Do you sometimes feel like you have to win the lottery just to have a decent life?

[JanMichael]

Especially in retirement years? Or even able to retire at all?

Once private defined benefit pensions (hell even Sears had it) were looted and made obsolete by a slew of raiders (I.e. evil people) the average working person has Social Security and maybe some savings or some 401k left over. Around 10% are in state or local government pension plans that includes teachers, law enforcement, fire departments, city and state and other government (regional gov, some PHA's, and authorities like water or airports), and federal employees.

This is discouraging:

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/survey-finds-42-americans-retire-100701878.html

"When asked to estimate how much money they had in retirement savings, close to half of all respondents — 45% — claimed they had no money put aside for retirement, while 19% said they’ll retire with less than $10,000 to their name. If these trends hold, that means 64% of all Americans will essentially retire broke. Twenty percent will retire with anywhere from $10,000 to $100,000. As for the remainder, well, let’s just say they have more wiggle room with their retirement savings."

The move to make everyone a day trader to fund life has been a colossal mistake. GameStop be damned.

Personally we are in the 10% of workers with defined benefit pensions. With some planning and minor other investments we will not HAVE to win lotto to live modestly comfortably in our old age. Fingers crossed and lotto ticket bought.

It galls me that more than 50% of us though will live on limited Social Security and maybe some 401k leftover crumbs.

Pensions and healthcare should follow people (PEOPLE) not employers. Free up options for people when it comes to moving and jobs. A person can be literally "stuck" in jobs because they are in a certain state pension system and covered health insurance.

Nonprofits should be able to participate in the same systems as local governments do. So should private employers and employees.

Example - vested after 5 years; the more years you work in the system, and your age at retirement, plus the average of the highest four years, equals your annual retirement. Get 20 0r 30 years and you are golden pony boy. Usually about 50 to 60% of your current working salary or pay.

But if you leave this job and go to another state (or to a private job or nonprofit) that doesn't have a reciprocal agreement (usually a neighboring state) you stop accruing time in the better system. You may retire at 65 and get $100-500 a month but that could have been doubled or quadrupled.

Merge them and grow them. Biden may have hit on something regarding credit companies that could help move this along. Stop letting private algorithms dictate your ability to get a job, buy or rent a house, car, school , etcetera.

Just because someone works retail or on commission should not deprive them of portable decent and comprehensive healthcare and defined benefit pensions. Merge those.

I should add that it does help to just spend less in life's activities but it would be nice if all people had the psychological security associated with financial security. And the ability to take jobs in other places/states/fields and not lose your time towards defined retirement income in a better system.

Still spend a little on lotto though.

[captain queeg]

1. It really is a bad situation for most.

I’m in that 10% that gets a pension check. It’s less than SS but between the two I’m ok. Provided of course my health doesn’t go south. I’d always lived pretty frugally, not that I saved much by my standards of living is low enough to keep living pretty much like I had been. I’d planned on working a couple more years, a whole lot of people end up retiring sooner than they wanted, usually due to health or losing a long time job and being unable to find another. I know there are lots of people that wish they could retire but just can’t afford it. My sister has some European friends that came to the US to visit. I guess something they all noticed were how many older people were still in the workforce. Other advanced countries take care of their elders.

[JanMichael]

3. That taking care of elders has to have a system buy-in.

We don't do that in the US. We say good luck and god bless. Which is worth its weight in dogcrap.

When I lived for a short while in the EU in the 90's I was dumbstruck by what I considered working class people taking 12 week summer vacations in Spain or Portugal. Many have small second vacation homes too. That warped me permanently. The comments my foreign friends made about US poverty and weak social net also was cringeworthy.

People that have, and can, worked their adult lives should be able to retire and chill (or not). I wish everyone had that option. Sadly in the US it is coming close to 10% (that doesn't include the top 1 and 5 % in wealth that do not rely on monthly pensions and SS) that can live in peace and relative security in their old age.

I am an older X'er and for us it will be much worse than the main Boomer cohort and the WWII generation in retirement. Since I'm in a system it should be manageable but for most everyone else...sheesh. Hopefully a good percentage will inherit a house or condo.

Fried Green Tomatoes style resting homes cost too much now.

[Grasswire2]

12. I have been advocating for social security credits for stay-at-home caregivers of family.

Work is work.

Child care and elder care and home care are work.

Why do those who must leave the work force to do family care not earn SS work credits for those years?

It's so discriminatory!

[flying rabbit]

2. K&R nt

[Corgigal]

4. I think my husband and I are Ok.

I’m more worried about our kids, who don’t seem to be too worried about it. Ah, the young, they never can imagine what getting older is like.

[JanMichael]

6. I graduated HS in the mid-80's...we saw US long term jobs starting to die.

I remember people saying "don't rely on a company pension" "don't rely on Social Security" and so on.

So I went to college (graduated rapidly with a BA in 6 years!) and smoked pot and drank through the early 90's. Worked shitty jobs and didn't really care about anything.

Got lucky in 2001 with a tech job in a small town. I think when I was young I did care but I didn't know what to do about it. Some friends went to work for places like Publix which was great back then or became paramedics etcetera. I was rudderless.

Your kids are how old? If they are in their 20's they will see things that will blow our minds in 50 years. I guess I'd be in my 80's and hopefully stoned.

They will be fine.

[Corgigal]

8. Thank you.

Yes they are in their 20s. I want them to try to get a federal or state job. It’s my husband state pension that allows us to live well. I thought federal pensions were better until I saw Trump trying to tinker with them,
They are all doing their own thing, all able to eat, but I want to pass from this world believing they will be ok. It’s just a mom thing. Got life insurance on me for all of them to get a little something.
America can be such a cruel country.

[Mr.Bill]

5. There needs to be an increase

and I mean a big increase in Social Security payments. How do we pay for that? Three ways:

1. Raise the amount deducted from paychecks. We did this in the 80s and we all survived it. It's time to do it again.

2. Raise or even remove the cap on income that is taxed for Social Security.

3. And this one is my favorite. Tax the living shit out of people who have so much money that they wouldn't even notice if you took half of it.

[Initech]

7. I will have to admit that I have saved a lot of money in quarantine.

And this is in a year in which I purchased a new vehicle, a new laptop, and upgraded my desktop. But as much as I like having money, I would like it even more if I could go places and do things with it!

[JanMichael]

9. Well I hate to agree but yes we have saved a stupid amount during COVID.

We used to go out to restaurant/bars at least once a week. Way less gas spent on work travel. No real vacations.

So yes savings have increased but we were not on the edge financially to start with. This a is boredom boom IMHO.

I doubt the majority of households have made enough of a COVID savings windfall to fund 20 or 40 years of stoner retirement though.

[Sympthsical]

10. This is a much poorer country than people think

I'm incredibly fortunate. I'm in a dual-income, no kids relationship, and both our careers are completely COVID proof. So, while so many others have been devolving into misery and poverty, we have deep and serious discussions like, "Should we buy a piano?"

But I grew up dirt poor. I have a lot of friends and family hit by this pandemic. I know what financial insecurity feels like. Just this week, a friend's job is about to go under due to lockdown. The owner has held on as long as she could. She's giving out. His hours were already trimmed to the bone, and he burned through a lot of his savings. He called me worried about rent, this or that. You could hear the panic in his voice. And I told him, "You're not ever going to be on the street. So I want that weight off your shoulders. Don't think about that." We have empty rooms. It's not a question.

But just that insecurity. I'm shuddering just thinking about it. I remember not eating for three, four days at a time because I was just trying to keep the lights on. Our social safety net just isn't what it should be. Our COVID relief has just not met any livable standard.

No one in my friends or family is going without on our watch. We bring food over to nieces and nephews twice a week so their single mom who's a nurse isn't worrying about any of that shit. I send my elderly mom things over Amazon, because I don't want her going to stores during the pandemic.

Some of us are fortunate. Many of us are not. My credo: If you can do something, you have to do something. My conscience is the closest thing to God I have, and at the end of the day, I have to answer to it.

[Kaleva]

11. I'm about 3k above the federal poverty level and I do fine

[JanMichael]

14. Good. I said reducing costs can help.

That said there is income and their is wealth/services. There are plenty of people that get SS or SSI and have a house they live in low cost (paid off over the years, inherited, relative, nonprofit). Or they have a Housing Choice Voucher (formerly Section 8) or live in a USDA project based apartment. Or they live in a 'Key" unit. Or they get LIHEAP annually. Etcetera.

So one can be a few bucks over the poverty line:

https://aspe.hhs.gov/poverty-guidelines

And be "fine".

I guess geography, health, debt and "needs", are all relative when it comes to being "fine".

[Kaleva]

16. It is relative.

My two homes are paid for and I live in a region with low property taxes plus I get back about 40% of what I pay on property tax on my main home from the state because I'm low income.

Plus, I can get by without a vehicle. Others in my income bracket cannot so they would have that added expense.

[moondust]

13. I'm so old...

I remember when well-paying manufacturing jobs were almost like a safety net. You didn't need much education to do them so if you couldn't find a job you really wanted to do you could always fall back on manufacturing and still make a good living.

Then came Reagan and unbridled greed/neoliberalism, globalization, and offshoring jobs--basically predatory capitalism--and that manufacturing "safety net" of good-paying jobs with pensions and union protections began to slip away.

I'm guessing that Trump's cult would be much smaller and less radical today if those manufacturing jobs were still around allowing MAGAts to make a good living even if not particularly smart or well educated.

[liberal_mama]

15. I do think about that a lot

[MichMan]

17. I'm planning on retirement in a few months

Last edited Sun Feb 14, 2021, 06:39 PM - Edit history (1)

We are middle class, but our 401k has done very well over the years. Put aside around 6% a pay, so it wasn't a huge amount; had a company match much of the time, but not all. Just left it alone for 30 years and fortunately, never had to touch it.

Like many people, I bounced around in a few different jobs, so the 401k was much better suited for retirement than defined benefit pensions would have been. A few jobs I worked at less than 5 years, so being able to roll over a 401k was beneficial in my situation.

I wouldn't like having to turn down better jobs & being stuck in a job I hated just because I had too many years already invested in a pension at one employer. Looking forward to retirement as I have been disliking my job the last year or so.