Switzerland Questions US over CIA Drunk Driving Gambit

[struggle4progress]

12:05PM Wednesday
June 12, 2013

... “In accordance with the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, Switzerland expects the members of the diplomatic missions in Bern and the members of the permanent mission in Geneva to comply with the laws and rules of the country of residence,” a statement from the foreign ministry read.

At the time of the alleged incident, Snowden said he was working undercover for the CIA in Geneva, maintaining computer network security. The CIA has declined to comment on Snowden’s case, but the Swiss foreign ministry confirmed that he publicly held the position of “an attaché” with the permanent U.S. mission in Geneva from March 2007 to February 2009 ...

http://www.630wpro.com/common/more.php?m=58&ts=1371036903&article=0846E94CD37E11E286DEFEFDADE6840A&mode=2

[okaawhatever]

1. What good did Snowden do by outing this? All intelligence agencies do these sort of things. This

is pretty tame compared to what they try to do to compromise each others agents. Remember, we thought Switzerland was neutral during WWII and wasn't laundering Nazi money.

[Monkie]

3. WWII makes it alright then? thats a new one for me

you might think it pretty tame that your government attempts to entice a foreign national, in his country of residence, to break the law so that he could be recruited to break the law in a country that is not your enemy.

do you think the swiss government has agents doing the same to the US?
can you imagine the outrage if iran did this?

you cant pretend to be the beacon of democracy in the world while at the same time being a serial breaker of EU law and international law. the level of delusion shown in america regarding this issue is breathtaking.

[okaawhatever]

4. Absolutely the Swiss has agents trying to do this to our agents. This is commonplace and expected.

One of the biggest things they look for in clearing someone for classified info is vices. More agents are turned because they get in trouble with their vices than for political reasons. The FBI and other agencies recruit Mormons heavily. Why? Because they don't drink and those who don't drink are less likely to get caught up in other risky behavior.
The outrage if Iran does this? Are you friggin kidding me? They try to do this each and every day. That's tradecraft 101.
The point about the Swiss and their business with the Nazi's is just to show you never know who your friends are, and even the most docile of nations participates in world politics.
I think you need to review who is deluded in this.

[Monkie]

5. the total budget for the whole of switzerland including municipal is $211.1 billion

the US intelligence budget alone is 80 billion?
the US is responsible for 40% of all the worlds military spending.
seriously?
you think the iranians and the swiss are trying to recruit US agents every single day?
you are seriously saying that the swiss are a potential threat to the US and i am deluded?

if this is the same thinking that is common currency in your government then i am beginning to understand the spying a little better.

[okaawhatever]

6. Do they approach someone every day? No, do they continualy try to find out who our agents are and

try to find ways to compromise them, absolutely. Do I think the Swiss would attack the U.S.? No, do I think the Swiss (and just about every other country) would use info gathered from the u.s. to their benefit? Heck yes. The Swiss can't protect themselves. They rely on relationships with foreign governments. The Swiss have had banking relationships with some of the world's biggest criminals/terrorists/dictators. I would believe if we were trying to compromise a Swiss official it would be for info on their banking relationships. Many countries are wonderful to their people and the world at large, but I don't know of anyone who hasn't gotten their hands dirty.

[Monkie]

8. since spying is illegal they are within their rights to find out which visitors are US spies

if you want me to dig up the evidence of US banks, and banks with a large presence in the US which have been given a slap on the wrists for laundering money for criminals/terrorists/dictators i will, but otherwise i will just leave this "fascinating" discussion for what it is.
the thing you and many others here and in the wider US dont seem to understand is that snowdon has exposed massive criminality on a unprecedented scale, deployed against its allies, those same allies that gave complete support to the US after 9/11 despite grave misgivings about its purpose. All the EU asked in return was that the US used existing channels to ask for this data, and if you doubt the scale of this access that was given, one example is the direct connection that was given to the database of ALL financial transactions in the EU.

[okaawhatever]

9. I will wait for proof of that. I don't agree that Snowden has exposed "massive criminality" on an

unprecedented scale. That's absurd considering what Bush was doing. The fact that Snowden is saying "since 2009" is highly suspect. All he has revealed is his claim about the Swiss agent, the existence of Prism which was already exposed and reported on. (Look up Stellar Wind). We still don't know the details of the data mining program that is worldwide. That was reported on by financial news sources. The company that created it (or one we used to use) is a publicly traded company. They revealed in stock reports contracts with the FBI, CIA and it said they were looking for a contract with the NSA.
It would surprise me greatly if the U.S. were doing something within the EU without their approval. There is so much information sharing, I doubt they could have even hidden it for long. I can see how the data mining would be allowed, strictly from a generic stand point. Then for example, if they find anomalies in France, say, they would pass the intel onto the French for investigation. We'll see when all the facts are revealed, but Snowden is highly suspect and I look at what he's saying with a grain of salt. It's also interesting that he went into that job looking to leak info. He previously worked with the CIA. I think he went to the NSA looking for info. I'm not afraid to admit I'm wrong if that's what the facts reveal.

[arely staircase]

2. the fact he says this is the thing that freaked him out makes me wonder

who he thought he was going to work for. what did he think spies do?

[MNBrewer]

7. Is he your new favorite target?

Has Julian lost his luster?

[struggle4progress]

10. Facts first, analysis second. A number of my posts in recent days have indicated

my skepticism regarding Snowden's claim that the CIA posted him under diplomatic cover to Geneva, following a stint as a security guard at NSA and only a couple of years after he was enrolled in junior college, where he earned no degree or certification

I thought this likely to be pure fantasy on Snowden's part, since it seemed unlikely to me that he could get a foreign diplomatic assignment with so thin a resume

But apparently the Swiss are now saying that he WAS at the Geneva embassy, so I posted the info in GD and in LBN: it may rather undermine my earlier-stated PoV in various ways

Facts matter: we can't win political fights without clear accurate fact-based analyses

Have a nice day

[MNBrewer]

11. Smear first, second and third.

[struggle4progress]

12. I merely posted a news story that might discredit some of my earlier comments. Have fun trawling!

[1StrongBlackMan]

13. This is getting curiouser and curiouser …

So Snowden was an undercover operative (read: spy) that was opposed to undercover activities? What did he suppose undercover activities (recruitment) involved … inviting the target of recruitment to tea and cookies and talking to them real nice?