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Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:16 PM

DU Exclusive: Interview with Dr. Bandy X. Lee !

Recently, I had a conversation with DU community member “Mike 03” about Yale Professor Bandy X. Lee's book, “The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump.” Originally published in 2017, this important book featured the contributions of 27 psychiatrists and mental health experts. Last year, an updated and expanded version was published, which features contributions of 37 psychiatrists and mental health experts.

When my daughter Chloe gave me my copy of the book, she said that while she knew I did not want to have any books on Donald Trump in my library, she believed that this one was essential reading. From the moment I read the book's dedication – to Dr. Lee's Grandfather and Mother – I knew that I'd have difficulty putting the book down. And while I have since added a few other books that expose the madness of the Trump presidency to my library, I recognize “The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump” to be by far the most important.

During my conversation with Mike 03, , I decided toask Dr. Lee if she might take part in an interview for this forum. For if you want something important done, ask a busy person. They are most likely to do important things. I would like to thank Dr. Lee ….for the book, her appearances in the media to discuss the topic, and for this interview. I hope that community members will thank her, and read and discuss her book.



Q: Dr. Lee, as you would expect, there are people who feel depressed and discouraged about the process and outcome of the Senate’s impeachment trial. They are anxious about our country’s future. Others recognize that while the House impeachment was a significant victory, that the president is now more likely to engage in dangerous ways. In that context, can you please explain the “duty to warn” that has resulted in your speaking out?

A: It is entirely understandable that people are feeling depressed and discouraged; that he is more likely to engage dangerously is correct from our perspective, also.  The error, from our view, has been in trying to solve a mental health problem through a purely political approach, which is why we petitioned the Congress to consult with us (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-mental-state-impeachment-psychiatrist-petition-congress-a9232386.html).  We had cautioned that impeachment could go either way: psychologically, delaying impeachment was risky, because it would cause a sense of unlimited power and impunity to balloon.  A rapid progression after delay then maximized the potential for paranoia and narcissistic rage, while the combination of impeachment and acquittal now has created conditions that would heighten the drive for revenge.  With each failure to contain the president psychologically, there has been an expansion of dangers as well as worsening of symptoms.  We can learn from this experience and recognize that a nuanced, psychological understanding of the situation is paramount—even if political processes are the only interventions we have for psychological limit setting and containment, which are still a lot.


Q: In 1973, Erich Fromm published “The Anatomy of Human Destructiveness.” In it, Fromm detailed how certain social factors, combined with specific personality types found in those in power at the time, create fertile ground for what he referred to as “malignant narcissists” to rise to the top. Do you see instances – saying, putting children in steel cages on the southern border – in our society that concern you?

A: Traumatizing children in a way that will breed injury and violence for society concerns me a great deal!  Erich Fromm understood dynamically what I have been studying statistically and epidemiologically.  I have always conceived of this presidency as a reflection of the poor state of collective mental health in our society.  In fact, I have been fearing this result for about twenty years while watching public mental health decline and what I call “structural violence” increase.  Structural violence, such as economic inequality, is one of the most potent causes of behavioral violence, be it homicides, suicides, or warfare, and when the groundwork is laid for a culture of violence, people will be attracted to a leader who does them violence.  It was not time to be complacent because homicide rates were declining, even as suicides were rising.  My research has been mostly about “connecting the dots,” which I am making great use of now.  We have become locked in a vicious circle, where the more violence powerful people do to the population, the more vulnerable it becomes to manipulation and attraction to violence in ways that give violent people more power.  It is an abusive relationship cycle at societal scale.



Q: Older people such as myself remember the publisher and an editor of “Fact” being sued for a story that questioned Senator Barry Goldwater’s stability during the 1964 presidential election. This was in spite of the Senator’s wife telling reporters that he had previously suffered a “nervous breakdown.” The “Goldwater Rule” kept this general topic from being reported upon for many years. There are potential dangers in diagnosing someone the clinician has not met. This raises a question: is it possible that what an expert sees in the media, including films of speeches and press conferences, and legal documents, might be more accurate sources of information than the self-reporting of those being evaluated with the Hare Checklist? (This is not to suggest that Senator Goldwater was in that group.)

A:This is absolutely correct.  We must distinguish the quality and reliability of information, not just discount all media as a source.  For certain impairments, such as personality disorders that cause others suffering but are not bothersome to the self, it is far more accurate to have reports from the person’s acquaintances, the sworn testimony of close associates, and external, direct observation of behavior.  If the media presentation is not all staged but shows reasonably candid moments, actual interactions with other people, extensive coverage, and progression over prolonged periods of time, then it can be one of the best sources of information.  Interviews, on the other hand, are known to be harmful in some cases, especially when a person is trying to present oneself in the best light and hiding important information.  The most dangerous individuals are charming or manipulative, and even the most seasoned clinicians are fooled in a one-hour interview.
“The Goldwater rule” is problematic on many fronts: it should have been invalid since 1980, when our diagnostic system changed from reliance on introspection to observation of external behavior.  It also treats the public figure like a patient, when our responsibility is to actual patients and to society, not to public figures we are not treating.  Finally, currently it has no exceptions, which means it is the only rule in medicine where danger—an emergency—exception does not apply.  This means you must violate the core tenets of medical ethics, and the humanitarian goals that all health professionals pledge to, in order to keep with this one “rule”.



Q: Do those people who are malignant narcissists, psychopaths, or sociopaths ever have periods of psychosis when under extreme pressure?

A: Psychosis is defined as detachment from reality, and since malignant narcissism, psychopathy, and sociopathy can be seen as defects in coping mechanisms, extreme pressure will make them more prone to psychotic spirals.  For example, extreme narcissism can lead one to have such difficulty coping with normal human limitations, that one must create an alternative reality where one is superhuman, an expert in all fields, and even heaven-sent.  Psychopathy or sociopathy can lead one to believe one is “the walking dead” to help explain the hollowness one feels inside.



Q: Do those referenced in prior question have the capacity for insights on how others view them? Are they capable of experiencing self-doubt or guilty feelings?

A: Insight and empathy are often what individuals with these disorders are missing.  Because they have not developmentally gone beyond the stage of distinguishing between “me” and “not me,” other people are merely extensions of themselves or instruments to use for their purposes.  They experience self-doubt or guilty feelings through projection: in other words, they perceive the anxiety they feel inside—such as doubt, confusion, and fear—as danger coming from the outside.  Unfortunately, attempts to escape or to defeat that feeling translates into attack perceived enemies or, if they are lacking, to seek scapegoats.


Q: If such a person were to be found “not guilty” in a trial for a crime they definitely committed, are they more likely to engage in other anti-social behaviors in the future?

A: Absolutely.  Because they are lacking in self-control, if the control does not come from the outside, they will keep pushing their limits.  Setting firm boundaries of behavior, and consistently returning with immediate and commensurate consequences for behavior that violates those boundaries, is one of the most important ways to deal with such defects.  Trying to elicit remorse, insight, or understanding about one’s behavior will not work.  Trying to get them to understand objective laws or rules of fairness will not work, either, for everything will be predicated around the self and whether it benefits or pleases the self.



Q: It was reported that some of the contributors to “The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump” were scheduled to meet with elected officials in Washington, DC. When Democratic floor manager Adam Schiff spoke during the impeachment trial, he summed the president’s personality up quite well. Do you think elected officials fully recognize the threat the president poses?

A: We directly met with groups of lawmakers in December 2017 and January 2018, and they were already “fully on board,” as they told us then.  In fact, they showed great concern, and many of them stated that the president’s access to nuclear weapons was of particular concern.  Whereas we were looking to lawmakers for a solution, astonishingly, they seemed to be looking to us!  Mostly Democrats, they said they could not do anything without being the majority party, while Republicans either would not express how they truly felt or would refuse to meet with us (even though their concerns seemed to be well-known behind the scenes).  The lawmakers encouraged us to continue educating the public, for, if public opinion shifted, then they could act.

When we went to the media, however—and the media were extremely responsive at the time—the American Psychiatric Association stepped with press releases and articles, stating we were being unethical and practicing “armchair psychiatry,” using psychiatry as a “political tool” for “self-aggrandizing purposes.”  It even mobilized the New York Times to state that psychiatrists need not be heard from, and, after this, press inquiries dried up instantly and almost permanently.  Thus, by the time the Democrats had the majority in the House, the topic could no longer even be spoken about, and our situation was worse than before.  Our book, however, was distributed by citizen groups to all members of the Senate and a substantial portion of the House.  When members of the public approach lawmakers about the book, most say they have at least heard about it, if not read and have avidly recommended it to colleagues.



Q: On MSNBC’s “The 11th Hour with Brian Williams, Columbia University’s John McWhorter told a story about Trump that he leaned from a reliable source. As a teen, Trump hung a small child out of a window by his ankles, and enjoyed the child’s suffering. Would such behaviors add to or reinforce your thoughts about him?

A: It is not a surprising anecdote, and consistent with the story of throwing rocks at an infant neighbor when he was a child, and punching a music teacher in the face while in primary school.  Those with psychopathic or sociopathic tendencies enjoy others’ suffering, as they envy others for having something that they lack.  The human ability to sense others’ feelings, to care about one another, and to do things that help rather than harm others, is something they do not have.  Everyone has this, no matter one’s background, personality quirks, or lifestyle—unless one is a psychopath or a sociopath—and this exclusion from the communion of human beings can be very painful.  Instead of facing this inner feeling, they transfer the pain onto others, which manifests as cruelty and pleasure at others’ suffering.



Q: In 2019, the updated edition of “The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump” was released, with insights from 37 psychiatrists and mental health experts. Has the year that followed changed your mind on the threat he poses?

A: Not at all.  As expected, the psychological dangers we saw translated into social, cultural, political, and global dangers through the office of the presidency.  He followed exactly the course we predicted, on the timeline we estimated.  Not only that, we have gotten so good at predicting his actions, we sent in a letter of warning to the Congress (https://dangerouscase.org/urgent-letter-to-congress/) three days before he withdrew troops from northern Syria and caused the massacre of our Kurdish allies.  We sent in another warning about an impeachment proceeding without guardrails
(https://dangerouscase.org/petition-to-the-judiciary-committee/), and one month later there was the assassination of Qassim Soleimani of Iran.  We warned of the continued need to contain the psychological dangers (https://dangerouscase.org/urgent-communication-to-congress/), and now the president is on a revenge spree against those who lawfully testified against him and pardoning criminals while declaring himself the law of the land.  Because someone with his condition grows worse in a position of power, no matter what—whether you give into his pressures for more power or try to restrict him does not matter—we have not seen the worst yet.



Q: For those who are feeling depressed and anxious about current events, do you have any suggestions?

I have often said that “the Resistance” is like the immune system of the body: we must replenish ourselves, know our target, and keep healthy!  We should take mental hygiene seriously and practice it regularly.  It may sound strange, but this means setting boundaries to protect our personal and leisurely lives.  Far from being selfish or complacent, doing the things we enjoy and giving time to our loved ones are all a part of responsible action.  Allot in advance a reasonable time for the fight, and do not go beyond it.  When in it, use the time intelligently and creatively—and this includes listening to the mental health experts!  What is exhausting to others is what mental health professionals deal with on a daily basis, and we ourselves protect our mental health through boundaries while treating the sickest individuals!  Correctly understanding what is happening is most of the battle, and there are proven techniques for managing the difficult behavior we see.  Even if some methods cannot be applied to a president, the principles still apply, and there are lots of things that the public can do.  In fact, if only one recognized that true power rests with the people, and the posturing and bullying are actually façades—or fake power, like the Wizard of Oz—the people could achieve a great deal!

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Arrow 108 replies Author Time Post
Reply DU Exclusive: Interview with Dr. Bandy X. Lee ! (Original post)
H2O Man Feb 2020 OP
malaise Feb 2020 #1
H2O Man Feb 2020 #2
malaise Feb 2020 #4
H2O Man Feb 2020 #8
elleng Feb 2020 #3
H2O Man Feb 2020 #9
elleng Feb 2020 #19
H2O Man Feb 2020 #21
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #5
H2O Man Feb 2020 #14
panader0 Feb 2020 #6
H2O Man Feb 2020 #17
panader0 Feb 2020 #26
NBachers Feb 2020 #7
H2O Man Feb 2020 #20
kentuck Feb 2020 #10
H2O Man Feb 2020 #23
Hortensis Feb 2020 #11
malaise Feb 2020 #13
Hortensis Feb 2020 #18
H2O Man Feb 2020 #25
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #12
malaise Feb 2020 #15
H2O Man Feb 2020 #33
malaise Feb 2020 #52
H2O Man Feb 2020 #88
malaise Feb 2020 #89
H2O Man Feb 2020 #91
H2O Man Feb 2020 #32
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #84
klook Feb 2020 #16
H2O Man Feb 2020 #34
PETRUS Feb 2020 #22
H2O Man Feb 2020 #35
PETRUS Feb 2020 #43
H2O Man Feb 2020 #90
PETRUS Feb 2020 #94
H2O Man Feb 2020 #102
soldierant Feb 2020 #49
PETRUS Feb 2020 #54
soldierant Feb 2020 #64
smirkymonkey Feb 2020 #24
H2O Man Feb 2020 #36
malaise Feb 2020 #27
H2O Man Feb 2020 #37
malaise Feb 2020 #44
canetoad Feb 2020 #28
H2O Man Feb 2020 #38
Me. Feb 2020 #29
H2O Man Feb 2020 #39
democrank Feb 2020 #30
H2O Man Feb 2020 #40
Progressive2020 Feb 2020 #31
H2O Man Feb 2020 #41
warmfeet Feb 2020 #42
H2O Man Feb 2020 #46
JDC Feb 2020 #45
H2O Man Feb 2020 #47
burrowowl Feb 2020 #74
Joinfortmill Feb 2020 #48
H2O Man Feb 2020 #50
coeur_de_lion Feb 2020 #51
H2O Man Feb 2020 #55
coeur_de_lion Feb 2020 #57
H2O Man Feb 2020 #59
coeur_de_lion Feb 2020 #68
H2O Man Feb 2020 #69
Docreed2003 Feb 2020 #53
H2O Man Feb 2020 #56
chowder66 Feb 2020 #58
H2O Man Feb 2020 #61
chowder66 Feb 2020 #71
H2O Man Feb 2020 #72
chowder66 Feb 2020 #73
icymist Feb 2020 #60
H2O Man Feb 2020 #63
icymist Feb 2020 #65
H2O Man Feb 2020 #98
5X Feb 2020 #62
H2O Man Feb 2020 #66
mercuryblues Feb 2020 #67
H2O Man Feb 2020 #70
shanti Feb 2020 #75
H2O Man Feb 2020 #77
dawg day Feb 2020 #76
H2O Man Feb 2020 #78
Kali Feb 2020 #79
H2O Man Feb 2020 #80
malaise Feb 2020 #81
H2O Man Feb 2020 #92
malaise Feb 2020 #93
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #82
malaise Feb 2020 #83
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #85
H2O Man Feb 2020 #95
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #86
malaise Feb 2020 #87
Mike 03 Feb 2020 #108
Kid Berwyn Feb 2020 #96
H2O Man Feb 2020 #97
dalton99a Feb 2020 #99
H2O Man Feb 2020 #100
nolabear Feb 2020 #101
H2O Man Feb 2020 #103
cp Feb 2020 #104
H2O Man Feb 2020 #105
malaise Feb 2020 #106
H2O Man Feb 2020 #107

Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:31 PM

1. Wow! This is excellent

That last response is very very important.

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Response to malaise (Reply #1)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:34 PM

2. Dr. Lee's is one

of the most important voices of conscience in America today. I am hoping people here read and enjoy the interview.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #2)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:38 PM

4. I agree

I hope people share it with family and friends. You are a champion WaterMan.

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Response to malaise (Reply #4)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:48 PM

8. Me, too!

I would ecourage anyone who want, to share it with family & friends. And thank you for your kindness, though it was a small DU group effort. And in these often confusing and difficult days, it is so important that we listen to the voices of sanity ....at this time, being able to interview Dr. Lee was a real treat for me.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:38 PM

3. 'Thanks,' waterman.

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Response to elleng (Reply #3)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:49 PM

9. Thank you, elleng!

It was kind of Dr. Lee to do an interview for the DU community.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #9)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:06 PM

19. VERY kind of her,

and great you were able to participate.

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Response to elleng (Reply #19)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:16 PM

21. I think that

Dr. Lee knows exactly how important it is to provide this information to the public. And it was an absolute honor for me to have the opportunity to interview her for this forum.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:39 PM

5. You did an absolutely superb job, H2O Man

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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #5)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:57 PM

14. Thank you!

I think it is a good read for this community.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:40 PM

6. Most excellent!

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Response to panader0 (Reply #6)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:04 PM

17. Thank you, pander0 !

I'm thinking it comes at a good time for this community. Dr. Lee has a unique, gentle way of communicating in a manner that helps ground people.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #17)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:24 PM

26. Reminds me somewhat of your work.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:43 PM

7. Thank you - Two things that I'd like to comment on: "Republicans either would not express how they

truly felt or would refuse to meet with us (even though their concerns seemed to be well-known behind the scenes)."

My take-away from this statement is, that Republicans know what a mess and danger trump is, but they're cowed and afraid of the consequences if anyone finds out they have expressed their concern.

and, last paragraph: I'm shutting off the computer, and heading off to hike up into the foggy San Francisco hills. More life-affirming; enough death-of-a-nation obsessing.

Again, thank you, H2O Man

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Response to NBachers (Reply #7)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:10 PM

20. That part

of her response is truly unnerving. They are cowards who betray the nation.

Dr. Lee ranks among the very wisest human beings in our country. She has the level of wisdom that is usually found among Elders. That's why her dedication in the book really impressed me -- it gave me a clear hint that I needed to pay close attention to every word in the book.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:52 PM

10. "Do you think elected officials fully recognize the threat the president poses?"

I have wondered this myself.

Great job!

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Response to kentuck (Reply #10)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:18 PM

23. Thanks, kentuck!

Much appreciated!

I think that Dr. Lee will like the responses here when she reads them.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:53 PM

11. Great, thanks. Understanding that it STARTED around 1997

with the Republicans, or at least accelerated dramatically around then. Trump's mental disorders more blatantly reveal than would otherwise be the case what the Republican leadership has become.

I recommend John W. Dean's "Broken Government" to make clear that Trump's actions actually strongly, if erratically, reflect what today's RW powers are and are trying to do.

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #11)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:56 PM

13. I read that - have a copy

It was recommended on DU years ago.
I also think Al Gore's The Assault on Reason is a must read

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Response to malaise (Reply #13)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:05 PM

18. Like him but never read it. It's been around more than

long enough to be affordable, so I'll pop over to see about having it delivered. Thanks.

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Response to Hortensis (Reply #11)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:23 PM

25. Thank you!

Dean's book (and a couple similar ones) is indeed important. And I agree 100% about the republican leadership .....they created the soil that Trump was able to sprout in.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:54 PM

12. One of the most fascinating points Dr. Lee makes is that

Trump is incapable of experiencing self-doubt because it appears to him in disguised form: in the form of an exterior threat. That's mind-blowing. So he can't even interpret a feeling as "the feeling of insecurity" (about himself) because he doesn't experience it in the first place. It is unrecognizable to him.

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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #12)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:59 PM

15. That's exactly right

It explains how he responds to the intelligence agencies and to others with power and authority like Speaker Pelosi or Chairman Schiff.
The Con should be in an institution

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Response to malaise (Reply #15)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:59 PM

33. Exactly!

In my opinion, Trump is especially reactive to women such as Speaker Pelosi. While he always comes across as a weak, sick man, this is even more extreme when it comes to women.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #33)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:18 PM

52. I'd love to hear her take on his mother issues

He really hates women - I suspect it comes from genuine fear

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Response to malaise (Reply #52)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:14 PM

88. Right.

I think that when we look at descriptions of Donald, including from his own mouth, we find that references to his father are very common. But mentions of his mother appear to be the "missing link" in is life. That is telling. It is safe to assume there is a direct connection between this dynamic and his absolutely unhealthy relationship with women. All women. Including his daughters.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #88)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:18 PM

89. Yep - I really want to know more about his mother issues

Yet still I wonder why his children remain so loyal

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Response to malaise (Reply #89)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:47 PM

91. It's an interesting topic.

I respect that it would be improper for Dr. Lee to comment on this part of Trump's pathology, much as she cannot say, "Trump is a sociopath." But I'm confident that we can construct a rather accurate picture. (grin) I'll start with a rather extreme example, and note that if we examine the childhoods of the most infamous of sociopaths, there are some constants.

Those who murder, for example, tend to be male. Those who are spree or serial killers -- also male --tend to kill women. Frequently, they kill "prostitutes," in part because this is a most vulnerable population, and in part because of their image of their mothers. In almost every case, we find that this pathology is rooted in their relationship with their mother. All of their anger, frustrations, and resentments towards females are rooted in that relationship with Mom.

I find it interesting to consider two types: those who openly talk about their relationship with their mther, and those who keep the mere mention of it a tightly-held secret. Both Ed Kemper and Charles Manson would, after being caught, talk a lot about their mothers. It was in part to blame their mothers, even when Ed pretended to take responsibility for his horrors. Manson never took responsibility.

Likewise, Trump has never taken any responsibility for any of his misdeeds. Memories of his mother are buried deeply inside of him, and do not appear in his conscious mind. From his relationships with his wives, girlfriends, and the victims of his unwanted assaults, we know he views women as mere objects, not human beings with their own wants and needs.Thus, he misses out, without knowing it, of the opportunity to get the rewards of a healthy relationship with a partner.

Now, to his daughters. In both cases, these relationships are unhealthy. Can you imagine what it must be like for Tiffany to hear her father said he didn't want her in photographs with him, because she is "fat"? First, she is not "fat." Even if she was, big deal. That's his daughter. But she is as disconnected in Trump's conscious mind, as is his mother. She is the most sympathetic of his children.

His relationship with Ivanka is equally troubling. On one hand, he views her as a projection of himself. One the other hand, based upon numerous sick things he has said publicly, he wants to have sexual relations with her. Perhaps these two factors combine to explain why he isn't upset by people telling him to go fuck himself?

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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #12)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:54 PM

32. Definitely!

I think that Dr. Lee made something that has puzzled Good People for some time into an easily understood point of reference. It is clearly a dangerous part of Trump's pathology.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #32)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:32 AM

84. It also seems to shed new light on his inability to apologize

Dr. Lee’s observation that Trump is incapable of self-doubt tends to explain Trump’s unwillingness to ever apologize. Political experts attribute this to a strategic desire never to show weakness, but if I understand Dr. Lee correctly there is no volition on his part. He never even arrives at the phase of having to make this decision in the first place: Whether to apologize or not apologize.

Because Trump never experiences insight, self-doubt or insecurity, there’s never an inkling of the guilt, regret or remorse that are necessary prerequisites for an apology.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 06:59 PM

16. Well done.

Thank you! Fascinating read, and oddly reassuring. While it reinforces trepidation by confirming my view of the Sociopath-in-Chief, it is helpful to know the best minds in the field see what we see.

And the suggestion to set aside time and space for nurturing pursuits is well taken.

Much appreciated!

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Response to klook (Reply #16)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:03 PM

34. Thanks, klook!

I think this interview might encourage more people to read Dr. Lee's important book.

After doing the lay-out, but before I posted it here, I took the time to walk my dog out in the fields and woods, so that I could think about the powerful things that Dr. Lee shared here with us.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:18 PM

22. Great interview!

Thanks for posting it.

I'm glad Dr. Lee brought up the concept of "structural violence" and its impact on behavior and mental health. This is something that's preoccupied me for a while (and I'm now remembering that I still haven't gotten around to reading "Lost Connections: Why You're Depressed and How to Find Hope," by Johann Hari, which has been on my to-read list for more than a year). It's vexed me for quite some time that, when someone does something terrible that gets major media attention, a conversation can arise that seems to present what I think is a false choice between "blame the individual" and "blame society."

Your last paragraph is important, and I think I should take heed. In my case, following politics - especially since 2016, and even more so since the beginning of the primary - has taken too time away from reading books, practicing my instrument, and spending time outdoors.

Thanks again.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #22)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:06 PM

35. Thank you!

I shared the interview with one of the Clan Mothers that I know from my work with Onondaga Chief Paul Waterman. She loved it, and said that Dr. Lee sheds light upon the things that so many of us have found troubling for the past three years.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #35)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:24 PM

43. Indeed.

I realize my comments were sort of oblique, but I did get much more out of it than my response probably indicated.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #43)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:20 PM

90. I think that

your response was not only solid, but in highlighting the issue of structural violence, worthy of considerable discussion. It is one of the most important issues that Dr. Lee spoke of. In my opinion, it is that very dynamic that allows for the rise of a sociopath -- in business, government, etc -- and is thus directly tied to Trump's election. In fact, the Russian interference would not, nor could not, have had a major influence in 2016 except for the structural violence in American society.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #90)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 01:03 PM

94. Thank you. Structural violence is something I think about a lot.

I'm glad you agree it's important. (I'm used to my preoccupations causing many eyes to glaze over.) Like you, I think there is a strong causal relationship between structural violence and Trump landing in the oval office. I hate to use the word "elected" when referring to him - he lost the popular vote! There's another structural problem...

A few years ago I encountered a startling statistic. I'm not sure how it was calculated, nor am I sure I recall the source correctly, but I believe it was a report from UNICEF. The term in the report wasn't "structural violence," but it was close to that. The report said there are 10 million preventable deaths every year that can be attributed to "structural issues" with the global economy. That's World War II levels of fatalities every decade. It made me think of the Mahatma Gandhi quote, "poverty is the worst form of violence."

Right now I'm reading a fantastic novel (translated from German) entitled "Go, Went, Gone." It's essentially a story about refugees in Berlin, told from the point of view of a recently retired professor who takes an interest in the lives of these displaced people. The book contains extended musings about "the law" and the sometimes perverse results of its application, and notes that no one person can be held responsible for "the law." All suffering is terrible, but I think it's particularly hard to cope with when the question of who is to blame is murky.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #94)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 06:39 PM

102. That is one of

my favorite quotes from Gandhi. I have been reading and re-reading a notebook of his quotes I put together in the 1980s that has that quote in it. I also keep Thomas Merton's "Gandhi on Non-Violence" nearby. Both Gandhi and Merton were such fascinating thinkers.

I believe that we are in a time where Gandhi-style tactics are becoming necessary. And so I also think that James Douglass's "Gandhi and the Unspeakable" is essential reading.

Lately, I've been very impressed with Rev William Barber of NC. He has a deep understanding of what Gandhi and King were saying. We need more of that.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #22)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:13 PM

49. a false choice between "blame the individual" and "blame society."

I think that is because that's because our justice system is based on punishment, including the concept that punishment may be undeserved. And there is a basis for that view in the entire concept of fairness. Most of us think that, though life may not be fair, we have a moral obligation to be fair to each other.

I've struggled with this, not because I don't agree that we should be fair to each other - I do - but I also know from personal experience that a person can do things which for one reason or another it may not be fair at all to consider those deeds as "his or her fault" - and yet, if those actions cannot be otherwise stopped, the person cannot go free in society without endangering that society. In the case closest to me, the individual has TBI, but there are many things which can bring about that situation.

Whatever happened to Trump, and regardless how much of what he is today is or is not his "fault" - I do believe he is in the category of people who need to be locked up in order to protect society. The time to consider whose fault it is comes, if at all, after there are different conditions of confinement available to people depending on how much they are in fact at fault. It doesn't appear to me that that is going to happen in my lifetime.

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Response to soldierant (Reply #49)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:26 PM

54. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

I do think that society has to take measures to protect itself, and sometimes that does mean isolating (imprisoning, punishing, whatever) certain individuals. But I think the best measures are prophylactic - if we deliberately structure society so that most everyone has a decent life, I'm sure we'd have fewer "problem" individuals.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #54)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:53 PM

64. I 100% agree.

And I'm sure you know what a difficult task that is.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:20 PM

24. Excellent interview.

I have been following her from the beginning and have found her warnings very prescient. Thank you for posting H2O man!

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #24)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:10 PM

36. Thanks!

I was so impressed when Dr. Lee and others spoke up, recognizing the duty to warn. I've watched her and several of the others being interviewed on television, and thought that it was essential for the public to be exposed to what they say. And it was a real honor for me to play the minor role I did in bringing this interview to the DU community. Hopefully, it will be shared with other people and on other internet sites.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:25 PM

27. There is so much here

Psychosis is defined as detachment from reality, and since malignant narcissism, psychopathy, and sociopathy can be seen as defects in coping mechanisms, extreme pressure will make them more prone to psychotic spirals. For example, extreme narcissism can lead one to have such difficulty coping with normal human limitations, that one must create an alternative reality where one is superhuman, an expert in all fields, and even heaven-sent.

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Response to malaise (Reply #27)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:13 PM

37. That is so intense!

It is exactly what we have been witnessing for 3+ years. It is as much Donald Trump as a photograph of him.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #37)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:38 PM

44. It is as much Donald Trump as a photograph of him

THIS

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:28 PM

28. H2O Man, thank you so much

For doing this interview and posting the scoop on DU. I've used this email addy:
info@dangerouscase.org
to send a message of thanks to Dr Lee for sharing her time and expertise.

You're a legend, H2O Man!

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Response to canetoad (Reply #28)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:14 PM

38. Thank you, canetoad!

All credit goes to Dr. Lee. It was an honor for me to communicate with her, and to share this with the DU community.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:29 PM

29. OMG This Is Huge

Will have to read it a bit at a time

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Response to Me. (Reply #29)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:16 PM

39. Thank you!

I hoped that you would see this! It is so important.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:33 PM

30. Thank you, H20 Man.

It felt good to set aside all the chaos and read this insightful interview.Thank you.

I particularly appreciated two reminders....about setting boundaries and about people having the true power.

~peace~

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Response to democrank (Reply #30)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:20 PM

40. Thank you!

Those "two reminders" are so important.

I'm really happy that I have the honor of sharing the interview here on DU.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 07:35 PM

31. Great Post

Thanks for making the effort. Well worth it!

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Response to Progressive2020 (Reply #31)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:22 PM

41. Thank you!

Being able to interview one of the individuals that I have the greatest of respect for, and being able to share the results on my favorite internet site, has been my pleasure.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:24 PM

42. We know what needs to be done.

Let's do it.

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Response to warmfeet (Reply #42)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:56 PM

46. That's exactly right!

And it's the attitude we all need to take! Thank you!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:54 PM

45. Holy Cow. Thank you!

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Response to JDC (Reply #45)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 08:59 PM

47. Thank you!

I've been reading and re-reading Dr. Lee's answers most of the day. I'm going to print off a copy of the interview, and put it in my book. She is an amazing human being, and exactly the type of person that it is most important that we listen to.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #47)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 02:23 AM

74. She made me recall to mind

Hannah Arendt and The Banality of Evil.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:11 PM

48. This was excellent. Thank you so much.

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Response to Joinfortmill (Reply #48)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:15 PM

50. Thank you!

It was my pleasure to bring this to DU. I had one friend suggest that I could "sell" the interview elsewhere. I told him that I write for free, and that DU is my favorite internet site. There are really good people here.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:18 PM

51. Well done H20

You're such a gift to the DU community.

I found the interview enlightening. And although it is discouraging to know that rump is severely mentally ill it does help to have a better understanding of that illness.

And I really appreciated the end of the interview that talks about how to practice mental hygiene!

I hope we will be hearing more from Dr. Lee, especially about how to protect ourselves from too much stress.

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Response to coeur_de_lion (Reply #51)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:32 PM

55. Thanks!

I shared this interview with a woman I know from my work with Chief Waterman. She said that she appreciated the light that Dr. Lee shines ....that lately, she has found herself wondering how it is that people don't see exactly what is happening? And how she has withdrawn, to a large extent, from "political" issues, as she finds them too stressful.

The interview came at a perfect time for her, because of a conflict taking place on one of the Confederacy's western New York territories. It involves a Trump-like person, attempting to steal power, in order to sell that which is Sacred for his own financial gain. This struggle is going on everywhere.

At one point, I reminded her that we were taught long ago that these things were going to take place. She said yes, that is true, but she never thought about it happening in her lifetime. But it is. And it's up to us.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #55)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:36 PM

57. okay please clarify this

we were taught long ago that these things were going to take place


What were you taught?

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Response to coeur_de_lion (Reply #57)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:40 PM

59. Oh, that is

a long, complicated topic. Do you remember me writing about Handsome Lake on this forum? Probably around 2006 or so. My memory isn't perfect, you know! Or Leon Shenandoah and Oren Lyons?

When you have time, find Bill Moyers' interview with Oren on youtube. You'll love it.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #59)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 10:22 PM

68. I've watched that interview before

probably at your suggestion. And I am watching it again now. Of course I love it.

I don't recall you mentioning Handsome Lake though.

And I wish you would explain further.

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Response to coeur_de_lion (Reply #68)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 10:44 PM

69. I will.

Long topic.

Oren turns 90 soon. He is a great man.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:19 PM

53. K&R.

Thanks so much for this!

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Response to Docreed2003 (Reply #53)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:32 PM

56. Thank you!

I am glad that you like it!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:37 PM

58. Thank you H2O Man and Dr. Lee! nt

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Response to chowder66 (Reply #58)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:42 PM

61. Thank you!

I'm not sure if Dr. Lee will be reading this tonight, or more likely tomorrow. I'm glad that you thanked her! She is the one who deserves the credit.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #61)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 11:47 PM

71. I didn't know if she would see it or not. I'm just grateful to both of you for doing this. nt

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Response to chowder66 (Reply #71)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:01 AM

72. Yes, she will

be reading it! I had nothing but fun doing my part, and appreciate that you and others like it.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #72)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:05 AM

73. : )

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:42 PM

60. Great interview!

I just found the 2019 edition of her book and put a hold on it! Strangely, there were no holds at all on this book and the 2017 edition. In other words, I should have it here by Tuesday!

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Response to icymist (Reply #60)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:47 PM

63. Great!

I know that you will enjoy the book. From the day that I first read it, I recognized it as among the most important books that I've ever read. I have a fairly large library, and "The Dangerous Case of Donald Trump" is kept on a small top shelf with my favorites.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #63)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 10:07 PM

65. I Imagine I'll have to renew this book when I get through with it as roommates will want to read it.

You know, back in 2017 one of my roommates said that 45 was ruining the country just to get back for everybody laughing at him during the corespondents dinner. I brushed it off as being petty as I couldn't imagine anyone taking that event seriously. After reading this interview I believe that, yeah, 45 does want to see the US fail.

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Response to icymist (Reply #65)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 05:44 PM

98. Back in 1988,

Trump wrote to Bush the Elder, to volunteer to be his vice presidential choice. (Yikes!) So he has had his eyes on national politics for some time. But I agree 10,000% with your roommate -- as much as I love watching President Obama humiliating Trump, and I still laugh out loud when I watch it -- that this prompted Trump to run in 2016. More, it made him opt to go the vicious route, starting in the republican primary.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 09:46 PM

62. Thank you, H20 Man,

you are DU's treasure, Dr. Lee is a treasure to us all.

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Response to 5X (Reply #62)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 10:07 PM

66. Thanks, 5X !!!

Dr. Lee is among the very most important voices in America in this era.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 10:13 PM

67. Great easy to read analysis

I had heard about trump throwing rocks at the neighbor's kid, but I had not heard that he dangled a kid out of a window. That is probably what got him sent to military school, where he learned more about the military than those that actually serve.

I always suspected that the reason he doesn't have a pet is because he tortured them in his younger years. Being bored with torturing pets, they no longer hold any value for him. IOW he has escalated to genocide. When that no longer gives him the thrill he seeks is when the world will be in trouble. He has no remorse and knows more than any other human on the planet detonating a nuclear bomb is his dream.

What I would be interested in is how would trump's reported drug use (Adderall) impacts his phycological makeup.

By makeup I'm not talking about that orange clown shit he plasters on his face, although it would be interesting to find out why he does that.

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #67)

Sat Feb 22, 2020, 11:07 PM

70. Thanks!

I haven't interviewed any one in years. I still feel a bit self-conscious since the old brain injury two years ago. So I am pleased that the questions I asked were okay, and got great answers from Dr. Lee.

Her insights about his lack of self-awareness might explain the bizarre "Joker-like" makeup. But still -- what the heck is that all about? Doesn't he know people laugh at him for that?

Sociopaths tend to favor amphetamines as their drug of choice. Although Adderall wasn't prescribed to the population I worked with before retiring, if I remember correctly it is a combination of salts that are amphetamines, that was prescribed to children diagnosed with ADD. It helps them think clearer, with a longer focus. But, if my memory serves me correctly, a number of the parents of kids getting the Rx began sampling it. It is "speed" for adults, and so it appeals in particular to sociopaths, as they require constant stimulation. Thus, I suspect that it could only have the long-term results on personality that log-term abuse of any type of "speed" would have -- and these are never attractive. It would, if Trump is abusing it, fit with his spinning out of control.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 02:43 AM

75. Great interview!

How lucky of you to get it. What scared me, was Dr. Lee's dire prediction that we haven't seen the worst of him yet. It definitely feels like it's getting worse too. Puzzling too, is that his cultists are so far gone that they don't realize that if something really bad happens, it will happen to them too, not just us libs. Not the way I saw my golden years

Peace

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Response to shanti (Reply #75)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 03:16 AM

77. Thank you!

I was fortunate to get to do this interview. And as he spins out of control, things are getting worse at a faster pace. His cult suffers from a shared madness.

This sure as heck isn't what I anticipated for my golden years, either. I know that democracy involves constant struggle. But I didn't think republicans would be so willing to shred the Constitution.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 02:46 AM

76. Thank you- this is the best.

I don't hope for bad things to happen to people. But with Trump, I just hope the problems that he already has become more obvious so that he can be given the help he needs.

Okay, also so that even his Republican voters will think, oh, gross, he's nuts.

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Response to dawg day (Reply #76)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 03:22 AM

78. Thanks!

When I was talking with Dr. Lee about this interview, I noted that Trump reminded me of a few of the guys that I met with in the county jail, when I was doing forensics at the mental health clinic. In my opinion, Trump should be incarcerated. That is the only treatment that might reduce his corrupt behaviors. It would provide the structure that is clearly missing while he is president.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 03:40 AM

79. thanks to both of you

these kinds of things elevate DU, nice change of postings from all the hand-wringing over primaries, though still a depressing and alarming topic.

if he wasn't in a position of causing so much harm, he would just be a fascinating subject to examine.

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Response to Kali (Reply #79)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 04:31 AM

80. Thank you!

I thought that Dr. Lee's message would be beneficial for the DU community. We are living in some strange times. It's important to put the events we've been through already in 2020 into perspective, and to keep our eyes on the prize.

I am convinced that Trump could be best studied if he was incarcerated.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 07:46 AM

81. Kick for the morning crowd n/t

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Response to malaise (Reply #81)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:47 PM

92. Thanks!

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #92)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 12:50 PM

93. I think all Dems should raise the madness of Don the Con way more than they do

This has to be stopped

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:28 AM

82. "A Duty to Warn" vs. "First Do No Harm"

Your excellent question to Dr. Lee about whether episodes of intense stress can trigger psychosis—and her answer—will help some of us to understand why psychiatrists who’ve studied Trump never touch the subject of how to access Trump’s weak points or exploit them to gain a psychological advantage or throw him off balance. That’s been one frustration for those of us who read books like “Dangerous Case” and “Dangerous Charisma” trying to ascertain ways to identify, access and trigger his psychological vulnerabilities (and pass them onto people who are in a position to do so).

A responsible psychiatrist would never provide advice on this because of the inherent risk, and because the “Duty to Warn” is counterbalanced by the duty to “Do no Harm.” And since one outcome might be a psychotic episode, the consequences are unknowable and potentially hazardous. It would likely be gross professional misconduct and the repercussions (not to mention the liability) could be immense. Therefore, it’s understandable that mental health professionals like Dr. Lee are reluctant to go near this subject.

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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #82)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:30 AM

83. Excellent point but there are professionals in other spheres who need to stop him

from doing any more harm to the country and planet

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Response to malaise (Reply #83)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:37 AM

85. Perhaps mental health professionals are consulting privately with persons in a position to

do something.

For example, one of our candidates has hired a psychiatrist who is specializes in narcissism to help direct attacks.

Personally, this is why I read these books. But they shy away from this discussion.



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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #85)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 01:06 PM

95. Interesting.

I suspect that those in career military positions have a good understanding of these dynamics. But, much like "politics" cannot address the dangers Trump poses -- at least without a united front, currently not an option in DC -- the military is caught in a difficult position.

Trump isn't the first president to have serious mental health issues. In my lifetime, both LBJ and Nixon had episodes where they were detached from reality. Those around both were aware of this, and at least attempted to take steps to prevent it from becoming a crisis. In Trump's case, there were a few people initially in is administration who people hoped could serve as the "adults in the room." All of these, of course, have quit or been fired. It is unnerving when even John Bolton realized that Trump was a mad man, spinning out of control. Yet Bolton refused to come forward when his country needed him to.

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Response to malaise (Reply #83)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:40 AM

86. "Professionals in other spheres"

One of the most depressing things I've ever heard was an interview last week where a news anchor asked a Senator, "We know Trump and Russia are interfering in the election. There must be something you can do."

And the Senator basically threw up his hands and said "We can vote in November."

It's as if there's nothing anybody can do about anything!



I'm wondering, Who can help that we're not thinking about? If not politicians, if not psychiatrists... who?

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Response to Mike 03 (Reply #86)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 09:10 AM

87. It will come down to the American people in all spheres and their institutions

and while it is depressing, I still think the Con and his goons will lose

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Response to malaise (Reply #87)

Mon Feb 24, 2020, 10:20 AM

108. Yesterday I was thinking about this comment and a lightbulb

went on in my head.

Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 01:12 PM

96. Mental Hygiene: RESIST

Thank you, H2O Man and Dr. Lee!

Your great interview reveals much insight and adds to the record information needed to stop the Unstable Moron.

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Response to Kid Berwyn (Reply #96)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 02:09 PM

97. In terms of

mental hygiene, Trump has flossed his mind.

Thank you, and I'm glad that you enjoyed the interview.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 05:55 PM

99. Great interview.

A must read.

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Response to dalton99a (Reply #99)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 05:58 PM

100. Thank you!

I've been sharing the link with a lot of non-DU members. I know a few others are doing the same. I think that's a good thing, as it helps good people understand exactly what we are up against.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 06:29 PM

101. I've been away and am late reading this. Is it on the FB Page?

Y’all know I’m in the mental health community. This is common knowledge and much discussed among my friends and colleagues but the Goldwater Rule still hangS over our heads, in part out of a genuine desire not to wrong someone or to give the perception of having an agenda with our patients. And psychology and psychiatry has been egregiously misused in the past.

But we’ve kept up with Dr. Lee and others and she’s exactly on point. He’s incredibly dangerous, and the charisma and use of that chameleon like quality to convince others to support him even as he destroys them makes him more dangerous than many can even imagine.

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Response to nolabear (Reply #101)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 06:45 PM

103. I'm not sure.

I'm not on the FB page, though perhaps I should be. I'm hoping that community members here will share it if they want to. I know a few already are. I've shared it with my friends and associates, including my old co-workers from the mental health clinic I worked at. (By "old" co-workers, I mean in terms of my being retired, as are several others. But I'm older than them.)

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 07:04 PM

104. Thank you!

Will get her book and read it, and for now will go outside in the beautiful sunshine and walk my dog to replenish.
Just, thank you.

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Response to cp (Reply #104)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 07:30 PM

105. Oh, thank you, cp

I just took one of my dogs for a second walk today. It was a shorter one than in the afternoon. There are wonderful fields and woods here, and I get a kick out of watching him following all the deer, rabbit, turkey, and coyote tracks in the snow. He tends to get distracted by each new set, so we had a long, zig-zagged walk today. His brother prefers multiple shorter walk. They remind me of Tigger and Winnie the Pooh.

I have been thinking about doing a series of similar interviews with other people who have been or are active in social-political activities.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #105)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 08:48 PM

106. Please do those interviews

You also need to publish a compilation with all of them

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Response to malaise (Reply #106)

Sun Feb 23, 2020, 10:15 PM

107. You are kind.

I used to do them frequently. Even posted some on this forum before. I liked the one I did with Mark Rudd back in 2008. Of course, that kind of dates me, in terms of who I liked as a teen. Ha!

Years ago, before there was an internet, I used to have interviews published in the area's (very) small town newspaper.

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