HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Time for a mini-thread on...

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 06:35 AM

Time for a mini-thread on police unions, because it is both tricky and very high stakes.




Collective bargaining is a powerful way to prevent against profiteering and to protect workers. Its a long-standing cornerstone of progressive politics.

In '09 membership of public sector unions surpassed membership of private sector unions, as manufacturing and farming shrunk.

But police unions have some unique characteristics. I've been learning from the very good folks at Campaign Zero (https://joincampaignzero.org) and want to amplify some findings here.



Jurisdictions where there are police unions result in 40% more violent misconduct. https://static1.squarespace.com/static/55ad38b1e4b0185f0285195f/t/5d92b749ad13ae3d9b293125/1569896278868/Sheriffs+Unions+Misconduct.pdf

Cities with police union contracts are 50% less likely to sustain excessive force complaints. https://bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/ccpuf.pdf

This is data on cops who were *re-hired after being fired*, by region, typically after arbitration and appeal, supported by the union.


There is some cognitive dissonance for me, because I believe in collective bargaining.

But when it comes to public safety, and when the employer is *the people*, direct, transparent accountability must take precedence. And it currently isn't. By design.

Collective bargaining in police unions has become very sophisticated. And it isn't just about wages, but about insulating officers from accountability -- across the board.

These data confirm that at very granular detail. I encourage you to read all of these papers.

Finally, there is a bill on the House floor that I want to call attention to: well-intended, but will serve to strengthen the influences above, and is counterproductive to its intended end. Call your congressperson, ask them to reconsider:

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/1154

9 replies, 478 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread

Response to octoberlib (Original post)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 06:37 AM

1. They are like a gang or something. There has to be standards for sure

They purposely avoid hiring people who should do that type of work and it's like you have to be kind of shitty to get hired.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JI7 (Reply #1)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 06:40 AM

2. I think they are a BIG part of the problem.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to octoberlib (Original post)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 06:57 AM

3. I've already contacted

My Senators and Rep, Governor and Assembly Members -

They need to carry liability insurance so IF they are a *bad apple* the settlement is paid by their insurance company - not the community.

It needs to be a licensed profession.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JustAnotherGen (Reply #3)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 07:08 AM

4. Good idea! I live in Charlotte and am not pleased with their rehiring rate of

fired officers. One of the Ferguson officers was fired with pages of misconduct complaints and strolled on over to Ferguson and got rehired. The bad apples never leave until somebody dies and it gets enough press attention.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to octoberlib (Original post)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 07:43 AM

5. police union contracts prohibits the drug testing of police officers, in what way does that

serve the public safety?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to beachbumbob (Reply #5)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 08:00 AM

6. I didn't know that. Absolutely ridiculous. Hell, drug testing should be mandatory.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to octoberlib (Reply #6)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 12:08 PM

8. more likely than not in union contracts and if testing is allowed, its not done regularly and often

exclude steroids which causes a lot of physical and mental issues

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to octoberlib (Original post)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 08:11 AM

7. In my experience

officers are rehired when the PTB either
1) do not follow the procedures laid out in the CBA (it is a binding contract between both parties and neither one can ignore it under the name of expediency).
2) do not afford the person in question due process (many times driven by ignoring #1).

Like it or not, union represented police officers are afforded the same rights any one else has.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to melm00se (Reply #7)

Tue Jun 2, 2020, 12:10 PM

9. union contracts with police are no way as limiting as say employment contracts

the problem is enforcement and to tell you the truth, public officials really don't want to take on the cops for obvious reasons

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread