If Lincoln Project REALLY wants to bring down trump, why don't they run someone against him???

[BamaRefugee]

Siphoning off votes, especially swing states, would be FAR more effective than some videos.
They don't even need to get on every state's ballots, just the important ones.
And this goes for ALL so-called "never trumpers".

Convince me I'm wrong.

[empedocles]

1. Less credibility?

[TheBlackAdder]

38. Gary Johnson took 3X more votes away from Trump than Jill Stein did from Hillary Clinton

.

Johnson / Weld Libertarian 4,489,341 3.28%
Stein / Baraka Green 1,457,218 1.07%

.

[RandySF]

2. Could potentially siphon off Biden as well.

[Baked Potato]

3. Trump needs to crash and burn from the American People rejecting him.

Not because of some phony baloney stooge propped up by Internet Barkers.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

4. Easy. The answer is that they want Republicans to vote for Biden.

If an anti-Trump GOPer were on the ballot some Republicans might vote for him instead of Biden, potentially giving a few swing states to Trump. The Lincoln Project understands that the only way to get rid of Trump is to elect Biden by an unhackable, uncheatable margin.

[Thekaspervote]

7. This!!

[flibbitygiblets]

16. Yup.

[stopdiggin]

17. And -- if I might add,

they are looking to explicitly tie Republican politicians (and party) to Trump. Not deflect. (and thus the ads against R senatorial races) They want Democratic control of both houses -- and the Republican party to learn a big lesson in a crushing defeat in 2020. The intent is to rescue the party by first burning it down.

(And -- as further bonus -- another Democratic administration responsible for digging us out of the toxic mess left behind by a Republican. Never forget -- these guys are thinking ahead.)

[OnDoutside]

18. Exactly. It's disappointing that quite a lot of people here don't understand

this simple concept. It ain't rocket science.

[Budi]

23. Yes, they prefer Joe Biden.

K & R
💙

[Proud Liberal Dem]

5. Nope

Could siphon off votes from Biden. As it stands now, Never Trumpers are likely going to give Biden their votes. Having multiple candidates is part of why we're in the mess we are in now.

[enough]

6. Great way to give NeverTrumpers somebody to vote for besides Biden. NT

[AJT]

8. It would siphon off moderate republicans, like my brother,

from Biden.

[Ms. Toad]

9. Do you really want the Lincoln Project running ads against Biden?

If they succeed in dethroning Trump as the Republican nominee, they will turn in Biden in a heartbeat.

[BamaRefugee]

12. They still run their ads, but also put up someone WORSE than trump to siphon off the hater/racist

voters from the orange anal wart, not someone ,more "electable".
They don't ever have to make an ad FOR the guy, just get someone on the ballot who straight up uses the absolute worst language and appeals directly to their darkest fears, NO DOG WHISTLES

[OnDoutside]

19. Here, watch this interview with Rick Wilson, which explains much

about where they are coming from.

[muriel_volestrangler]

50. To put up someone worse than Trump (if you can find them) would destroy their credibility

Their strategy is clear: get moderates to vote for Biden, and Democrats in the Senate, and to make as many potential Republican voters say "no, I'm a moderate too, and therefore I'm for Biden and the Democrats". If they openly supported David Duke or similar, or could in any way be tied to that candidate, they'd be reviled, disowned, and assumed to be bad actors.

[backscatter712]

20. I think that we're getting something out of this tactical alliance.

Obviously, they're damned effective, and since they're GOP, they're more credible with swing voters than if we did that from our end. Besides, isn't it fun to see the nastiest campaign tactics - the memeing, the attack ads, the Willie-Horton/Swiftboat attacks go against a deserving target for a change? And the fact that they're going out of their way to personally troll Trump makes for endless fun!

But of course, you're right. In the long run, we need our own Lincoln Project, and we should be prepared for all the stuff that has us eating popcorn now to be turned against us after the election's over.

[awesomerwb1]

10. Republicans would vote R

if the devil himself ran as a republican. Not sure it wouldn't hurt Joe Biden more.

Plus, to make their case they would have to attack Biden as well. Those people (Lincoln Project)are smart and they're pros. They know how to attack. For that reason, I advise everyone not to fall in love with them or like them too much because in a couple years, they may be attacking Dems.

[chia]

11. They are running someone against him. Biden.

[LiberalFighter]

13. How would they do that?

The primaries are nearly over. And if they hold their national convention the delegates attending are not likely to vote for anyone but Trump. In all likelihood the rules for the GOP allow the campaign to approve or refuse anyone running as a delegate to the national convention to represent them.

[chia]

14. Lincoln Project ad for Biden:

[Demsrule86]

15. I disagree.

The ads are very effective.

[melman]

21. I'd tell you the answer

But I can't. This group of Republican operatives apparently enjoy a protected status here. Strange times.

[Budi]

24. Naa. Sounds more like some are just miffed that LP is moving their base to Biden's Dem side

I'd rather have LP running ads against Trump than Biden & our Democatic House & Senate.

Whose not on board with that?

[betsuni]

26. DU is for those who want to elect Democrats. LP wants to elect the Democratic nominee

in this year's election. What's the problem?

[OnDoutside]

28. Don't forget some ideologues wanted to take Biden down with the Tara Reade non-story.

[Cha]

37. That's right.. that didn't work out so well for them since

she's a Proven Liar. in the collective face.

[betsuni]

44. That was despicable. I'll never forget any of it.

[sheshe2]

29. Really?

LP is actually doing something to help Democrats win. These ads are hard hitting and doing damage to trump.

You had no problem with our 'Big Tent' when another candidate wanted to focus on wooing republicans. Confusing to say the least, them and not LP who is actually doing something.

[Cha]

39. Oh wow.. that's right. Again there's a word for that.. What was that's guy's name..

oh yeah "joe rogan".. that was some "embracing".

Mahalo, she!

[sheshe2]

43. Yep.

We had to wine them and dine them. Some candle light and a romantic fire to get them in our tent...those rust states. As far as I know LP asked nothing of us. They offered freely. Are they Republicans? Ya they are, yet they have free of charge made ads that are destroying trump, no coercion necessary.

Thank you, Cha!

[Cha]

45. Precisely, she.. TLP came on their own because they want trump GONE.. this is an Excellent sample..

of their work..

Link to tweet

[sheshe2]

46. Credit to the LP.

The image of two traitors/dictators sitting on a flag draped coffin is heartbreaking, Cha.

[George II]

47. Reminds me of that old John Cameron Swayze Timex commercial from years ago:

"It takes a Licking and Keeps On Ticking"

[Drunken Irishman]

30. lol what a cop out.

Please enlighten us with your wisdom as to why it would make sense for the Lincoln Project to put up a more acceptable Republican in an election where those Republican voters are either likely to sit out or vote for Joe Biden?

You want to know what cost Hillary wins in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Michigan? Those Never Trumper Republicans voted for Gary Johnson - not Hillary or Trump.

The Lincoln Project recognized this and decided that the only way to beat Trump was by forcing the Never Trumpers to VOTE for Joe Biden - not vote third party.

[sheshe2]

33. +1000

[George II]

42. Bazinga!

[la-trucker]

51. Winning is the key word

We want to win with every available vote for Biden. This is not the time for ideological purity.

[melman]

52. The key word is Denver

[la-trucker]

55. Winning for Democrats is universally desired

Not just Denver, we want to win in Pheonix, Frankfort, Raleigh, Austin, Augusta, Helena, Atlanta, Des Moines and Jackson as well.

Let's help Biden win and give him a blue senate! Like I said .. "winning" is the key word.

[melman]

56. But you told me it was Denver

[la-trucker]

60. Interesting

[melman]

64. You're telling me!

[George II]

66. Who on DU would NOT consider winning by/for Democrats as "universally desired".

[la-trucker]

67. Astonishing isn't it?

Winning is not a key word for some!

[George II]

69. The population of the US is 330 million, population of Denver only 600,000.

[George II]

58. I hope we learned almost 4 years ago what damage can be done in the name of purity.

[la-trucker]

61. Such a simple concept

but so hard for some to grasp.

[muriel_volestrangler]

53. So are you also saying the Lincoln Project should be running a far right nutjob?

See #12. That's what the thread starter thinks would be a good move. I think it's ridiculous. Can you tell us the answer to that?

[George II]

57. That's what it looks like, from the OP and person you responded to. That would defeat the purpose..

...of their ad campaign.

Like many of us here, the Lincoln Project wants to beat trump. I'm fine with that.

People forget that the US was allies with the Soviet Union in the effort to defeat Germany and Hitler. That was job #1. Of course there were after effects, but had we not been allied with the Soviet Union Hitler would have won, and that would have been so much worse.

[BamaRefugee]

62. This. I voted for the first time in 1970. I can tell you from DECADES of experience, NEVER trust a

Republican about ANYTHING.
The hero status here on DU of certain Republicans who will do everything in their power to shred us as soon as things "normalize" is incredible.

[la-trucker]

68. There is no hero status

Politics has always made strange bedfellows, temporary alliances and fleeting camaraderie.

LP wants to defeat Trump. We want to defeat Trump. Nothing wrong in welcoming it till November 3rd.

Let's not fight over the lunch and dinner menus before we have even cooked breakfast.

[Xolodno]

22. What everyone else mentioned....

...they basically want to burn the barn down and start fresh.

But there is also another pertinent reason. The RNC and GOP basically shut down the primary process to make sure Trump ran unopposed within. Kasich or Jeb could have easily jumped in and gave Trump a run for his money (hey, that's how we got Reagan, he lost to Ford, but set himself up once Ford lost)...but, the powers that be, made sure that would never happen. I think they will seriously regret that decision.

[Budi]

25. This. Yes.

[JI7]

34. There is no way Jeb or Kasich would have beat Trump in a Primary this year

[Xolodno]

35. And there was no way Reagan was going to beat Ford.

That's not what its about. Dole challenged Bush Sr. because he rightfully predicted he would be a one term President. After Bush Sr. lost, he quickly became the nominee in the next election. But in the end, couldn't seal the deal.

And with Reagan, once Ford was out, he did have a bit of a fight in the primary, but it only solidified him and ran circles around Bush Sr. And of course, we know the outcome.

Primarying an opponent is not about winning, its about exposing how weak the incumbent is and bringing them down. Then setting yourself up for the next election. The GOP had to know there was a real possibility that Trump would go down. But they buried their heads in the sand and hoped the economy, no major disaster, etc. would happen. Now, they have virtually no one lined up for 2024. Hence why the Lincoln Project wants to burn it all down. Common sense intra-politics has been thrown out the door. That being, you know your incumbent is a dead man walking...but can't abandon him. So you start setting the chess board for the next election.

[JI7]

36. Things are different now. Back then we had more moderate Republicans

and conservative Democrats.

today the Republican party base is mostly white hetero xtians who are resentful of anyone who isn't them.

Romney is only popular among mormon republicans. There is no way Romney or kasich(who didn't vote for trump) will win the nomination in today's republican party which is mostly supportive of trump.

this is why that crazy qanon woman beat that right wing republican in some congressional primary. The party is mostly appealing to an extremist type.

Trump is already a fucked up mess. Exposing more of his bs won't change anyone's minds. His supporters will only change if they are personally affected but even them their hatred may lead them to such m such m stick with him.

[Xolodno]

40. Hence the Lincoln Project.

They want to burn it all down, all of it. And all the enablers in Congress, etc. to send a message. Even if you survive the blood letting, your days are still numbered.

They want to retake the party and start with a clean slate. The TEA Party shenanigans, successful at first, but eventually set them into losing spiral. The base can no longer be hard right Xtians or racists. They'll take their votes, not their candidates.

[JI7]

41. im fine with that. ther country would be far better without a major party

that appeals to bigotry.

[BamaRefugee]

63. Agree. They are actually setting the stage to get another George Bush elected.

[W_HAMILTON]

27. Trump can't win a two-person race...

...therefore, why the hell do people want more and more people to enter into the race to beat him? It's not necessary to win and it only hurts our side (see: 2016).

[George II]

31. I don't think they want to take any chances. They want trump to lose, and the only one....

...who can beat him is Biden.

If they put up a candidate to run against him it would have to be an independent since there wouldn't have been any primaries in which a republican could run.

A three way general election is a crap shoot, and they could take away enough Democratic and/or Biden votes for trump to sneak in.

[JI7]

32. Because they support and want Biden and other Democrats to win

becsuse Democrats winning is how your bring down Trump.

[grantcart]

48. They are. They are helping run Joe Biden.

Running against Trump in the Republican primary is a fool's errand. They are not fools.


Their primary target is not Republicans but Independents, especially Republican leaning independents.

[chia]

49. Did anyone convince you yet?

[BamaRefugee]

65. Not really. Lots of conventional thinking, unfortunately similar to the kind of thinking I saw when

Carter was running for re-election, when Dukakis ran, when Gore ran, when Kerry ran, when Ms. Clinton ran.

We DON'T NEED millions and millions of people to cross over and vote for Biden, we need several hundred thousand in maybe 5 states to NOT vote for trump. But those people, when it comes right down to it, are gonna hold their nose and vote trump instead of EVER voting for a Democrat. Seconds before they enter their vote, years and years of brainwashing will kick in, and visions of gays performing abortions while simultaneously grabbing guns will dance through their heads, and they'll vote trump.

Thus, my feeling that to get Biden elected, the real strategy is to get those voters, not people who are leaning toward Biden, but hard core trumpers who are beginning to see him for what he is, but they want SOMEBODY EVEN MORE HEINOUS. So put up a candidate who is worse than trump, there are LOTS of RWNJ who will vote for that person in a heartbeat.
Lincoln Project doesn't have to have their name on the candidate at all, just funding and strong ads that appeal to the absolute worst instincts of many 'Muricans.

[brooklynite]

54. Because this is more cost-effective

Running an independent candidate costs huge amounts of money and consumes a lot of staff time to get onto State ballots.

[JonLP24]

59. They are irrelevant in their own party so they try to influence ours