Fixing the migrant bussing problem?

[Pantagruel]

Can Biden somehow decree the migrants victims and fast track their work papers and citizenship and hearing status? Doubt GOP racist Govs want to do them any favors.

Can CA , MA etc. reciprocate by moving up paroles of convicted criminals in their states in return for the early parolees accepting transport to TX and Fla. ?

Don't get mad, get even!

[pinkstarburst]

1. No one should be "mad" at Texas

Last edited Sat Sep 23, 2023, 09:06 AM - Edit history (1)

for migrant bussing.

Migrants are crossing the border in record, STAGGERING numbers. They are doing this for many reasons, due to terrible economic and political conditions in Venezuela and other places, and they are doing it because the border is not currently secured.

There are two choices.

Either we, as an entire country, decide that we support letting migrants in, or we don't.

If we as democrats decide that our values mean that we support migrants, we have to stop talking out of both sides of our mouths on this issue. It's much easier for people to say "I support migrants, those poor people! I feel sorry for them!" when they aren't showing up in your schools and your backyard.

In 2022, 1.2 MILLION migrants crossed illegally into Texas.
500K crossed into AZ
140 K crossed into NM
250 K crossed into California.

So the mayor of New York can pitch a fit and cry about 100,000 migrants, but Texas has to deal with 12 times that EVERY YEAR. They can't all stay in Texas. There are more coming this year. There will be more coming next year unless there is policy change.

If our democratic values say that we let these people in, every single city and state will have to support them. Every single one. It should not be Greg Abbott sending busses of migrants. Biden should be providing the busses to spread these people out to communities across the nation. Or we should slow the rate they're coming in. But blaming Abbott is silly. It's silly to expect they will stay in Texas where you don't have to look at the problem any more than it is to expect that 2 million migrants a year should have to stay in Vermont or Delaware. This is a national problem. IT needs a national solution.

[Seeking Serenity]

2. Screw that. Texas should be required to keep them and house, feed, etc, them ALL

That'll teach Goppers to be compassionate. Force them to be compassionate. Texas' problem shouldn't be blue states worry.

[ripcord]

3. And here I thought immigration was a national issue

[SickOfTheOnePct]

4. How very NIMBY n/t

[Seeking Serenity]

5. It's not NIMBYism

New York, Illinois, N. California are NOWHERE NEAR the border. Why should migrants crossing the border be sent away to blue states, purely to cause them political headaches, by an illegitimate government in land that rightfully belongs to Mexico anyway?

Remain in Texas

[SickOfTheOnePct]

6. Laughable

On all counts

[Seeking Serenity]

7. So you WANT Texas' problem to become Democratic states' problem?

That doesn't sound like sound policy for WINNING and defeating the Goppers once and for all.

[SickOfTheOnePct]

8. It's not a Texas problem

It’s a national problem.

CA, NY, & IL, among other states, claim to welcome immigrants. So do they or don’t they?

[ripcord]

9. You aren't understanding

It isn't just Texas' problem, it is the nations.

[Seeking Serenity]

10. And the national policy should be

Remain in Texas

[SickOfTheOnePct]

11. Why?

[Seeking Serenity]

12. Because that's where they're coming in

And let this be a political problem for asshat Greg Abbott. Texas is lost to us anyway, so let it suffer

[stuck in the middle]

29. How are our families...

…a “political problem”?

And let this be a political problem for asshat Greg Abbott. Texas is lost to us anyway, so let it suffer

Does your Party want people to suffer?

Is the cruelty the point?

Please tell me about the values of your Party, and why your Party deserves our support?



You want our votes. Let’s see you earn them.

[pinkstarburst]

14. That's where the problem is.

If the national policy is to welcome migrants in (which it currently is due to political and economic unrest in several countries, especially Venezuela), then the entire nation must take them in. It is not appropriate for the nation to say we will let these people in but every last one of them is going to be assigned to live in Massachusetts--our new migrant camp state.

One thing to consider before dumping on Texas also might be that Texas (and other border states) are stressed and frustrated after DECADES of having to deal with border issues and the messes that come with it. 2 million migrants crossed the southern border in 2022. 1.2 million of those crossed through Texas. That's a pretty big headache for Texas. This is something to think about every time someone writes a naive post about "gee, I wonder if Texas will ever turn blue?" while overlooking the fact that the RGV region is solidly ruby red, full of Hispanics who have to deal with these issues that the mayor of NYC just discovered yesterday, day in and day out, and failing to ask why.

[Seeking Serenity]

15. Fine. If Texas is stubbornly refusing to come around to the RIGHT-THINKING side

Then stick it with the bill and the problem and the political unrest.

Maybe then Texans will start to think twice about rejecting becoming a blue state.

[pinkstarburst]

17. Again, immigration is a national issue

Then stick Texas with the bill and the problem and the political unrest.

You do realize that this is what most of the country has been content to do for decades, right? That's why Abbott began bussing migrants out of Texas. Texas has been dealing with the headaches of having 1.2 million migrants per year cross into Texas and being dumped in small border communities by border patrol and left there. Abbott decided it was time for the rest of the country to see how it felt to deal with that for a while.

And sure enough, we're hearing a lot of NIMBYism from blue state mayors. Some democrats, it seems, are very pro-immigration, as long as they never have to see a migrant, or have one in their kid's school, or in their community.

I am no Abbott fan, but in this, he is not wrong. Immigration is a national issue. It is not up to Texas to be "stuck with the bill and the problem and the political unrest" as you put it. If our values say that we let these people in, then every state and community must be willing to receive migrants. 2 million last year. 2 million this year. And 2 million every year after that unless something changes. NIMBYism isn't going to work.

[area51]

18. +1 n/t

[Seeking Serenity]

20. "NIMBYism isn't going to work."

I don't see it as "NIMBYism". I see it as not causing unnecessary hardships for good, solid Democratic leaders. Remember how BAD it looked for Democrats when Martha's Vineyard got all in a twist when 50 or however many it was refugees arrived there?

Why do we want to embarrass Democratic leaders? We have to make Goppers to take 100 percent of the blame and responsibility for this. We don't need videos of Democrats freaking out. It's bad optics!

[SickOfTheOnePct]

21. The hypocrisy is stunning n/t

[Sympthsical]

62. Is it, though?

I feel like it's utterly unsurprising at this point.

[pinkstarburst]

24. It is NIMBYism, plain and simple

I don't see it as "NIMBYism". I see it as not causing unnecessary hardships for good, solid Democratic leaders. Remember how BAD it looked for Democrats when Martha's Vineyard got all in a twist when 50 or however many it was refugees arrived there?

Why do we want to embarrass Democratic leaders? We have to make Goppers to take 100 percent of the blame and responsibility for this. We don't need videos of Democrats freaking out. It's bad optics!

It did look bad when Martha's Vineyard freaked out and called it a crisis when 50 migrants showed up in their community.

Martha's Vineyard has a population of 15,000 people and couldn't handle the idea of 50 migrants showing up in their town.

Now imagine how Eagle Pass, Texas, population 28,000 feels about the fact that 10,000 migrants showed up in their town from Wed-Fri of this week.

If some democrats are embarrassed about the optics, it's because in some cases, the optics are not something to be proud of. Immigration is a national issue. It's a tough problem to solve, it won't be solved overnight, and it will never be solved by saying we support immigration as long as we don't have to see an immigrant, or have one live next door to us, or attend our child's school. Which is what is happening right now in some cases.

[Seeking Serenity]

25. Well, okay, friend

It's gonna a lot of bad images for Democrats looking the opposite of compassionate, and images of the EVIL Party looking sympathetic.

That's not how we WIN! And that is all we should be concerned about at this point -- f***ing WINNING! Total Democratic victory. The complete, unconditional surrender, subjugation, and dissolution of the Anti-Americanist (Gopper) Party to the point where they're a bloody footnote in history like the Whig Party.

No quarter!

[stuck in the middle]

28. You mean...

…to those of us reading your comments here in this thread?

It's gonna a lot of bad images for Democrats looking the opposite of compassionate...

I sure hope that this is not your GOTV shtick.

[Seeking Serenity]

30. I meant that when Mayor Eric Adams is on video saying refugees

Will infinitely harm NYC, while Gov. Kathy Hochul is saying not to spread them around the state (never mind the Martha's Vineyard example I referenced earlier), it doesn't make Democrats look good. Bad images.

[stuck in the middle]

31. Do your attacks...

…on our families here at DU make your Party look good?

[Seeking Serenity]

32. I'm trying to prevent Democrats from being attacked

By having refugees remain in Texas.

[stuck in the middle]

33. You are...

…attacking our families and attempting to demonize them to stoke a civil war within the Democratic Party.

How has my family ever caused you suffering?

[Seeking Serenity]

35. I'm not demonising anyone but Greg Abbott and all Goppers generally

My sincerest sympathies to you and your family because of the crisis the EVIL Party has caused you to suffer.

Honestly.

[stuck in the middle]

36. Do you...

…read your own posts?

[Seeking Serenity]

38. Yes. (?)

[TexasTowelie]

52. Democrats in Texas are already being attacked by the migrant population.

Trespassing, theft, high-speed motor chases, vandalism, etc.

It makes me wonder if it is convenient for you to care about Democrats in Texas.

[ChazII]

65. +1 n/t

[intelpug]

57. Texas Hispanics

For what it's worth, I work with about half a dozen California Hispanics whose folks migrated from Mexico in the early eighties or so, {legally} to California. Now they live in Montana and they have no use whatsoever for the masses of illegal immigrants hitting their former state nor do their parents. These guy's tell me thing's were doing ok until about 17 or so years ago around Long Beach {where they are mostly from} till lot's of illegal immigrants started coming up from central America and working for far less wages than the Mexican Americans would thus causing a lot of turmoil jobwise with them, Believe it or not most of them were trumpers in the last elections.

[stuck in the middle]

67. My wife often rides the bus.

Believe it or not most of them were trumpers in the last elections.

She can quite easily pass as gringa here in Iowa, so long as she doesn’t speak out loud. (Folks just assume she’s from Chicago or something.)

One day, she wads riding the bus and two Mexican men got on and sat in the seat in front of her, and imagining that nobody could understand them, were spouting some racist nonsense.

She just sat there and listened to their conversation, and as she finally got up to get off, said goodbye to them very nicely in Spanish as she exited the bus.

She said that I should have seen the look on their faces.



Racism among Latinos is a real thing, and it shouldn’t really surprise anybody.

There’s a reason why my wife’s ancestors ran away from their masters and set up their own palenque culture centuries ago.

[pinkstarburst]

13. It's not Texas' problem

Immigration is a national issue. If migrants were coming in through a portal in Delaware, it would be no more reasonable to expect 2 million people per year to be fed, housed, educated and cared for solely by the state of Delaware. It doesn't matter where the border happens to be located. If our values say that we are letting these people cross in (and that's what we are doing right now--due to massive political and economic unrest, particularly in Venezuela), then the entire country must be responsible for taking them in.

[Zeitghost]

41. Maybe you could start

With why immigrants are a problem? It seems your bigotry is showing.

[Seeking Serenity]

50. I DON'T have a problem with immigrants. Far from it

I have a problem with images of Democrats in NY, Chicago, MV, etc, some of which declared themselves as "sanctuary cities" during the TFG regime, reacting badly when immigrants are now bussed to their cities. That makes Democrats look hypocritical to people who don't have or won't make the time for a detailed, wonkish explanation of immigration policy writ large.

I'm interested in making the Goppers, NOT Democrats, exclusively own this problem and pay as high a political price as possible.

[Zeitghost]

69. And yet you seem to agree with the Gov. of Texas

In that they are a "problem" you don't want to deal with...

[Seeking Serenity]

70. Wrong. I don't want them used by Goppers to embarrass or target Democrats (n/t)

[Zeitghost]

71. Even if

They want to go to CA and the people in CA welcome them with open arms, you'd rather they not go where they want because it may be used by the GOP to score points. Seems like not the greatest reasoning to me. I'd rather they be happy, successful and welcomed.

[highplainsdem]

39. Do you have ANY idea how bad posts like yours in this thread make Democrats look?

This is a public message board. You're not being read solely by Democrats.

And even if you were, your posts here sound inhumane.

Immigration is a national issue. We need a national policy that works.

And Texas isn't a state of only Republicans who lack compassion. There are a LOT of Democrats there. And not all Republicans lack compassion.

You apparently view immigrants as chattel to be kept in Texas, with no federal assistance, to punish Texas for not voting Democratic.

[TexasTowelie]

51. Rant on.

You might feel differently about the situation if your state had to foot the bill for those migrants.

You might also feel differently if it was your property being trespassed upon or your property was destroyed or stolen. Imagine walking outside to go to work and discover that your vehicle was stolen?

You might also feel differently if you are driving and suddenly get passed by a van of migrants with the police chasing them and you are run off the road by the carelessness of the migrants and the people that transport them to their destination.

I wonder how you would feel if you saw an 18-wheeler stop and 50--60 migrants unloaded in your neighborhood?

All of those situations have happened in South Texas in this decade.

So yeah, screw Texas just because we aren't a blue state--it's because of the suggestion like yours that Texas has remained a red state for the past thirty years and it will make it harder for us to become blue in the future because a lot of Texans subscribe to foolish Us (Texas) vs. Them (everyone else) mentality.

The last time that I checked Texas is still part of the United States which means that our problems are your problems too. Since you believe that this should remain a Texas problem, then perhaps you don't want any gas, oil or agricultural products from Texas either? Perhaps Texas should tell all of the snow birds that visit in the winter in their RVs to stay away if people outside Texas are going to subscribe to the Us vs. Them mentality too? After all, we might need all of that space so we can find somewhere for the migrants to stay.


Texas can't change its geographical position and nobody has suggested a viable solution to the immigrant crisis. While I don't agree with the governor about busing the migrants out of Texas, it is past time for a solution to be found and for the rest of the country to step up to the plate to find a solution or bear their fair share to provide for the immigrants if there are no changes to immigration policy.

[In It to Win It]

26. We can be mad at Abbott for acting like a whiny little *****

I’m not mad at the act of bussing the migrants to other places, but I’m mad at the way he’s going about it.

I think it could have been more of a coordinated effort for the benefit of the migrants as well as the destination cities and states but he’s not trying to coordinate. He’s putting them on a bus and dropping them off unannounced and unprepared.

[pinkstarburst]

34. I agree that the way it's being done

is an absolute disaster, but even in that, I cannot fault Abbott, and do you know why? In the same way that is is not Texas's job to handle immigration for the United States of America, it is not Greg Abbott's job to deal with the 1.2 million migrants who cross every year INTO TEXAS and that the federal government is currently doing nothing about.

So if your argument is that the process is not orderly? Take that up with the Biden administration. They should be providing the busses. They should have those busses lined up in every single border town, organized, coordinated with the major cities across the nation, taking these people out of the border towns the moment the cross and spreading them out to every state in the nation. This is NOT GREG ABBOTT's job. He is only doing it right now because Texas has been shouldering the burden alone for too long and he wanted to make the problem more visible.

So if you have complaints about how the bussing is being done, the person to complain to is not Abbott. Immigration is a NATIONAL issue. Not a Texas issue.

BTW, I am no Greg Abbott fan. I can't stand the guy. But on this one tiny thing, he is not entirely wrong. And most Texans I know feel that he is not entirely wrong for finally making the rest of the country recognize what Texas and other border states have been dealing with alone for years.

[In It to Win It]

42. Several points for me

I'll take them one at a time...

I agree that the way it's being done is an absolute disaster, but even in that, I cannot fault Abbott, and do you know why? In the same way that is is not Texas's job to handle immigration for the United States of America, it is not Greg Abbott's job to deal with the 1.2 million migrants who cross every year INTO TEXAS and that the federal government is currently doing nothing about.

It's not Texas' job to handle immigration, but by putting these people on a bus, he's taking it upon himself to handle it by gathering them and putting them on a bus. If the only goal is just to get them out of the state, there are closer states he could've push them to, which I'm sure would be cheaper for Texas.

If it's not Texas' job, it's not New York's job either. It's not California's job either. It's not the DC mayor's job either. The same applies to all the other states that these buses are going to. He's pawning the problem to other governors, and it seems we've established it's not the problem of other governors of other states either, like it's not for Abbott.

If it's not the job of a governor to deal with the immigration problem (and I agree that it's not), the least he could do is coordinate with other governors because it's not their problem either. Those other governors could very well put the migrants on a bus back to Texas, because it's not their problem. It's the federal government's problem so I guess we wouldn't fault the other governors for sending them back to Texas if they wanted to.

So if your argument is that the process is not orderly? Take that up with the Biden administration. They should be providing the buses. They should have those buses lined up in every single border town, organized, coordinated with the major cities across the nation, taking these people out of the border towns the moment the cross and spreading them out to every state in the nation. This is NOT GREG ABBOTT's job. He is only doing it right now because Texas has been shouldering the burden alone for too long and he wanted to make the problem more visible.

My argument is that the bussing is disorderly because that's by design. My argument is that Abbott didn't want it to be orderly for the receiving states.

As you stated, it's not Abbott's problem. Again, it's also not the problem of the governors of the states these migrants are going to. Therefore, at least, his administration could coordinate with the administrations of other state governors. It's not a problem that Abbott asked for, but it is a problem that he's forced to deal with because he's a governor of a border state. It comes with the territory of being a governor of a border state. Governing is being a grown up and coming to the table with a solution, whether it be permanent or temporary. If the solution means bringing other governors to the table, then be an adult and do that.

Sure, he may have wanted to make the problem more visible. He also wanted to take the opportunity to pick a partisan fight, and that is what I think is his first goal before anything else. I, in no way, believe that if Trump were reelected and were faced with the same border problem that Abbott would have bussed immigrants to other states. He would not have dared to make the border problem look worse than it already is under Trump.

He could have made the problem more visible by not random dumping buses of people with zero coordination with other states, who are in the same position he's in - not tasked with the responsibility of enforcing federal immigration law.

Immigration is a NATIONAL issue. Not a Texas issue.

All the more reason, he should have coordinate with other governors. Abbott is not saying it's a national issue. He's saying immigration is a "Democrat" issue "so all of you blue-state governors should deal with it. Here you go..."

BTW, I am no Greg Abbott fan. I can't stand the guy. But on this one tiny thing, he is not entirely wrong. And most Texans I know feel that he is not entirely wrong for finally making the rest of the country recognize what Texas and other border states have been dealing with alone for years.

And yet he's sending buses to California, another border state. I wonder why... it certainly isn't because he wants California to understand how a border state feels.

I live in Florida. I spent my entire life here in South Florida. It's much harder to get here as opposed to the land border that Texas has. My entire life immigrants have been coming to Florida by the boat loads from many countries. I've been surrounded by people my entire life that share the sentiment of immigrants just showing up on our shores by the boat loads, and they let them stay, and they take our jobs. I literally hear this to this day. I remember it getting really bad that it was on the news every day. Everyday, more boats with more immigrants. I get it to some degree. I'm sure its worse for Texans.

[pinkstarburst]

53. Here are the numbers

In 2022, 2 million migrants illegally crossed the southern border.

1.2 million crossed through Texas.
249K crossed through California

That's a pretty big disparity. California is having to deal with migrants crossing its borders, sure. But Texas is having to deal with FIVE TIMES the number.

And no, it's not fair to say, those 1.2 million people show up every year in your state because you happen to border Mexico, so it's your job as governor to deal with it. Immigration is a national issue. Biden should be either 1) securing the border to slow or manage the number of people coming across or 2) providing the busses to transport people out of Texas immediately when they cross the border and distributing them to all 50 states. Your argument that they should go to a close-by state... why? So New York or Massachusetts doesn't have to deal with the problem? All 50 states should have to receive migrants on a weekly basis if our values say that we support allowing them in.

So if democrats and this administration do not like the methods for the bussing or the organization of it (I as a taxpayer am personally frustrated that my Texan tax dollars have to be used to do this when FEDERAL money should be used to pay for this), then they take over the task for Abbott and organize better bussing themselves. Start sending migrants to every state in the lower 48 and coordinate with those governors to let them know the busses are coming.

Biden won't do this. It would be a PR nightmare if he were responsible for the busses. He would lose votes from independents and moderates who are steamed when migrants begin showing up in their neighborhoods just like democrats in blue cities are steamed about it now. It's NIMBYism, plain and simple. Which is why Biden is perfectly happy to let Abbott take the fall for this one. But as a democrat, I can't entirely fault Abbott on this one. I detest Abbott and all the goons in the Texas government, but in this, they are not entirely wrong. Everyone has abandoned Texas and left us to deal with the mess at the southern border for decades. Abbott making the problem visible and moving these people along to other places so they are not all in Texas is a good thing.

[In It to Win It]

56. You're ignoring the point entirely but okay

Last edited Sun Sep 24, 2023, 11:55 AM - Edit history (1)

In 2022, 2 million migrants illegally crossed the southern border.

1.2 million crossed through Texas.
249K crossed through California

That's a pretty big disparity. California is having to deal with migrants crossing its borders, sure. But Texas is having to deal with FIVE TIMES the number.

My point to you is not about the disparity because every state receives less immigrants from the Southern border than Texas. EVERY state has a disparity, but he’s not sending them to every state.

My point is that in the same way you say it’s not Texas’ job, it’s also not California’s job. You keep saying it’s a national issue, but he’s not making it a national issue. He’s making an issue for a handful of states, not every state in the lower 48 if it was such a national issue.

He’s making it an issue for other state governments. Therefore, as I’ve mentioned, the least he could do in coordinate with other state governments.

It’s not California’s job to take in immigration from Texas plus deal with an influx of immigrants of their own. It’s not the same amount, but we’re not going to act like 249K is a small amount of people to deal with and therefore California has no understanding of an influx.

Instead of sending buses to a state that is not on the Southern border and has not received an influx of people yet, he chooses to send buses to a state that also receives an influx of their own because of partisanship. There are plenty of other states in the lower 48 that haven’t received a bus of people to chose from because it’s such a national issue. Yet, he chooses a border state that received nearly 250K people of their power own rather than plenty of other states that haven’t received a bus yet.

And no, it's not fair to say, those 1.2 million people show up every year in your state because you happen to border Mexico, so it's your job as governor to deal with it. Immigration is a national issue.

Except you must be misinterpreting me because I didn’t say that.

I said it comes with the territory of being governor of a state on the southern border. I even agreed with you that it’s not his job.

It’s not his job but it comes with the territory of being governor. What I’m saying is that the circumstances make it so that he has to be the one to deal with it. It’s unfair to Abbott but this problem is at his doorstep and he’s finding himself having to deal with it. Much like the governor of Florida has to deal with hurricanes. States don’t really have capacity to deal with these things but the circumstances forces them to confront it. It comes with the territory.

I as a taxpayer am personally frustrated that my Texan tax dollars have to be used to do this when FEDERAL money should be used to pay for this

Then it sounds like you should tell Abbott to stop using your using your tax dollars to do it. He chose take on the responsibility to do it. I agree that Texas should receive federal funds for immigration influxes. I think all southern border states should. It’s already been reported that reported that he’s using federal funds for Operation Lone Star.

I’m not a state governor, clearly. If I was, I would be willing to work with Abbott in taking some of the migrants. The thing is that he has to be willing to work with me, rather than just put these people on a bus and drop them off randomly. The key words there are “work with me.” If I was a state governor and Abbott refused to work with me, I’d have no problem spending more tax dollars to put them on a bus back to Texas because it’s not my problem.

[pinkstarburst]

59. And this is the problem

The key words there are “work with me.” If I was a state governor and Abbott refused to work with me, I’d have no problem spending more tax dollars to put them on a bus back to Texas because it’s not my problem.

So let's say for argument's sake that Abbott called up Eric Adams today and said, "Hey, I've got 500 migrants headed your way on busses. Just wanted to let you know. They'll be there in two days so you can have resources ready..." what do you think Adams' response would be? Or that of any mayor or governor? Do you think they are going to say, "Thanks, Greg, for the phone call! We'll get things organized and be ready for them!" Or do you think they are going to be pissy, start bitching that there is no more room for any more migrants, that they have taken in ENOUGH PEOPLE, that NYC has no more room, that they can't take any more, and that he should send them some place else?

I can guess how that conversation would go.

The thing of it is, Greg Abbott doesn't get a warning phone call before 1.2 million migrants show up on his doorstep. No one asks his permission if it's okay. No one asks if he's okay if they show up in Texas.

So if you're arguing that as long as Abbott picks up the phone and says "They're coming, FYI" he's done his due diligence and no governor or mayor has the right to complain or turn migrants away or whine that they already have too many people (spoiler alert: Texas has LOTS of migrants here already too!) then fine. But if those phone calls are going to involve a lot of whining and "I don't want those people, send them to someone else" then I still think the appropriate person to be coordinating that is someone in the federal government--like don't we have someone overseeing the southern border?

[In It to Win It]

63. You can guess how that conversation would go

but that's all you can do is guess, because he didn't try.

He didn't want to try. That's what makes it a ridiculous political stunt.

When California and Washington needs help with their wildfires, they ask for it.
When Florida and other gulf coast states needs help with its hurricanes and floods, they ask for it. When these same states need help with search and rescues and evacuations for these events, they ask for it.
When midwest states needs help with their tornadoes, they ask for it.

In these scenarios, they ask the federal government and they ask other states. The states will provide assistance if they're able. Other states will spare some National Guard troops if they can; spare some firefighters if they can; and whatever else if they can.

Many states, both red and blue, set up programs for resettling Ukrainian refugees, and something similar could be set up for Venezuelan asylum-seekers (assuming these are mostly Venezuelans) to help relieve Texas of a good chunk of them. Abbott is a fairly prominent politician, and if he had tried some amount of diplomacy rather than the partisan tit-for-tat he was looking for, he might have found some political allies. He wasn't looking for allies. He was looking for a fight.

Maybe, I'm naive but I have to think that politicians want the job because they believe they can solve problems for the good of their state and perhaps the country.

If he actually tried to be an effective politician, they might have assisted Abbott to whatever degree they could have. We'll never know though because he didn't want to. He wanted to grab headlines and talk shit to score political points.

The thing of it is, Greg Abbott doesn't get a warning phone call before 1.2 million migrants show up on his doorstep. No one asks his permission if it's okay. No one asks if he's okay if they show up in Texas.

This is supposed to justify him making it the problem of other state governors? Just because no one asked him, that means Abbott should perpetuate that onto other state governors? As I've said before, it's not their problem.

I'm sure Abbott would pout and complain if New York took a problem that was specific to NY and just shipped it to Texas. If they were wanting to be petty, they could have easily put them back on a bus to Texas... but these migrants were dropped on their doorstep and they're not shipping them to another state, like they could have done. They chose not to forcefully push the problem onto other governors, even ones they hate.

I still think the appropriate person to be coordinating that is someone in the federal government--like don't we have someone overseeing the southern border?

There is but we also have asylum laws that are pretty generous that only Congress could change. I'm not limiting the blame to the current immigration spike, but all of the past spikes as well. I believe the appropriate entity that is to blame here is Congress. I think the immigration problem is symptom of the dysfunction in Congress. Our entire immigration system, from top to bottom, is completely inadequate to handle today's problem, and for many reasons, Congress does nothing to address it. A president can only kick the can to the next president, but Congress can reconfigure the system entirely.

[DemocraticPatriot]

47. Greg Abbott ought to be schmeared underneath the wheels of a bus...

I am 'not entirely wrong'....

[treestar]

40. they pass through Texas

unless that is where they have family. The "poor me" from the southern states is a big lie. There is nothing state governments have to do for them, either.

[DemocraticPatriot]

45. I think you are quite right that Democrats across the country should be

prepared to accept these migrants into our communities... in a share equally divided with the rest of the country---
if we intend to stand up for our values. OK...


However, you have been misreprenting the issue, regarding Abbott and DeSantis "busing migrants" into the north.

The problem with that, from the Democratic standpoint, has NEVER been that the immigrants were bussed into the North,
but the way that it was done....

Many migrants were transported into Massachusetts for instance, in the dead of winter, with no notice, and nowhere to go, and dropped off in the dead of winter on the street, in the middle of a very cold night...

Many of them should have stayed where they were, because they had federal cases pending about their status, and when they were moved away, may have inadvertently degraded their legal status....

Many of them got on the bus because they were promised jobs and homes at their destinations---

(which was a complete and total LIE by DeSantis/Abbott because no such arrangement had been made)...



Being Democrats and people that care about people, the northern states would likely have been more than willing to talk about it, if these southern states had offered any communication about the matter--

but they did not. They only shoved migrants onto buses and shipped them north, without caring what would happen to them.

It has been nothing but a right-wing political stunt, and you are vehemently supporting it here. So, WTF ???

The Democratic objection to all this, has been that it is a 'human rights' issue, and that the Republicans have been treating these people as if they were cattle....



(you seem to be very much in love with Greg Abbott--- I think perhaps you are posting on the wrong site...?)


(( and as far as the state government of TEXAS goes------ I am personally in favor of KICKING THEM OUT of the Union!
Forget this 'secession' bullshit--- their government does not deserve to be a part of this nation,
so we ought to KICK them out of the country, first! (sorry Texas Democrats) ))


Well, President/General Ulysses S. Grant once said something to the effect that 'the war against Mexico was the most unjust war which was ever fought'... since we gained so much territory from that war, starting with Texas, perhaps it is time to give it BACK!


The Texas Republicunts who control the state can negotiate with Mexico over the results.... Good Luck!

[intelpug]

58. War against Mexico

Umm, just a little historical correction. The Mexican American war Grant was referring to was not responsible for Texas being part of the U S , That came about from the Texas revolution some year's earlier when the residents of Texas rebelled against the government of Santa Anna.

[Sympthsical]

60. People like to say they are pro-immigrant

Right on up to the moment they appear in their neighborhoods.

Then that shit is on.

See: Well, *gestures all around*

[Freethinker65]

16. Process immigrants faster.

Relocate immigrants to areas where they already have support (existing family, sponsorship by non-profit, etc.). If highly skilled, relocate to an area where those skills are needed. Relocate unskilled immigrants to areas with affordable housing that have jobs (I travelled the "grey roads" off of major interstates recently on a road trip through small towns having a hard time finding workers to fill positions). Once a work history is established, it will be easier for immigrants to take that history and move somewhere else if they desire.
I fully support immigration, but those seeking to immigrate should understand their immediate residence placement destination will be where there is housing and jobs and that might not be in a big major city or State they had planned on.

[dalton99a]

19. It is not a Texas-Mexico border. It is a U.S.-Mexico border. In fact, the border is federal property

[Pantagruel]

22. A good start?

Biden Lets Venezuelan Migrants Work
The administration had been hesitant to pursue this approach.
By Ronald Brownstein
September 21, 2023

...

Yesterday, the Department of Homeland Security extended legal protections under a federal program called Temporary Protected Status (TPS) that will allow as many as 472,000 migrants from Venezuela to live and work legally in the United States for at least the next 18 months.

Despite the panoramic pressure from across the Democratic coalition, the administration had been hesitant to pursue this approach. Inside the administration, as Greg Sargent of The Washington Post first reported, some feared that providing legal protection to more Venezuelans already here would simply encourage others from the country to come. With polls showing widespread disapproval of Biden’s handling of border security, and Republicans rallying behind an array of hard-line immigration policies, the president has also appeared deeply uncomfortable focusing any attention on these issues.

But immigrant advocates watching the internal debate believe that the argument tipped because of changing conditions on the ground. The tide of migrants into Democratic-run cities has produced wrenching scenes of new arrivals sleeping in streets, homeless shelters, or police stations, and loud complaints about the impact on local budgets, especially from New York City Mayor Eric Adams. And that has created a situation where not acting to relieve the strain on these cities has become an even a greater political risk to Biden than acting.

“No matter what, Republicans will accuse the administration of being for open borders,” Maria Cardona, a Democratic strategist working with immigrant-advocacy groups, told me. “That is going to happen anyway. So why not get the political benefit of a good policy that so many of our leaders are clamoring for and need for their cities?”

[Mad_Machine76]

23. Fixing the migrant problem

Depends on all states working together with the Federal Government to tackle the issue and figure out a good way to handle the issue, not busing migrants all around the country with no coordination or plan just to score political points. Democrats have time and time attempted to address the issue while Republicans refuse to lift a finger and want to throw migrants right back over the border or punish them severely if not kill them for the “crime” of trying to enter our country without proper processing and politicize the issue. Until there is full cooperation I just don’t know what we should do. I don’t think Republicans want to solve the issue bc like with Abortion they crassly just use it for votes every election. Or they fear trying to do anything bc they’re afraid they’ll be accused of supporting “amnesty” and be primaried.

[In It to Win It]

43. +1000000000000000000

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[stuck in the middle]

27. Geeze! What a Train Wreck of a Thread!

[Zeitghost]

37. You can't move people who don't want to go

I've asked before, why is this a problem?

The immigrants want to go to CA, etc. Those places have public policies and programs welcoming immigrants into their diverse societies and seem to want them to come and help fill critical jobs and add to the pumping economies that need workers. Seems like a win win.

I understand that the reason for bussing them out is rooted in ignorant Texas/Florida racism. But the results seem to be all positive.

[DemocraticPatriot]

46. "the results seem to be all positive."......

Have you checked with these immigrants, whether they have food to eat, or a decent place to sleep,
or JOBS ???



Abbott and DeSantis LIED to many of these people to get them onto the buses, about what awaited them at their destinations....

"Food, Home, JOBS...."


Yes, the immigrants are certainly better off in California, or any other blue state---

but their welfare was certainly not one of the concerns of those who loaded them onto the buses---
(and if they really gave half a shit, they would have informed the destinations that these people were being transported to them..)


"You can't move people who don't want to go"

If you had nowhere to go, and someone promised you food and a home and a job,
would you 'want to go'? These people were SWINDLED.

[Zeitghost]

68. Are they better off in CA/NY or not?

The immigrants are happier and have more/better opportunities. The people in NY/CA/"Blue States" are more welcoming and accepting of them and need them to fill better jobs than they would get elsewhere in their booming economies.

So again, what exactly is the problem? How were they swindled if they ended up somewhere they would rather be with better outcomes among people who value them?

[KentuckyWoman]

44. The bussing is not the problem.

Inhumane treatment is a problem. The volume of people at the southern border is staggering. There is absolutely no way border towns can provide any sort of humane living conditions once people are approved to stay, pending their court dates.

Moving people around the country ... voluntarily ... is a good thing for immigrants and for the US. We need a better system for doing so. Currently we are allowing Abbott to just dump people out on the street. Like trash. That is appalling.

[DemocraticPatriot]

48. Yes, "inhumane treatment is a problem"... or rather, THE PROBLEM

These people are not moving around the country "voluntarily"---
when they have been LIED TO, and no arrangements made for their sustenance at the destination....

Republicans like Greg Abbot and Ron DeSantis have absolutely no interest in the welfare of these people---

They are only committing a political stunt and trying to embarrass the Democratic party in the north.

The Democratic party in the north would appreciate as little as a phone call,
before their fascist buses dump immigrants in the street in the dead of winter,
before any preparations for their welfare could have been made
(since we didn't even know that they were being sent here, right??)

[KentuckyWoman]

49. The federal government

Needs to take control of making sure migrants have a plan before being released. Where are they going. How will they get there. Food. Shelter. Education. Access to medical care. This is a national shame that Abbott even has the opportunity to do it.

My humble opinion.

[pinkstarburst]

54. Whose responsibility is this?

I agree the way it's being done is terrible. Whose responsibility is this? Why is it Abbott's responsibility to manage the bussing for the 1.2 million migrants who cross the Texas border every year?

Immigration is a national issue.

Abbott should not be the one forced to send the busses. This should not be dumped on Texas border towns of 28,000 people where 10,000 migrants show up in 3 days (Eagle Pass, Texas.) How is a town that small supposed to provide services or support or even food and water to that volume of people when 10,000 people show up in three days? Martha's Vineyard called it a humanitarian crisis when 50 migrants showed up and got rid of them within 24 hours. Their population is 15,000 people.

The Biden administration should be organizing the busses. They should have an immigration czar coordinating those phone calls to the mayors and governors that you want. They should have busses at all the border crossing checkpoints and those busses should go to all 48 states. Migrants should be spread out and given temporary guest worker permits, at a minimum. Let them do some of the minimum wage jobs we've been having trouble filling. But this should be done on the federal level, not something where border states are once again burdened. Border states are already burdened enough by our position at the border.

This won't happen because it is a PR nightmare. If Biden were to be responsible for the busses, he would lose votes in November from every voter who hated that migrants showed up in their town. So he's happy to leave Abbott holding the bag on that one. I am not happy with the way bussing is being done in terms of people being just dropped off. But I also don't think it's fair to just leave them in border states. Where is the national solution coming from the administration? Why is the anger once again directed at Texas, rather than expecting national leaders to lead?

[snowybirdie]

55. I really don't

believe its a good thing to use human beings as pawns. But we should let those here and bussed to large cities be able to work and build lives here instead of being housed and fed indefinitely.

[stuck in the middle]

61. Treating people..

…as means rather treating them as ends.

[Torchlight]

64. I hold with great conviction the problem are imaginary red and black lines on map

taking priority over actual human beings. A primal desire by humans that for so long we've accepted and codified into law we tend to perceive borders as a physical reality.

When I hear the derision of (for one of many examples) imaginary religions confining so many to methods of thought and action, I ofen giggle to myself a little bit, thinking that most of our daily decisions are predicated on what is wholly imaginary, and in effect confine ourselves to methods of thought and actions are also wholly based on the imaginary.

[Polybius]

66. Or stop them from coming here

If that's even possible. Nothing is working, they keep on coming.