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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsGreenwald: Thumbs Up or Down?
Pretty controversial fellow!
57 votes, 1 pass | Time left: Time expired | |
Overall, I'm GLAD Greenwald does what he does | |
53 (93%) |
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Overall, I'm SAD Greenwald does what he does | |
3 (5%) |
|
Other (please explain below) | |
1 (2%) |
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1 DU member did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
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Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll |
ProSense
(116,464 posts)Why do they keep doing that and forcing these posts to declare loyalty to Greenwald?
Response to ProSense (Reply #1)
Post removed
ForgoTheConsequence
(4,869 posts)Funny that you're asking others to leave, it would be a lonely place for you and the other 10 people if they did.
and you'd have to change the name to neocon underground....
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)Many of us in the "DU minority" don't bother to vote in Manny's specious polls.
Congratulations, looks like Greenwald is a shoo in for class president.
Number23
(24,544 posts)This will be another pointless push poll that gets thrown around here as proof of... something. Prepare to be dazzled!
Bjorn Against
(12,041 posts)When someone has access to the treasure trove of government secrets he has access to they are terrified of the info he may release. They will do everything they can to try and discredit him before he releases any more damaging information.
ProSense
(116,464 posts)"The reason people hate Greenwald so much is because they are terrified of him When someone has access to the treasure trove of government secrets he has access to they are terrified of the info he may release. They will do everything they can to try and discredit him before he releases any more damaging information."
...disliked him before that, and because of his choice of politicians to hype
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024931733#post186
Bjorn Against
(12,041 posts)But people who actually read him know that he disagrees with the Pauls on many issues and really does not focus much of his energy on them. He is far more focused on talking about issues such as war and NSA spying than he is on partisan politics, you can try all you want to pretend Greenwald is some huge Ron Paul backer but those who have read Greenwald know that he does not spend his time hyping politicians, he spends his time exposing government secrets.
ProSense
(116,464 posts)"I know you like to pretend he focuses his energy promoting Ron Paul...But people who actually read him know that he disagrees with the Pauls on many issues, and really does not focus much of his energy on them. He is far more focused on talking about issues such as war and NSA spying than he is on partisan politics, you can try all you want to pretend Greenwald is some huge Ron Paul backer but those who have read Greenwald know that he does not spend his time hyping politicians, he spends his time exposing government secrets. "
...he disagrees with the most "anti-war, anti-Surveillance-State, anti-crony-capitalism, and anti-drug-war" who he claims holds those "genuine" views?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024931733#post186
Maybe you're "pretending" that people don't understand what Greenwald writes. That's typical Greenwald apologia though.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)anti-crony-capitalism, and anti-drug-war" candidate.
Which of those do you disagree with most, and why?
ProSense
(116,464 posts)"He claimed that Ron Paul was the most "anti-war, anti-Surveillance-State, anti-crony-capitalism, and anti-drug-war" candidate.
Which of those do you disagree with most, and why?"
...all of them. Are you trying to imply that he's right? Ron Paul wants to eliminate corporate taxes and preserve oil subsidies. Did you know he's really a RW Republican? Greenwald's favorite politicians are frauds, and the fact that he doesn't know that means he's clueless. Anyone backing these frauds or making excuses for Greenwald support of them is trying perpetrate the fraud.
Ron Paul Calls For 'Nullification' Of Obamacare: 'Pretty Soon ... We're Just Going To Ignore The Feds'
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/ron-paul-calls-for-nullification-of-obamacare
"Ron Paul hates govt intervention, likes mandatory vaginal ultrasound probes"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002161152
Rand Paul backs bill that could lead to crackdown on states where voters legalized weed
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024663470
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)ProSense
(116,464 posts)I love the denial as a rebuttal.
Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #36)
Dragonfli This message was self-deleted by its author.
Bjorn Against
(12,041 posts)I know you like to pretend that one Tweet limited to 140 characters represents some kind of endorsement of Ron Paul, what you fail to mention is that Greenwald has repeatedly said he did not endorse the Pauls for any elected office.
Emphasis Greenwald's.
http://www.salon.com/2011/12/31/progressives_and_the_ron_paul_fallacies/
I don't agree with everything Greenwald says in this article, but his view on the Pauls is far more nuanced than you are making it out to be.
Hassin Bin Sober
(26,356 posts)Sounds about right.
QC
(26,371 posts)bvar22
(39,909 posts)ProSense
(116,464 posts)"I am not endorsing or expressing support for anyones candidacy"
...you're buying into his spin, and claiming:
"I don't agree with everything Greenwald says in this article, but his view on the Pauls is far more nuanced than you are making it out to be. "
Greenwald stated:
It is true, as Booman convincingly argues, that the bigfoot reporters move like a herd and put fingers on the scales in elections all the time. But sometimes thats done for petty reasons (such as their 2000 swooning for George Bushs personality and contempt for Al Gores); in this case, it is being done (with the effect if not intent) to maintain simplistic partisan storylines and exclude important views from the discourse.
However much progressives find Pauls anti-choice views to be disqualifying (even if the same standard is not applied to Good Democrats Harry Reid or Bob Casey), and even as much as Pauls domestic policies are anathema to liberals (the way numerous positions of Barack Obama ostensibly are: war escalation, due-process-free assassinations, entitlement cuts, and whistleblower wars anyone?), shouldnt progressives be eager to have included in the discourse many of the views Paul uniquely advocates? After all, these are critical, not ancillary, positions, such as: genuine opposition to imperialism and wars; warnings about the excesses of the Surveillance State, executive power encroachments, and civil liberties assaults; and attacks on the one policy that is most responsible for the unjustifiable imprisonment of huge numbers of minorities and poor and the destruction of their families and communities: Drug Prohibition and the accompanying War to enforce it. GOP primary voters are supporting a committed anti-war, anti-surveillance candidate who wants to stop imprisoning people (dispropriationately minorities) for drug usage; Democrats, by contrast, are cheering for a war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior.
The nuance there is Greenwald basically saying: Yeah, sure progressives find Paul's "anti-choice views to be disqualifying" and while his "policies are anathema to liberals" they give Reid and Obama a pass on equivalent or worse views.
I mean, why are Democrats "cheering for a "war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior" when they could be "cheering" the genuine Ron Paul?
Greenwald is delusional, and your spin doesn't work. He holds Democrats in contempt and spends a lot of ink defending Ron and Rand Paul against criticism from Democrats.
Glenn Greenwald defend Rand Paul against "Democratic myths"
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022485711
You want Greenwald to have his cake and eat it too by claiming that he isn't 'endorsing' or expressing support for anyones candidacy." He's just saying Ron Paul is the best, "genuine," on every issue, yet instead of cheering Paul, Democrats are "cheering for a war-escalating, drone-attacking, surveillance-and-secrecy-obsessed drug warrior."
Why can't Democrats see what Greenwald sees in Paul?
That's the nuance. Greenwald is delusional.
baldguy
(36,649 posts)has nothing to do with it, huh?
Cha
(298,021 posts)arely staircase
(12,482 posts)psiman
(64 posts)Terror is not a response the Glenn provokes.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)come on now.. that's just silly.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)One of my favorite reporters. He is controversial and pisses off a lot of people. He does it so well
UTUSN
(70,785 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Gets a big jackpot and don't care about anything but his bottom line. Hw doesn't need Snowden so Snowden is put out to pasture. Greenwald doesn't have integrity.
365fx
(12 posts)I thought Snowden was the criminal one. Greenwald was in the USA and the DOJ didn't arrest him. Or do you hold the position that Snowden didn't commit a crime? If he didn't, why was it wrong for Greenwald to publish non-criminally leaked documents?
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)365fx
(12 posts)Greenwald's fiercest detractors don't even make that claim.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Up question, Snowden is a patsy. It is about fooling Snowden to give up the information he had stolen from the NSA. Did Snowden give up the information?
365fx
(12 posts)Do you still contend that they fooled him into giving it to them?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Last edited Mon May 12, 2014, 10:49 PM - Edit history (1)
He was able to control Snowden's brain, forcing him to steal the documents and hand 'em over.
Obviously.
truebluegreen
(9,033 posts)and welcome to DU.
Response to truebluegreen (Reply #45)
Name removed Message auto-removed
bobduca
(1,763 posts)Or write books and expect people to publicize and buy them! The nerve of the publishing industry!
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)WillyT
(72,631 posts)And WE villify the TPer's.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)sheshe2
(84,057 posts)But for Glenn, it's all about Glenn~ he's a compassionate conservative.
Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)arely staircase
(12,482 posts)But why should he care about them, it isn't like they are white supremacist assassins or anything? those he will go to bat for.
Electric Monk
(13,869 posts)arely staircase
(12,482 posts)like Glenn Greenwald
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)protect the business interests of a white supremacist.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)the Revolution. Lawyers sometimes represent unpopular criminal clients. Doesn't mean they agree with the clients' actions. It's the job of a lawyer to represent people accused of crimes among other things. Don't judge a lawyer by his clients' actions.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)Matt Hale as his civil attorney. He did not represent Hale in his various criminal cases---therefore neither Greenwald or his supporters can claim that this representation was somehow honorable.
There's little honor in protecting the business of white supremacists.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)the revolution of 1800 for nothing.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)They are just using the "Al Gore said he invented the internet" tactic developed and perfected by the right wing to discredit people...it works because one can interpret what people are saying instead of what they actually say.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)who's publicly said that Jews are going to Hell.
Would that be more callous, or less, than what Greeenwald tweeted? Which action would have been more carefully thought out?
Bonus question: would you attack a president who did such a thing the way you attack Mr. Greenwald?
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)just suppose
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)It doesn't seem like a very challenging question.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)kidnapped girls. your OP is about Greenwald. But let's talk about Obama? Obama won (twice) Get over it.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)I'll assume that you agree that Obama's choice of Rick Warren was orders of magnitude more insensitive than Greenwald's tweet. If that's not the case, please correct me.
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)alrighty
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Think about the choices that you're making.
Is that who you really are?
arely staircase
(12,482 posts)zappaman
(20,606 posts)WorseBeforeBetter
(11,441 posts)Petty, yes. I fully admit it.
psiman
(64 posts)Because squabbling amongst ourselves is the best way to block the Republican agenda and move forward with the leftist program.
WorseBeforeBetter
(11,441 posts)Last edited Tue May 13, 2014, 02:18 PM - Edit history (1)
is having ZERO impact on the Republican agenda.
Capt. Obvious
(9,002 posts)WorseBeforeBetter
(11,441 posts)It makes it *all* worthwhile.
Capt. Obvious
(9,002 posts)Sometimes I rec threads based on who it pisses off.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)pa28
(6,145 posts)A Greenwald thread always seems to result in cascade of angry opponents attacking him. One might think the consensus was anti-Greenwald here on DU.
Let's find out if a vocal minority is at work.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)Of his social media antics. He sometimes makes outrageous comments, then when challenged he resorts to crude smug statements, which then leads to thousands of his worshippers trolling that person, saying even cruder statements until they eventually start just responding with pictures of a dog raping a pig.
365fx
(12 posts)For disclosing the leaks. Greenwald had haters even before the leak because he slams abuses in both parties. We all know why Greenwald haters hate him.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)I was referring to responses challenging him, no hate involved, except apparently coming from him.
840high
(17,196 posts)Sancho
(9,071 posts)Frankly, I don't care what Greenwald personally believes (or Snowden for that matter). I only have an interest in what Greenwald publishes.
Uncovering the NSA spying was an important story for all Americans. Thanks, Greenwald and Snowden.
Historic NY
(37,461 posts)or a fundraiser?
DeSwiss
(27,137 posts)anti partisan
(429 posts)bobduca
(1,763 posts)Because to engage in policy debates is to question the certainty of one's allegiance to the leader.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)neverforget
(9,437 posts)and sad.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)if they worship the oligarchs, maybe they will be given a reward.
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)there are times he does good things, though they are always out of selfish motives, like any Ayn Rand disciple would be, but he is never someone you would trust without verifying, and never someone to idolize. The Mafia may have run Vegas well, but you never forgot they were capable of killing you at a whim.
Iggo
(47,594 posts)Easy.
frylock
(34,825 posts)and that makes me smile.
Autumn
(45,120 posts)they are so delightful to read.
frylock
(34,825 posts)Autumn
(45,120 posts)because they sound so cute. Threads like this satisfy that little guilty pleasure.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)That's just creepy.
shawn703
(2,702 posts)Where he said (and I'm paraphrasing), that the most explosive revelations will be coming in a few months. To me, that doesn't sound like a guy who is concerned with what's in our best interests or he would have released it when he learned about it. He's interested more in what's best for Greenwald.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)those revelations are in our best interests or not.
I'm not going to judge future revelations until I know what they are. To judge them a priori is to judge them based on speculation or worse.
eridani
(51,907 posts)Is "we" the 99% or the 1%?
dionysus
(26,467 posts)simple as that...
nikto
(3,284 posts)even though he's 1000-times worse than Hitler.
psiman
(64 posts)I am sad that Snowden did not choice an experienced journalist to receive the documents, one who knows how to vet an asset and build a story. Had Snowden been more wise in his selection in whom to trust, maybe hear after a year has passed we might have had some real progress for our pains instead of this endless Sturm und Drang.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)That's what the Sturm und Drang is all about, it wouldn't matter who the journalist might be, it could have been zombie Walter Cronkite and the Sturm would still Drang just as hard here.
Welcome to DU!
War Horse
(931 posts)It would have helped if Snowden had picked someone with an actual moral compass to reveal this important info.
It should be clear to anyone that the NSA overreaches. Just how much is impossible to tell if one relies on Greenwald's convoluted writings alone, with his hyperbole and actual facts buried in the last paragraph of his articles.
I guess that's why I'm pissed off at Greenwald. Because this is a very important issue, and he seems to be only in it for himself. I may be wrong on that, and I hope I am, but that's the way it seems to me.
dionysus
(26,467 posts)MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)dionysus
(26,467 posts)I think he's a self serving jerk, but he doesn't make me sad or take up much of my time.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)that would give a substantially different result?
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)psiman
(64 posts)If some experienced, knowledgeable reporter had been given the source materials he would have developed the story and published a series of solid and well substantiated analyses of the NSA practices that would have built support for a reform movement in America. Instead we got a string of sensationalist exaggerations that make it difficult to separate fact from fantasy; true believers give credence to all sorts of lurid fairytales while normal people tune out the junk and nobody listens to the government.
Thus we get handed insulting pieces of garbage like the recent "reform" bill, because nobody is taking any real steps to pressure the politicians. We have only ourselves to blame for squandering the opportunity handed to us last June, with an assist from Greenwald and his short fuse.