General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDo you support NSA data mining?
For me, when I think a policy is wrong, it doesn't matter to me who is in charge. I also welcome the sunlight on wrong policies. I take the approach of asking whether something is right or wrong, rather than concerning myself only with how criticism may affect a political figure.
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I supported the policy under bush and do under Obama. | |
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I was against it under bush, but support it under Obama. | |
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I was against it under bush and am against it under Obama. | |
34 (94%) |
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I supported it under bush, but am against it under Obama (hi RW troll!) | |
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Other | |
1 (3%) |
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0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided. | |
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cherokeeprogressive
(24,853 posts)morningfog
(18,115 posts)arely staircase
(12,482 posts)nt
RGinNJ
(1,021 posts)RKP5637
(67,112 posts)mwooldri
(10,303 posts)As for monitoring telecomms, I was against this in 1993. It has been known for long enough that the CIA and the NSA (for that I also include MI5 + GCHQ) have had that capability all this time.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)I know next to nothing about them beyond the occasional headlines.
Democracyinkind
(4,015 posts)"mining coins"
I find it rather witty.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)Forgive me for being obtuse.
mwooldri
(10,303 posts)And apparently malware is distributed across computers and the malware works on "mining" the bitcoins.
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/security/researchers-find-malware-rigged-with-bitcoin-miner/8934
However mining bitcoins is technically theft, the malware attempts to find the bitcoin digital wallet and send that to the person who is doing the mining.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)As I get older, I'm finding myself more and more behind in the technical arena. Thanks for the link, too.
limpyhobbler
(8,244 posts)rocktivity
(44,585 posts)Warrantless domestic spying is intolerable in this country.
rocktivity
morningfog
(18,115 posts)qualify as a legitimate warrant?
I don't think it does.
rocktivity
(44,585 posts)and a legal reason why that someone should be monitored.
rocktivity
uponit7771
(90,371 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)uponit7771
(90,371 posts)...especially when he's out in crowds
I get a lot of people with that one
DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Q: Do you support the President's domestic surveillance of citizens?
Your answer: "Yes, he's not doing enough of it".
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2967456
uponit7771
(90,371 posts)..sure he keeps an eye out for the really stupid ones.
Do I support the meta data "program"?!
Nope and neither am I going to act like I heard about it yesterday either.
I'm working for a more pgoressive congress and not disingenuous faux outrage of acting as if this is new news.
DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)Your word is of no value. Good evening.
uponit7771
(90,371 posts)DisgustipatedinCA
(12,530 posts)You're done.
uponit7771
(90,371 posts)limpyhobbler
(8,244 posts)Savannahmann
(3,891 posts)The ones telling us that Obama has to do this, and he doesn't have any choice? Where are the people telling us time and time again that it's not that bad, and really a good thing, because it stopped some vague threat some time ago once or something. You know, the ones who were parroting Senator Goofball from South Carolina about how good this whole thing was for the nation.
The ones who told us that it didn't violate the 4th Amendment because they had a warrant, based not upon probable cause, but a warrant right?
morningfog
(18,115 posts)JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)Union Scribe
(7,099 posts)uponit7771
(90,371 posts)quinnox
(20,600 posts)I would love to debate anyone who wants to argue why we need to have wholesale spying of Americans, but they don't seem to want to argue for that, for some odd reason. The best they can manage to come up with is "It has been happening for years, so there!"
SHRED
(28,136 posts)...should share our information with each other.
DallasNE
(7,404 posts)That is the enabling legislation that makes this all legal. The timing of this is suspect, coming but a few months after the Patriot Act was reauthorized. The disclosure and outrage needed to occur before that vote was taken. Coming out now only supports Jim DeMint's stated goal for Congress to not legislate but instead go all in on scandals all of the time. DeMint 1, Democrats 0.
CJCRANE
(18,184 posts)like the rest of the scandals.
Lifelong Protester
(8,421 posts)ohheckyeah
(9,314 posts)whole thing disgusting beyond belief. I'm not surprised, really, just sick of this government and the complete lack of morals, scruples, decency, privacy, and integrity. Slippery slope - you bet, the slope is coated with Teflon and Astrolube.
limpyhobbler
(8,244 posts)Beacool
(30,254 posts)I understand the need to gather information to prevent future terrorist attacks, but I think that the government has overreached. Apparently, they have been doing this for the last 7 years. Little by little most of our personal liberties are eroding. Unfortunately, I think that the clock won't be turned back and these governmental abuses are here to stay, regardless of who sits in the WH.
cynatnite
(31,011 posts)I really don't know enough about how it's implemented, what exactly it's used for, and how the information that is retrieved is disseminated. I don't know if it's benefited this country in any way such as stopping potential attacks or if it's harmed us to the degree that it's used to spy on political opponents.
Perhaps the potential for abuse is enough to not support it. I just honestly don't know.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)uponit7771
(90,371 posts)...issues on this whole topic.
The M$M is full of crap!!!
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)The conflict ...people volunteer their data for free but don't want the gov to collect their data. The dif is that Facebook will not be our future country's dictator. If a dictator should take over we will have no way to undo that. They will know about most every anti dictator person and group and stop us.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)No ads, no public posts, no pictures of myself, no profile info, and a known alias. My choice.
NaturalHigh
(12,778 posts)Or twitter or any of the other social media things.
tridim
(45,358 posts)I've learned today that some DU'ers want NO spy program in this country whatsoever.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)I think if you have probable cause and a signed warrant, you are following the law. If you are Nixon ordering break-ins at Democratic Headquarters, you are not! Maybe I ma super sensitive to that because I remember how shocked I was listening to the Watergate hearings? We got to see behind the government's secret curtain.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)but this is where I draw the line. You cross it, I don't care who you are. Data miner, telemarketer, hacker, spy, government voyeurocrat, totalitarian oligarchical scumrats. I will not be cowed into silence. Neither will I support tyranny.
You will not need to eavesdrop when I whisper because I will shout out loud for your benefit what I think of your actions.
Everywhere in our lives, the government has invaded our space, restricted our freedoms in the name of protecting us. They have made us pay a massive cost to fund Homeland Security, the very thing historians will point to as the beginnings of our descent into totalitarianism. Because that is where we as a nation are heading. Homeland Security spends most of its money devising more powerful ways to control us all. X-ray scanners, data mining, warrantless spying, the new arsenals available to local cops...we are coming uncomfortable close to voluntarily losing our freedoms entirely. And the ones who are fine with this tell the rest of us we need to just acceot it, that there's nothing to be done.
And yet, just yesterday I read here on DU that TSA is taking out the naked bopdy scanners in all the airports. Fancy that! Must be because enough freedom loving Americans raised their voices?
LuvNewcastle
(16,867 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)who grew so powerful no one in government could control him! We should be scared. Once the NSA and others have "blackmail" info on all our government officials, it's all over for the rest of us.
These agencies don't ever retreat, downsize or disband. They just get more and more powerful. Our KGB. Our Gestapo.
We really should be alarmed.
randome
(34,845 posts)...Republicans would sweep into power for ANOTHER 30 years.
If we don't like the Patriot Act, we need to change it.
And no, I don't support NSA data mining.
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[font color="blue"][center]Stop looking for heroes. BE one.[/center][/font]
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morningfog
(18,115 posts)It doesn't become anymore true or relevant each time.
randome
(34,845 posts)Few have bothered to argue the point.
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[font color="blue"][center]Stop looking for heroes. BE one.[/center][/font]
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morningfog
(18,115 posts)it will be politicized regardless. Conversely, lack of a major attack does not necessarily prove the data mining has helped prevent, or would help, prevent an attack.
I can't see a situation where an attack occurs and the repubs run around saying, "if only we had data mined the entire American population!" If an attack occurred, will they attempt to say it is because we ended the war in Iraq and stopped waterboarding? Possibly. But, none of that will guarantee 30 years of repub rule. You are stretching into unfounded scare tactics to justify authoritarian apologia. A very weak argument.
hunter
(38,349 posts)Seriously, incurious guys who can be led around like puppets, guys like Ronald Reagan or George W. Bush who haven't been caught telling people what they really think (if they think at all), dodging taxes, exposing themselves to Congressional pages, or having kinky diaper sex with farm animals, these Republican candidates are very difficult to find.
It takes a huge amount of computing power to do it, and the party is not always successful. A grumpy old man and a vacuous beauty queen? Romney and Ryan? Really? Is that the best the Republicans can muster???
Obviously they need more computers, more monitoring of the 'nets. Somewhere out there is a suitable Republican presidential candidate. There must be!
Initech
(100,139 posts)But what royally pisses me off is the double standard in the media that applies to one side but not the other. When the republicans misuse the NSA, it's "protecting our freedoms" (whatever those are anymore). When the democrats misuse the NSA, it's "eroding our civil liberties and destroying the fourth amendment". Really, that shit pisses me off more than anything!
limpyhobbler
(8,244 posts)ZombieHorde
(29,047 posts)Some of the people involved probably feel like they have a duty to protect the American people from terrorist attacks, and that job is very difficult. If they feel that they are saving lives of innocent civilians, then they may feel that end justifies these means.
That said, I am against this tactic.
kenny blankenship
(15,689 posts)which I wish were going instead to schools + educational grants, bridge + road repair, alternative energy R&D and stuff that could make life better for the 99%, instead of more restricted and fearful for us.
A surveilled population is a terrorized population, and that's why they do it.
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)Marr
(20,317 posts)I've seen several apologists saying they don't support it, but it's okay because a, b, c...
That is supporting it. If you don't support it, then you find it unacceptable. There's no third option, and pretending otherwise is just weasely bullshit.