General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsAre you ready to put the Trump presidency behind us and move forward once Biden takes office?
Or do you want to exact some sort of political revenge for the damage he has done to our country?
How important is it that the new President try to heal this nation and put the division behind us?
Are the problems too great to continue investigations of the present Administration?
Would this be a losing political issue for the new President?
Nevilledog
(51,006 posts)I don't think ignoring the criminality will be healing for anyone. Exposing the corruption will hopefully make trumpers open their eyes. If there aren't investigations they will continue to think trump did no wrong.
brush
(53,741 posts)Let the chips fall where they may on the likes of Kushner, Navarro et al.
TheBlackAdder
(28,167 posts)Walleye
(30,978 posts)I do want to see the worst offenders prosecuted
JHB
(37,154 posts)It'll all happen again, likely under someone who isn't as incompetent as Trump.
Walleye
(30,978 posts)grumpyduck
(6,222 posts)moving the country forward and doing some "healing," and leave the DOJ and others to focus on investigations and prosecutions.
And I would LOVE to see the MSM keep their fucking asses out of it. Of course we know it won't happen.
kentuck
(111,052 posts)The President should not be that involved in any criminal investigations, but his Justice Dept and the FBI should be on it like a dog on a bone. They should do it in a quiet but thorough manner. When the evidence is uncovered, the people of this country need to be informed, in my opinion.
gordianot
(15,233 posts)This should never happen again. I do not care if it is Democratic, Republican or Independent there needs to be consequences. The President is not a Unitary Executive.
Turbineguy
(37,291 posts)Kaiser Wilhelm II was sent to live out the rest of his life in comfort at a nice little chateau in the Netherlands.
Baby Doc Duvalier ended his days in the south of France.
These people rarely get what they have coming.
I expect this will be no different. You don't get the revenge you want, you get the revenge you get.
WA-03 Democrat
(3,037 posts)Google how Mussolini died
SoonerPride
(12,286 posts)....with some heads.
But I may not be in the majority opinion.
unitedwethrive
(1,997 posts)It is very important that a thorough examination of all the illegalities committed by the Trump administration is undertaken. We need to 1) send a clear message that no one is above the law, and prosecute as many people as is necessary and 2) fix the loopholes that allowed them to seize more power than they should have given our system of government.
We also need to do a deep dive into all of his court appointees and scour their testimony for falsehoods, which would be grounds for impeachment.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Also to uncover whatever other crimes are in their histories, and use those as grounds.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)Azathoth
(4,607 posts)It did nothing to heal the country and instead emboldened the radical GOP. Biden will not be able to placate anyone who didn't vote for him. That's just the state of the country now. Trolling them the way Trump trolls Dems is unnecessary, but attempting to cater to them is a fool's errand.
And besides, if there are no repercussions or consequences for the unprecedented things Trump has done, we might as well just admit that the president is a fixed-term king.
soothsayer
(38,601 posts)Give him a little rope and hell hang you
matt819
(10,749 posts)Accountability.
Investigations that lead, where necessary, to prosecutions, is the only way we (hopefully) repeat what has transpired. Republican perpetrators have no shame. They will move on, get their Fox or AEI sinecures, and then resurface during the next campaign, and the next, and the next. They need to be held accountable, and be seen to be held accountable. From Trump to the guy committing crimes against humanity by forcibly sterilizing women in concentration camps. From Barr to the unidentified troops beating protesters. From Azar to the toadies in CDC and NIH that modified reports to meet political goals. Etc., etc.
kentuck
(111,052 posts)..with the other side, and he may decide to not pursue anything?
shanti
(21,675 posts)Kamala will make him see the light.
crickets
(25,952 posts)There will be those who will call it a partisan witch hunt (likely congruent with the same ones going after Hunter Biden right now) but never mind. It's imperative that the level of criminal behavior we've endured throughout the last administration not be allowed to stand unchallenged or unpunished.
Tanuki
(14,914 posts)and our way of life should be investigated and if (ha!) laws were broken, the perpetrators should be held to account. If people end up in jail, so be it. They knew they were breaking the law and thought they were powerful enough to get away with it. They, and others who would try to emulate them in the future, need to learn otherwise
Jeebo
(2,021 posts)The "political revenge" you referenced will not be appropriate, but it will be appropriate to hold these corrupt government officials accountable for their misdeeds. ALL of them.
There will be an immediate need, of course, to get the plague under control, to do whatever is necessary to rein it in. The hospitals, doctors, nurses, all the medical people and other important front-line people.
And then to fix the economy and help the people who are out of work, the small businesses that have been essentially killed by the plague, to address all the economic woes that have been visited upon our country and our people. To get businesses and schools and other organizations and components of our infrastructure kick-started and running again.
And then -- this is VERY important -- there need to be numerous legislative fixes to the deficiencies that orange con man and his corrupt administration have exposed in our system. To plug the holes, so to speak. There needs to be legislation strengthening the laws about subpoenas of government officials, particularly where oversight of one branch by another one is concerned. I would like to see laws passed that REQUIRE witness testimony and evidence in ANY impeachment trial. I would like to see laws that FORBID anybody ever again from getting away with the kind of obstructionism the turtle has been practicing in the Senate. Fixing the filibuster rules in the Senate would be an enabling step toward solving that problem. We need legislation protecting the right to vote. We need to outlaw gerrymandering. (How about a constitutional amendment requiring that congressional districts be drawn using perfectly straight north-south or east-west lines, or existing state, county or city borders?)
There are a million legislative things we can do to fix these kinds of problems, so that somebody like the orange con man and the turtle can NEVER AGAIN get away with doing the kinds of things they've been doing for the past four years. I wouldn't want a Democratic president to be able to do things like that, either. Although the Democrats would never nominate somebody like that.
-- Ron
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)This is not optional. Trump and his cronies must suffer serious consequences, both as an example, and to keep them out of commission for a long time.
Miguelito Loveless
(4,454 posts)it would be a MONSTROUS failure to "put the Trump presidency behind us".
His appointees and sympathizers must be rooted out and replaced. His crimes and the crimes of the GOP must be punished. Formally "traditional norms" must be established in LAW to prevent future Trumps.
The US government MUSt be de-Nazified.
beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)Nazis. Rid the police, the military and govt. period.
forgotmylogin
(7,520 posts)If the Herd-Mentality squad would just pack up quietly and leave and stop ruining the country and lives of the American people, I'll mark that as a victory.
Fullduplexxx
(7,844 posts)beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)unpunished by obama for war crimes and Middle East destruction. Fuck that shit. We are TALKING JUSTICE.
The first thing Biden must see to is a select committee to investigate crimes and treason committed by trump and all people in the trump administration. Fuck thus healing bullshit.
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)fishwax
(29,148 posts)Given that, I think political accountability will hopefully follow.
Solly Mack
(90,758 posts)Revenge is about being vindictive. It's a cycle that keeps going and going - You get me/I get you/I get you again/You get me again. And so and so on. That's not justice.
Justice is about vindication. Someone breaks the law, you prove it, they get what they deserve - and only what they deserve under the law. Justice must be fair to be true justice. Justice can be had for both social and legal breaches.
It's not political to hold a criminal, who also happens to be a politician, accountable for their crimes. The mingling of the two IS political (the bullshit "criminalizing politics" ) and is done so as a distraction from the crimes committed by the criminal, who just happens to hold public office.
Some criminals seek public office to expand on their crimes. Criminals can be elected to office. Simply because someone is an elected official does not change the nature of their crimes. Their crimes are still crimes. This self-defeating idea that those in public office are somehow above it all, or too special to be held to the same the standards as all other citizens is, in my opinion, the result of some weak-minded brainwashing to place elected officials above the rest of "the people". Something elected officials much prefer to the people seeing them for what they actually might be and treating them for what their crimes say they are - nothing more than common thugs.
kentuck
(111,052 posts)Much better than I said it.
Solly Mack
(90,758 posts)Thanks!
Skraxx
(2,967 posts)Hoyt
(54,770 posts)hang a jury hearing what will be seen as political charges for anything trump did in office.
We need to move on with healthcare, CV19, education, BLM, etc.
Hugin
(33,047 posts)I think we should at least pull the handle and flush.
Hugin
(33,047 posts)Demsrule86
(68,456 posts)We need to send help to the people.
kentuck
(111,052 posts)..to win the election in 2016?
Do we really want to sweep that under the rug and "move forward"?
uponit7771
(90,301 posts)... Nixon politically and look where it got us?
There will be ***NO*** peace without justice. It's not "revenge" to seek justice and prosecute the stupid to the nth degree at minimum for deterrent.
lpbk2713
(42,736 posts)They didn't screw the USA by accident.
meadowlander
(4,388 posts)justice served, and every last Trump croney extracted like ticks from the corridors of power.
These people tore babies away from their mothers and couldn't be bothered to keep track of how to ever reunite them. They sided with the profiteers while Covid tore through American cities killing 200,000 people. They covered up Russian election interference and did nothing about Russian bounties on US soldiers heads.
We owe those victims a full accounting and the Democratic party will not survive as a moral institution if it does not even try to provide it.
kacekwl
(7,013 posts)totodeinhere
(13,056 posts)Last edited Thu Sep 17, 2020, 11:08 PM - Edit history (1)
to the federal bench and they all have lifetime tenure. And the Republicans will almost certainly have enough votes in the Senate to block any impeachment convictions.
Crunchy Frog
(26,578 posts)thoroughly investigate everything that has happened during his regime.
It's critically important that our nation know and understand what happened, and begin putting safeguards in place so that it hopefully can't happen again.
We can't just pretend it never happened.
JI7
(89,240 posts)Zing Zing Zingbah
(6,496 posts)Revenge isn't going to help the country and I think it could make things worse. Definitely, we should have new laws to prevent presidents like Trump in the future though.
kacekwl
(7,013 posts)want all the criminals in his administration and especially trump and his family of criminals prosecuted and punished for their many crimes. That will put it behind us plus will make me very happy after years of sadness.
totodeinhere
(13,056 posts)But if he is elected I will leave it to the Biden Justice Department to decide how to proceed.
lame54
(35,262 posts)To prevent them from murdering again?
Squinch
(50,911 posts)marlakay
(11,425 posts)If you let them get away with something next time they will do it again and worse.
This is not revenge it's political discipline, everyone needs to know that if you hold your hands to the fire you will get burned.
DinahMoeHum
(21,774 posts)This is not question of "justice". This is not even a question of "vengeance"
It's about P-U-N-I-S-H-M-E-N-T
I want to see PUNISHMENT for Trump, his family, his associates, and every single stinking GOoPer senator and congressman who aided and abetted them.
If that does not happen, then we damned well better not act shocked, shocked when some folks decide to enact punishment themselves, in their own way.
I'm sorry, but this has to happen so that we, the American people, resolve among ourselves to see to it that our nation never ever goes down this path again in our lifetimes.
JHB
(37,154 posts)...investigations of many people and actions on a wide front, up to and including Trump, McConnell, and other senior Republicans, possibly extending to his judicial picks.
Both Clinton and Obama tried strategies of what Obama called "look forward, not back" and the fruits of that deference to previous administrations were the Iraq War and its fallout, heedless embrace of the housing bubble amplifying the 2008 crash, years upon years of unyielding obstruction, and finally Trump's full-blown, self-delivered American Carnage.
But no, I don't want them investigated as some sort of "political revenge" (though I won't exactly be sorry to see some elephant people in orange jumpsuits), but because the political rot that allowed them to do what they did needs to be cleared out and repaired.
Because that is a present problem, every bit as much restoring our ability to deal with the pandemic, repairing our reputation abroad, undoing as much of Trump's damage as possible, and all the other immediate concerns. It may take a longer timescale than some of the other things (because there are sooooo many things to investigate, and likely prosecute) but it is absolutely essential that it be done. It's about getting a metaphorical disease under control every bit as much as a literal one for COVID.
kentuck
(111,052 posts)...perhaps I should not have used "political revenge", when justice and truth for the American people may have been a better way of putting it?
But it did assist in the conversation, I think?
brooklynite
(94,333 posts)On the other hand, I'm still not convinced that a crime has been committed by Trump or his aides that will result in jail time.
aidbo
(2,328 posts)Looking forward, not backward got us here in the first place. If justice is not sought after in a Biden administration then what is even the point?
kentuck
(111,052 posts)Justice must be a foundation stone for a democracy.
Skittles
(153,113 posts)enough with this LET'S JUST MOVE FORWARD nonsense, that's how Dubya's crimes were excused. PROSECUTE THESE CRIMINALS.
RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)Every. Last. One.
I want their fucking kids taken from them. I want Ivanka screaming "Do you know who I am????" as she is dragged away.
Autumn
(44,980 posts)Political revenge has nothing to do with it. Fuck healing, I will never heal and I don't want to be united with those fuckers. I want justice.
Rice4VP
(1,235 posts)His sycophants will jump ship because they have nothing to gain at that point. The media needs to do a total blackout and his Twitter account needs to be suspended. Im only interested in seeing him go on trial and go to prison for mass murder
pecosbob
(7,533 posts)This is why things are so off the hook...no one is ever held accountable. We have a "President" urging Americans to shoot other Americans over political ideology because no one has ever slapped them down properly.
JonLP24
(29,322 posts)Trump did and said things Bush would never dare.
bluecollar2
(3,622 posts)Comes up every time...
"It's time to work together...time to heal....yadda, yadda, yadda..."
Fuck that...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DpojL_35QlSI&ved=2ahUKEwjGz5-ynfHrAhUouVkKHYM-DO0Qo7QBMAB6BAgBEAE&usg=AOvVaw2XpteBQfO9UUgePxjAcg-l
nolabear
(41,932 posts)Were exhausted by sensationalized rage. I used to see people in therapy who wouldnt let go in the emotional sense. They were as captive as if they were in love. I appreciate seeking justice. I hope that monster is prosecuted quietly, imprisoned without the snarky celebration that triggers his sheep into rage that makes him feel like a victim and not a caught thiefand thats all he is. A thief. Hes stolen our countrys heart and crushed it for four years, those who love him as much as those who hate him. We need to take it all back.