Done here.
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)a very specific person. They didn't opt for the luck of the draw any more than most people do when they choose a spouse.
They love their child and that's not the issue. The issue is the contract and the negligence of the agency in following through.
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)about his background, education, and interests.
Using the wrong sperm was a absolutely a mistake.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)pnwmom
(109,029 posts)to abort a healthy pregnancy at that stage.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)And 5 months is barely more than half way anyway- its only "late term" becuase rethugs say it is. 
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)At five months you can feel the fetus inside you. I've never known any woman who would have thought an abortion at 5 months would be a trivial thing.
And these women were two months into the easiest, most joyous part of many pregnancies. They were past the point of worrying about a first trimester miscarriage, and not at the point yet where the pregnancy itself can feel burdensome. They were so joyous and hopeful that they decided to reserve more of their intended donor's sperm for a subsequent pregnancy, so their child could have a biological sibling. A donor they had carefully selected based on his background, education, and interests -- almost as if they were selecting a spouse.
And then they got the rug pulled out from under them, learning that a man they knew nothing about and hadn't selected had mistakenly been used in the insemination. Of course they were upset.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)I know if it were me I would feel like I had been raped by that company.
pnwmom
(109,029 posts)What that woman experienced, emotionally, was akin to a rape. She was impregnated against her will by a stranger's semen.
But not even all rape victims decide to have an abortion, especially so late in a pregnancy.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)Her body her choice. I may have made a different choice, but im not her and she isnt me!!!!
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)abortion just like they assume (mistakenly) that all evil anti-life liberals would!
ncjustice80
(948 posts)Why so defensive Kestrel? I refuse to treat abortion like its a big deal- otherwise you fall into the rethugs trap. Its just a medical procedure.
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)"just a medical procedure".
It is the taking of life, and none of us take that lightly. We DO however, think the woman gets the final call. We're not into forced pregnancy.
Obvious troll is obvious.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)Until it comes out of the mother, it is *not* a life, it is a fetus. An organ that is part of the womans body, to keep or abort, HER BODY, HER CHOICE, 100%. Anything else is anti choice light at best.
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)Is there notification required? And is he on the hook for child support?
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)I'm sure sperm donors sign papers to that effect.
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)Some of then might be putting it on ice for later personal use.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)by someone who intended it for that use. Sperm banks don't sell self-stored sperm that is stored for future use by that person.
They simply don't. Any sperm that is for sale came from someone who signed papers allowing them to sell it and waiving other rights and responsibilities connected with that sale.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)IIRC in some places if the woman can id the donor she can sue for child support.
Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)If it is a private arrangement, in some states you are right.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)Something unexpected is always happening, and rational people shrug and write it off as part of the uncertainty. Were I the woman who bore this delightful child, I'd have shrugged my shoulders and said, "What the heck?" I'm not her, though, but if they love this child, they probably should let this pass and go on with their lives.
That said, it's very dangerous to let a 2-year-old sit on a narrow low wall over what looks like a 2-story drop. 2-year-olds make a career out of falling backwards when they stand up. That's my concern with this picture.
Rex
(65,616 posts)But it is there. Had to look at the picture, because your initial worry was the same response I had. Even with a glass partition, I would be wary about letting her sit there, because that is a two story drop.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)You're right. That certainly changes my thinking about that situation.
Thanks for pointing it out.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I hope the mother does not hold some kind of grudge against her child. The child is 100% adorable.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)I just want to give her a big hug and to try to make her giggle.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Of all the issues that this child is going to face in life, falling through safety glass during a photo op must be pretty far down the list.
JustAnotherGen
(32,091 posts) Rex
(65,616 posts)People hung up on skin color, make me sick. Fear? Fear of what exactly?
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)they anticipated, due to an error on the part of the place that sold them the sperm. I've looked at some websites from those places, and they're like a catalog, with photos and resumes of the donors. Shopping for the male part of the equation has always seemed like an odd thing to do, somehow, but I guess everyone does that when choosing a mate, too.
Still, their reaction is troublesome, I think, and may well reflect something rather ugly. I'm sorry for the kid.
Warpy
(111,501 posts)I'd be terrified for my biracial child, too.
Look how all the haters have come out from under their rocks because we have a biracial president. Look at how the hate has been legitimized by the Republican Party.
It's a pretty scary proposition.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I hope nothing but the best for the family. That kid is so cute. Your right, she will have her skin color held over her head in that community and that should be a crime. Nobody asks to be born. Maybe they will have to move, but the child deserves a normal life. All children do.
It looks so bad in some states, that just 'driving while black' can lead to a fatal encounter with law enforcement. It's 2014 yet we still live with Jim Crow.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)We have a biracial man who has risen to the pinnacle of what is possible in the world by becoming President of the United States. That's a pretty fine example. Will people say stupid, racist shit? Sure. But I'm sure that this darling girl will suffer far more for her gender than for her race (just ask Shirley Sherrod). You can just see the life, the spark in her. But the most important thing by far is that she knows that she is loved infinitely and beyond measure by her parents. That's what any child truly needs. That is the bedrock that makes navigating through life successfully possible.
She may choose to identify with white culture or black culture or both. It will be her choice. I know many biracial people, including myself, and cultural preference is very fluid. I try to take the best of both worlds and see that the history is stark but the divide is thin when viewed from a certain angle: we're all people. I also get to stock up on as much different types of food as possible (the heart of culture), because deliciousness knows no bounds.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Do you also suggest that hospitals should abandon their policy of matching newborn babies to the mothers who gave birth to them? If "it's a crapshoot," and if "all children are precious," then why don't they simply assign babies randomly?
That's what this culplably negligent fertility clnic did, after all.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)It is not the same thing at all. While the sperm bank was in error, things are still a crapshoot. Picking a father for your child from photos and a resume still leaves a lot of room for chance. In fact, choosing the father in person still leaves the door open for all sorts of unexpected results.
The sperm bank is liable for their error, but only in a monetary sense. Errors happen with everything we do, and there is always chance involved in any such decision. That's why life is a crapshoot. In this country, any of us might have any sort of racial history that may well pop up when we parent a child.
The clinic is financially culpable, but that's it. An apology and a refund is about their only responsibility, and I suspect there are words to that effect on the contract the mother of this lovely child signed. A crapshoot.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Do you wear a seatbelt? Do you look both ways before crossing the street? Why bother? If life's a crapshoot, as you insist, then it's out of your hands.
Obviously, the answer is that you do these things to mitigate risk, just as these women did when they signed the paperwork indicating their selection.
And "the clinic is financially culpable?" No shit. I'd say that they should be on the hook for child support until the child reaches adulthood, just like any accidental father would be. Further, the clinic should have to advise future clients that they have a history of error. They should also have to do a full audit of pass fertilizations and notify prior clients of any irregularities.
Or they can just throw up their hands as you (and others in other threads) have suggested, and chuckle that "life's a crapshoot."
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)Well, life's fatal in the end, isn't it. I do fasten my seatbelts and look both ways before crossing the street. Still, every time I drive or cross a street, I take a chance that something might happen that I didn't anticipate. I accept that risk as part of my daily life.
These women, or more particularly that woman, selected a male parent for the anticipated child from a catalog, which no doubt also included other information about the person. An error was made in supplying the actual sperm. A common error of reading or entering a number somewhere. Such errors happen frequently. Almost daily, I answer phone calls where someone has misdialed my number, usually by transposing or repeating a number. I shrug, since I also make such mistakes.
At the time of selection of the male donor, the child was only a potential possibility. Apparently, the woman discovered the error on the part of the clinic while still pregnant, but chose to carry the child to term. Once the child is born, it is a real, rather than potential, human being. At that point, the question is different. Many things influence who that actual child is. An unsuspected genetic disorder on the part of the selected sperm donor or something that occurred during the pregnancy could also influence who the actual child turned out to be.
Every pregnancy is a crapshoot, to some degree. The clinic is, as I said, liable for its error. Recompense for that liability is a legal matter, and will be determined, based on harm and the terms of the contract the mother signed when ordering the sperm. That's why we have courts and civil suits.
The child, however, remains a child born to this woman. Judging from the photo, she is a delightful child. That's really the pertinent information, isn't it?
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Everything that everyone has said in these threads about "luck of the draw" is a bullshit post hoc rationalization. The woman was denied agency in her reproductive choice, and we're all fine with this?
Apparently a woman is only granted the privilege of reproductive choice when it's convenient, or when it fits the narrative.
MineralMan
(146,361 posts)The mother of this child could have aborted the child when she learned who her father was. She did not. I fully support reproductive choice at any stage of pregnancy. She had the information and she chose to carry the child to term, for whatever reason. It was HER decision.
She had agency throughout the entire process. An error was made. That does not have anything to do with her agency. That error had to do with some mistake on the part of the company that supplied her with the donor sperm. They informed her of the error. She made a decision.
Choice was never limited. There was an error, and the company that sold her the donor sperm is financially liable for damages due to that error. What those damages are remains to be determined, apparently. None of that has anything to do with the child in question. She is here. She deserves to have the same agency we all enjoy, when she is old enough to exercise it.
Chance plays a role in every conception.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Forcing her to select between aborting a fetus and giving birth to the child of a man she didn't choose is not preserving her agency in the reproductive process. It's saying "we screwed you, and now you need to figure out how to deal with it." She made her choice in selecting her donor, and she was denied that choice.
Pretending after the fact that this in some way honors her choice is disingenuous and more than a little creepy.
As stated before:
Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)
AngryAmish This message was self-deleted by its author.
Catherine Vincent
(34,491 posts)What is it about blonde and blue-eyed that some white people desire heavily?
kiva
(4,373 posts)that some people desire heavily?
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)Really, I am astounded that so many DU'ers are reading their own interpretations in to what has been reported… and those interpretations are intent on demonizing and castigating the mothers.
I think part of it is many DU'ers are intent on seeming "uber-liberal" and see this as an opportunity to point a finger at two women and call them racists or weaklings unwilling to stand up to racists.
11 Bravo
(23,928 posts)It must be easy to sit behind a computer and criticize these women in their response to learning that quite possibly the most personal decision they will ever make was taken out of their hands by a corporate fuck-up.
No doubt the holier-than-thou crowd would simply smile and say, "Hey, shit happens", were the same event to transpire in their above reproach little lives.
All of that.
Renew Deal
(81,915 posts)On DU or elsewhere. And they will find out that you and others think she is a "mistake."
jeff47
(26,549 posts)Mistakes happen. My aunt is one - my grandmother thought she was no longer fertile.
Being a mistake is not the same as being inferior or unwanted.
The company screwed up. The way the company is held accountable in our society is via lawsuit.
Skittles
(153,374 posts)the fact that the little girl is unbelievably cute doesn't excuse the error
Lex
(34,108 posts)is a good way to make sure a mix-up doesn't happen again. Is someone saying these moms don't love their child?
Bettie
(16,152 posts)She's going to grow up with the knowledge that she isn't want her parents wanted.
Honestly, I wouldn't sue, simply because I wouldn't want my child to ever think for a second that she wasn't wanted and adored for being who she is.
Then, I come at this from a different angle. We lost our first child at birth, so, to me, a living child is way more important than how that child looks or how the birth came about.
In the end, no matter how much they love her, she'll know that they wanted another child, one who was white.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Lots of parents really want one sex and get another. But if the kid is loved anyway, the parents' original preference usually has no negative impact. Often just makes for amusing family stories.
Bettie
(16,152 posts)Doesn't include a nationally publicized lawsuit.
I was hoping for a girl when I had my third boy. I found out early and had some disappointment at the time, but then, it was so much more important that he was healthy and lived through his birth. While I would have liked to be able to raise a daughter, I would never tell my sons that they weren't the children I wanted.
This child's parents have made their disappointment, anger, and horror over a mistake (I do not believe that this was a malicious act on the part of the sperm bank) into a very public event which the child will find out about as she grows up.
In the lawsuit they seem to see having a biracial child as some sort of insurmountable obstacle to a happy life.
This little girl will learn about all of this as she grows older and it is very likely it will cause her pain to know that she was not the child her parents wanted.
But, this is my opinion. Yours may be different.
In this position, I would not sue, simply so that my child would never believe that she was not wanted.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)But the truth is the sperm bank fucked up and should probably pay for that mistake. Hopefully the little girl's parents will put all proceeds into an education fund for her.
Lex
(34,108 posts)is not the same as not being loving parents. My parents wished they had a boy instead of a girl but they still loved me to pieces.
Bettie
(16,152 posts)It would only make a private matter public, telling the child in a very public way that she is inferior because she wasn't what they wanted.
I'm glad your parents loved you, but would you have believed in that love if there were news articles about their horror at finding out you were a girl? If you were aware that they filed a lawsuit because you were not the child they wanted?
I wanted a girl when I had my third boy. My disappointment lasted about a day after the ultrasound, then, I was on to hoping he would make it into my arms, breathing. He did and while I still wish I had my daughter to raise, I adore my boys and would never want them to think they were not what I wanted.
JI7
(89,295 posts)it would be one thing if it was just about the mix up but all the things they said after and then putting the girl's picture out there.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)
hunter
(38,355 posts)That's what bothers me about this.
Faced with a similar situation I wouldn't do anything to generate publicity, certainly not lawsuits. My happiness and excitement about being a new parent wouldn't be diminished at all.
Yes, I would notify the agencies responsible for monitoring sperm banks of the problem, maybe with strongly worded letters, but then life goes on with a healthy happy kid.
The nicest thing about my family and my community is the diversity. The kids are every color. The majority of them have mixed ancestry from several continents. A kid like this would fit right in, no matter what colors or genders her parents were.
Bettie
(16,152 posts)That was what I felt when my first child died during her birth.
After that, you realize that nothing matters except a healthy, breathing baby.
In my mind, the public nature of the lawsuit ensures that this child will grow up knowing she wasn't the child her parents wanted. That is a terrible burden to put on a child.
I agree with the idea of making monitoring agencies aware of this, though they probably were very aware. Such businesses are highly regulated and the sperm bank probably already has new procedures in place to ensure that this doesn't happen again.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Having endured the tragedy of your loss, how did you discuss the matter with your susequent children without making them feel like replacements?
I ask because a dear friend lost her first child to a congenital defect, and although she later gave birth to preposterously adorable twins, I know that she wrestles with how to discuss their late older brother when the time comes. How have you managed to share this part of your life with your children without making them feel inferior, or like they weren't what you originally wanted?
I suspect that the women in this case will have a similar conversation with their daughter. And, like your children, I'm confident that she'll be fine, thanks to her loving family and in spite of the doom-and-gloom condemnation that DU has heaped upon them.
Bettie
(16,152 posts)We talked about how our family started and how Julie was our first child.
They knew that we went to the cemetery when we were up to visit Grandma, so we told them about her and how she was their sister, but she didn't get to come home with us.
Mostly, we told them that while they couldn't replace her, they are her brothers, even if she was never with them.
We've always had her picture up with the other kids' newborn pictures. We were fortunate in that the hospital took a regular newborn picture of her and aside from her lips being dark, she looked like any other baby, startlingly like my middle son.
But, they've always been aware and as they have asked questions we have talked about it.
They know that they were planned as a part of the family, we're just missing a piece, but the picture is still a pretty good one.
I hope that makes sense. We have had a long time to deal with this now as my boys are 13, 12, and 6. Julie would have been 16 this year and her three little brothers would no doubt be the bane of her existence.
In any case, for us, the secret was being open about it from the start and waiting until someone asked about the visits to the cemetery or the picture. We then explained in an age appropriate way. It was never some big dramatic thing, just a piece of our lives.
It's weird, I go months without thinking much about it and then BAM some random thing (like this news story) brings it all back.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)We did the best we could.
I hope your friend has success in talking to her subsequent children.
This poem actually helped me a lot when I was expecting my first boy.
A Different Child
"------for Madoka Marietta Rosalie, from your mother,
Pandora Diane Waldron*--------March 4, 1999.
A different child,
People notice
There's a special glow around you.
You grow
Surrounded by love,
Never doubting you are wanted;
Only look at the pride and joy
In your mother and father's eyes.
And if sometimes
Between the smiles
There's a trace of tears,
One day
You'll understand.
You'll understand
There was once another child
A different child
Who was in their hopes and dreams.
That child will never outgrow the baby clothes
That child will never keep them up at night
In fact, that child will never be any trouble at all.
Except sometimes, in a silent moment,
When mother and father miss so much
That different child.
May hope and love wrap you warmly
And may you learn the lesson forever
How infinitely precious
How infinitely fragile
Is this life on earth.
One day, as a young man or woman
You may see another mother's tears
Another father's silent grief
Then you, and you alone
Will understand
And offer the greatest comfort.
When all hope seems lost,
You will tell them
With great compassion,
"I know how you feel.
I'm only here
Because my mother tried again."
4Q2u2
(1,406 posts)I remember the day we were in the NeoNatal specialist office and she was explaining the problems with our yet unborn daughter. After she was done, she had said she had to ask why my expression never changed or reflected sorrow or anger. My reply to her was everything she just told me actually meant nothing. It changed nothing in the way I loved my child to be, it changed nothing in the way I would devote my life to her care.
My little angel never made it though. She was not strong enough to endure birthing and died. Even that has not changed my Love for her.
Bettie
(16,152 posts)And yet, we still love them.
So sorry for your loss.
4Q2u2
(1,406 posts)May her smile warm your face when you think of her.
Kurska
(5,739 posts)Imagine if instead of a company and a black vs. white donors, it was just a guy and his lesbian friend. The guy said he would provide the sperm, but instead allowed his buddy to do it instead while not informing the lesbian friend.
People would be howling with indignation over that (rightfully so at least), some might say it was rape (if it ain't it is damn close to it).
Add a racial component and a faceless company though, suddenly rape ain't rape anymore. People will claim the mothers ought to be happy a company massively botched possibly the most important medical procedure of their lives.
Crazy.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)That is just so wrong in many levels.
The company who inseminated her gave her the wrong sperm.
The parents love their daughter, but even so, they gave them the wrong thing.
This is also their reproductive rights at stake.
They would have agonized over their choice on the profile of the sperm donor, and received the wrong thing.
In many ways this could be considered bringing to term a child from an unknown father.
Look at that issue first. Think of the profile of the sperm donor being the expected father of the child, and then them being surprised that they got impregnated by someone else. How much of a violation would one feel?
It does not mean that they do not love the child. They went through a lot of things to improve the child's situation.
Why shouldn't they go after the place that made that mistake?
Making this an issue just about race is myopic.
They picked a profile for the father of the child. This could be easily anything else.
There are many reasons people take this seriously.
At some point or another, I would have to wonder if this story was leaked to the general public to generate racial controversy to shame the mothers from dropping the law suit.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)The race of their daughter made them uncomfortable.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)Only ones I saw that say something like that are the ones that were interjecting their opinion already.
They mentioned how they had to leave the area they were in, due to the prejudice they received.
Though they themselves did not feel uncomfortable about their daughter.
To the point that they are the ones that moved away from an area for their daughter's well being.
Besides, the only reason they found out that there was a mess up was because they were expecting the child to have a different race. So of course, they would have to mention it. If it was something else, they may not have figured it out till much much later, if at all.
bluestateguy
(44,173 posts)It's about contracts, as far as the lawsuit is concerned, not whether or not someone is a racist.
JI7
(89,295 posts)And racism
stevenleser
(32,886 posts)deserves to be sued.
There is zero chance I would have sued because I would never have wanted my child to think she wasnt wanted in any way shape or form.
bluestateguy
(44,173 posts)Legally they have a valid reason to sue, even if it doesn't look so good on tv.
I think their plan is to get a nice settlement, keep it out of court, and then use the settlement money to send the young lady to college someday.
AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)Her epic cuteness makes it impossible to view her existence through the prism of anger, disappointment and fear. Just love her.
MADem
(135,425 posts)chastizing the sperm bank for their sloppiness:
The lawsuit said they had moved from Akron to Uniontown for better schools and to be closer to Cramblett's family. She said that as a lesbian she has felt the sting of prejudice but doesn't know what it's like to be mistreated because of skin color.
Therapists have recommended that Cramblett, Zinkon and Payton move to a more racially diverse community with good schools, the lawsuit said. Cramblett said she decided to sue to prevent the sperm bank from making the same mistake again. The lawsuit says the sperm bank has no electronic record-keeping and no quality controls that would have prevented it from sending the wrong sperm to fertility clinics.
The lawsuit seeks a minimum of $50,000 in damages. Cramblett's attorney, Tim Misny, said some of the compensation would pay for ongoing counseling.
That should pay for the move and the counseling, and maybe something towards the down payment on the mortgage...if they own a house they can sell with no trouble, it will maybe give them a head start on Payton's college fund.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)Over and over again I've read that they're racists who hate their daughter.
And now you're telling me that they're loving parents who want what's best for their child?
Impossible!
MADem
(135,425 posts)And it's really not appropriate for anyone to speak to their motives without hearing from them, first. It's not fair to assume that they have ill intent.
I take them at their word. Now, I suppose, the decision they will have to make is if they continue with the same donor sperm when the other partner in the marriage decides to get pregnant. That was the original plan, so that their children would be united by a DNA bond. I can understand how that would be a source of comfort--to know that you and a sibling are LINKED by blood, that you both have the same genetic history.
I would guess--I don't know, I have no experience in this area of parenting-by-the-bank/donation/whatever--that the parents would want to choose a donor who has a lot of characteristics that are similar to both of the parents--a donor who is a mix of the two moms, in essence, in appearance, temperament, intelligence, etc. That way, the children have the strongest chance of sharing similarities with both parents, and the parents would catch less shit when they go to pick up their kids at school. That's something I do have experience, with, as I have been a target of the "You don't look like him" glances, hyper-vigilance, and questions.
Orrex
(63,305 posts)is respecting their right to make a decision, and this has been sorely lacking in the discussions I've read.
Over and over and over again I see sentiments along the lines of "they're telling their daughter they don't want her" and "it's all about random chance," and "they should consider themselves lucky."
In this very thread we've seen some truly ugly speculation about their character or their motives, presuming to know what these women are thinking, and scolding them for not thinking the way DU's armchair moralists would prefer.
A more measured response--like yours--would be to defer to their handling of the situation and to recognize that the clinic should be held accountable for its inexcusable error beyond simply "issuing a refund."
MADem
(135,425 posts)Say two slight, dark haired caucasian women were looking for a slight, dark haired caucasian donor and by mistake they ended up with the sperm of an Arnold Schwarzenegger look alike. By the time the kid is three, he's enormous and blonde, like a cross between Bam-Bam and Baby Huey, and everyone thinks the moms are the babysitters. Or the caucasian moms get Asian sperm, and find themselves with a child who people think they've adopted from China. They constantly get the "Oh, aren't you so nice to ADOPT" line when that's not what they did. Even though adoption is a wonderful thing, it can grate on a birth parent when people tell you that you've adopted your biological child.
I think the blame lies entirely with the sperm bank in promising them that they would match the donor father to the mother's desires, that they had a protocol in place to provide people with a screening process so they could select attributes that are important to them, and then, through sheer sloppiness, not following through with their promises. If they want it to be a "random" process, why not rename the sperm bank the Wheel of Fortune and let the evolution be like putting money on the table and spinning the wheel? Round and round and round she goes....where she stops, nobody knows! Congratulations, madame, you're child is half ....... (fill in blank after DNA tests are done following birth!).
It would be the same degree of offense if a black couple with an infertile father went and screened for a donor who looked a bit like the father so as to fit into the extended family unit, who shared the same characteristics, interests, educational level and pursuits of the father-to-be, and -- ooops! that poor mother ended up with the Ahhnuld sperm or the Jackie Chan look-alike sperm. It's not a question of "I don't like this RACE" it's "This is not what I ordered." That imaginary family would love THEIR child just as much--even though the sperm bank didn't provide the requested sample from the appropriate donor. And they'd still have to listen to sniffing at the holidays from Uncle This One or Aunt That One who would have something to say about Baby Ahhnuld/Little Jackie, when it isn't their business. And if they made this mistake with a heterosexual couple, like this one I'm inventing, here, who's to say the parents might not have wanted to keep the whole donor sperm issue quiet and between themselves? A mistake like this would sure make that impossible--the people who didn't know the circumstances would assume that the wife was a cheat, or the child was the product of a previous liaison, or something.
I mean, look at that kid. She's alert, engaged, clearly happy as hell, and gorgeous. Hell, I'd take that kid in a heartbeat if she needed a home, I'm sure anyone would. But I think she's well loved, so that's just not the issue, here. The issue is that actions have consequences. The actions of the sperm bank should have consequences. They made a promise, and they failed at it and they need to understand that splashing the sperm around willy-nilly is just not OK. If they make promises, they need to keep them, and not play the "Oh well, then you're a racist" game when it comes to their screw up. It's appropriate that they relocate this family to a less white-centric community, that they provide counseling all around as needed, and that they compensate this family for the agita they endured as a consequence of having to change their plans, move, maybe even find new work. I hope that enough is left over to help with that lovely young child's college fund, too.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)Ms. Toad
(34,154 posts)Both members of the couple fill out an extensive questionnaire listing their personal characteristics (physical, educational, religion, interests, etc.). They typically try first to match the non-biological parent - but if they can't, then they try to match the characteristics of the biological one. The concept - in straight families - is that you are trying to make it appear as though the child is the biological ciod of the couple. Some places even go so far as to encourage the couple to continue to try to have a child so there is even the theoretical possibility that the child is really theirs.
MADem
(135,425 posts)on conversations that I half-remembered from a cousin who went through the process. It's always helpful to have a clumsy, distant memory validated!
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)It is no longer a shock.
hunter
(38,355 posts)... and broke the boss's arm with a baseball bat.
.
.
.
JI7
(89,295 posts)not her going after the sperm bank for messing up.
azmom
(5,208 posts)Framed it from the child's point of view. Stating how awful it would be for the child to live thru life with white parents, and gay ones at that too. The horror.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)Make the clinic pay for the abortion, and then punitive damages for any pain and suffering as a result.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)1. obviously she wanted a baby
2. everything she's said leads me to believe she would not have chosen abortion if she'd known the baby would be biracial.
3. she didn't know the baby was biracial until she was born, so your reply doesn't even make a slight bit of logical sense.
ncjustice80
(948 posts)snagglepuss
(12,704 posts)to such a degree that her parents launched a law suit. 
mother earth
(6,002 posts)their lawsuit, which I'm sure they will be, it would really be wonderful if after legal fees the money is used to help educate and fight racism. Now, wouldn't that be something they and their daughter could really be instrumental in? Just a thought...she's a little sweetheart, cute as a button.
Sometimes things happen that can really make for a beautiful start to something unexpected. 
rebecca_herman
(617 posts)I used a sperm donor to have my daughter. For most couples and individuals who use a sperm (or egg) donor, a LOT of thought goes into choosing the right donor. While I would have loved my child even if there had been a mixup, I chose the donor I did with what I thought the future child's best interests were. I was mainly concerned with:
1. A genetic issue, I carry a fatal recessive gene, so I was only interested in donors who had been tested and did not carry the gene
2. Donor of the same ethnicity - I am a single mom by choice and my family is not diverse, we are all the same race, same ethnicity (all four of my grandparents were the first generation of the family born in the US, and none of their kids married and had kids with anyone of another group...). I didn't want my child to have no known family members at all that shared the other half of her heritage, I didn't want her to grow up missing out on that connection, and I didn't feel well equipped to immerse her in or teach her about another culture I wasn't familiar with at all.
3. Similar physical features as myself and my close relatives... I didn't want her to feel she looked really "different" from the entire rest of her family
I can definitely understand why this child's parents are upset. From the pictures of them with their daughter they obviously love her very much. They live in an area where their child was already going to be different because she has two moms instead of a mom and a dad, they didn't want her to have yet another difference on top of that, that made it even harder for her to fit in. The sperm bank, by keeping such antiquated records (Transcribing orders by hand??? My bank required me to select the donor online, submit the order, then confirm it with a typed fax, and the clinic that received the sperm then had to verify the number as well upon receipt, then it was verified again when I signed consents for fertilization, then again when I had the embryo transferred), made a huge medical error and they need to be held accountable so this doesn't happen again. Given how sloppy their system is, I would be shocked if this hasn't happened numerous other times and simply wasn't noticed because the wrong donor was the same race and there were no genetic issues that would have made the parents suspect the wrong donor sperm was sent.
I would have loved my child no matter what, but I would have felt robbed of my right as the parent to make a decision of what was best for the child, that no one else had the right to make for me.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)rebecca_herman
(617 posts)If I were married to a man of another race who was infertile, I would have used a donor the same race as my hypothetical husband. I personally would not choose for my child to be the only person of their race in the entire family and have no one with that shared heritage. It's not about a child being worth less because of race. It's about feeling a child should have the opportunity be with others like them, to learn about all of their heritage from their family, to have family members they can share that with, instead of having 50% of their biological heritage that they don't share with a single other person in their entire known family. Because I used a donor not just the same race as myself, but also the exact same ethnicity as well, she won't have an entire culture/heritage from her other biological parent that she will be missing out on.
hunter
(38,355 posts)Blood banking procedures are very thorough. It would take multiple human and system errors for a mistake like this to occur.
I was surprised that a sperm bank could make an error like this.
Being "different" isn't an issue in many places. It was my generation of siblings and cousins who abandoned white America. Our own kids and their cousins are diverse themselves, with multiple cultural and genetic heritages, and they've grown up in diverse communities.
The girl in the picture wouldn't be out of place in my family or my community. The majority of kids here are "Hispanic," which already encompasses a very broad spectrum of origins including Native Americans, but there's a pretty good mix of other people living here too; black, white, Asian.
I'm white, my wife is Hispanic, two of her grandparents were born in Mexico. My white California grandfather was a little upset I was marrying, in his words, "A Mexican girl" but he got over it.
MADem
(135,425 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)
kimbutgar
(21,307 posts)And I could do her hair with no problem.
She is so beautiful!
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)MADem
(135,425 posts)
RobinA
(9,925 posts)this story is about to me.
Two parents are suing a sperm bank because their child didn't turn out as planned. Obviously, mistakes were made, but there is a child involved here. I find it deeply disturbing that these people are suing because their child is who she is. Their definition of love for their child is certainly not mine if they can saddle her with the fact of this lawsuit for the rest of her life. There are no words...
