A plea for all DUers who haven't already done so. Drop Facebook like a rock, please?

[Dennis Donovan]

Twitter and Facebook refuse to delete fake video with Speaker Pelosi

It is, easily, one of the most dangerous social media platforms *because* they make NO pretense to being fair or policing their platform for disinformation. Starve them of clicks and make them go away, please?

It's become 4chan for Nanas and Grampas.

Thanks!

[Kurt V.]

1. K&R

[DemocracyMouse]

156. I'm inclined to love your post too, but to be utterly clear-minded and fair:

DU is profiting off of adds for semi-automatic weapons. This very post had one. Why isn't DU employing editors to weed out such fascist ads? I've asked the management about this and they claim their ad service "just works that way." Why don't they change services? Or use a non-profit business model?

I do agree that Facebook needs an overhaul, but let's not be hypocrites.

[Ms. Toad]

168. It is "employing" editors - us.

I'm sure when you spoke to them about it they told you to report inappropriate ads.

Once reported, they are removed. (I've gotten several removed, largely ads for republican candidates.)

The way the service works is that the ads are served automatically based largely on page content. So in a page full of gun conversation, gun ads will run. In a page full of trashing a republican candidate (or boosting their democratic opponent) the ads for the republican candidate will run. If DU notifies the server that it does not want a particular ad the ad is pulled.

Here's where you report them: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=ata

It's the 4th option.

[NRaleighLiberal]

2. I did 3 months ago. Twitter too. Much joy ensued in my life.

[Dennis Donovan]

5. I'm still on Twitter. With the introduction of tools that sort out the bots, it's a better place...

...than it used to be.

[greymattermom]

8. I still like Twitter.

Of course you have to be careful, but I'm following the progression of Trump's neurological issues on Twitter, where videos document every foot dragging, podium grabbing, dilated pupil, failing speech event.

[barbtries]

69. Tom Joseph, right?

I just found him and went back and read all of his deep dive threads. trump is being held together with elmer's glue and safety pins.
https://twitter.com/TomJChicago

[Moostache]

127. Twitter is a total joke

Until they enforce their "policies" against hate and encouraging violence against Trump just like anyone else, they are nothing more than government propaganda for the administration and they can rot in hell.

fuck you Jack Dorsey...you are a joke of a human being.

[wnylib]

154. Here's my concern about the Trump dementia.

He is the 3rd mentally unfit president to be propped up by R's. Reagan, Bush II, and Trump.

So who is behind this? Who is the puppet master for these mentally incompetent presidents? Whoever they are, they are the people we need to be concerned about. They will be around after Trump. Who will tbey use next? How do we defeat them and not the puppet they set up to promote their agenda?

[2naSalit]

3. YES!

[texasfiddler]

4. I did two weeks ago

I haven’t missed it

[Blue_Adept]

6. Another day of telling people to do something they may not be able to do

We get these topics at least once or twice a month now. Some people simply can't for a number of reasons.

If you can, great. If you can't, no shame.

[Dennis Donovan]

13. I asked, I didn't "tell" anyone anything.

[Blue_Adept]

15. pleas, pleading, guilting... same thing.

[Dennis Donovan]

17. Yawn...

Of course their not.

[VOX]

28. No need for the didactic weigh-in.

Why the need to fire a torpedo at Dennis here? His request is legitimate and worthy of consideration. If it ruffles your feathers, why not just simply move on to another thread, instead of giving grief to a fellow DUer? If all repetition, requests or reminders were excised from DU, there wouldn’t be much traffic here at all.

Peace.

[not_the_one]

110. Why? Guilt.

FB is nothing more than a toy. We got along just fine before it came along. It may be "fun" for some, but if anything it has made us as a people, more shallow, superficial, self-centered.

Now, as he helps reduce this country to a shit-hole level, in the gutter, Mark Zuckerberg transports his money to the bank by the truck load.

Just so we can play with our new toy. He KNOWS what he is doing.

[VOX]

133. You should read and get the context before firing a round at a bystander who agrees with you.

I was speaking in defense of Dennis. He posted about Facebook’s bad medicine, and another DUer cranked at him for posting that. I don’t like seeing DUers go after one another, THAT’S ALL. I agree with Dennis, and I agree with you— Facebook is a fucking unflushed toilet that needs to be dynamited, and its fragments dumped into a live volcano.

[not_the_one]

172. I, too, was defending Dennis.

The question was "why the torpedo to Dennis". I suggested a reason.

Sorry for the confusion. I offer to kiss and make up with a heart.

[Skittles]

176. it's how addicts behave

yup

[Dennis Donovan]

190. Skittles, you win this thread

This thread is exhibit A.

[DownriverDem]

80. FB

is where I have met many left leaning Democrats.

[blueinredohio]

7. Agree a gazillion percent.

[hlthe2b]

9. Absolutely, but be prepared to duck...

I (and several others) have made entreaties to do so over the past several months because FB (especially) is no friend to truth or fairness, and is in the pocket of Trump and his ilk.

You will get all kinds of outrage and "self-righteous" indignation from some (the same ones typically) over your suggestion that they should be "inconvenienced" by dropping FB because they only use it to share pictures with their long lost high school buds and family members and that because THEY never get political fake news ads from FB, due to their blocking software there is no problem. Every damned thread. Well, guess what? Our opponents only care about disseminating their hate and lies to the masses who DO read their crap, may not know better and are fully susceptible. As long as you support FB, they have that platform.

Ahh, I see a new post now that proves my point.

[volstork]

78. Precisely.

I have any number of dyed-in-the-wool Democrat friends who wouldn't DREAM of giving up their precious Facebook for just the reasons you list. It just boggles the mind...

[HuskyOffset]

153. Democratic friends (NT)

[writes3000]

95. I dropped it last year when I realized Zuckerberg is clearly helping Trump. It felt good.

I suspect some people are truly addicted to it so this request will get some anger from them.

[A HERETIC I AM]

10. It's dangerous only if you take it seriously.

An easy way to avoid all of the undesirable content is to simply form a private group amongst your friends and or family. That way none of the bots or bad advertisements etc. will show up, and if they do, so what?

I’m pretty sure I can decipher what is crap and what isn’t without dropping an entire platform that has allowed me to find friends from 40 years ago.

[we can do it]

29. Its dangerous because it exists.

[Dream Girl]

38. You don't know wat you're up against goes farther than simple influence.

People are being segmented and profiled. There is a suspicion that Facebook profiles was used to drop people from voter rolls in tight precincts. Based on your segment profiles and matching it to voter registration, malicious hackers are suspected of strategically deleting voter registration. When they showed up to vote, they were given”provisional” ballots. They are very very sophisticated. You just have no clue. I live and work in SiliconValley and know many people who won’t go near it. Even people who friggin work for Facebook

[CrispyQ]

63. Where the fuck are the Hackers for Democracy?

Sarcasm—sort of. Why is all the hacking against our side? Is it a matter that our side doesn't do that shit? When they go low, we go high? And now, their boot is on our neck. Which is why I'm only kind of sarcastic about my original question, where the fuck are the Hackers for Democracy?

[greymattermom]

11. I found a group I didn't know about, They See Blue,

and went to an event with Stacy Abrams and 3 of the candidates for one of the Senate seats open in Georgia this year. I love seeing them in person and WE HAVE TWO CHANCES.

[Cirque du So-What]

12. I advocated for dropping FuckFace for years now

You know what I got? Ridicule for boycotting a ‘free service.’ We’ve since found out that the cost is higher than expected.

[beachbumbob]

14. if you are of above average intelligence and age,no msiinformation on FB will influence your opinion

[Dream Girl]

32. Sorry but you don't know wat you're up against. Not just the influence but wat you say and do

Goes into their algorithm. They have very sophisticated segmentation and profiling algorith. Advanced data science. Your data is mapped to your content, contacts and follows you around the internet. Just don’t do it and besides why would you want o support them. Oh yeah beaceause it’s “convenient” and you are “smart”. I work in Silicon Valley and know tons of people who won’t go near Facebook. In fact just had a conversation with someone we just hired from Facebook and I asked him if he was on it. He just smiled and said No I stay away.

[Coventina]

62. You do realize that 50 percent of voters are below average?

That is why Facebook and Twitter are destroying democracy, QUITE INTENTIONALLY!

[Squinch]

159. The ignorant are always unaware of their ignorance.

[cwydro]

16. How about Twitter?

Hmmm?

[Dennis Donovan]

23. Twitter has policies in place, and there are tools available to sort out the veracity...

...of twitter users. So, nope, not even close to the same thing.

[cwydro]

174. Lol, I've seen people right here, whose names I won't mention, post absolute falsehoods from

Twitter.

So if there are “tools” to separate truth from falsehood, apparently people seldom avail themselves of them.

[Coventina]

64. Twitter has also refused to remove the fake video Trump is using. n/t

[Hotler]

18. And drop Linkedin. nt

[dalton99a]

22. +1.

[fierywoman]

148. Me too.

[dalton99a]

19. Zuckerberg is relying on the old folks

[Dream Girl]

33. Old unsophisticated folks who either don't know any better or think they are "smart"

[Fla Dem]

97. Not sure why you're taking aim on the "Old Folks"

If I'm reading the chart correctly, only 53% of people aged 55+ use FB, whereas 69% of people aged 35-54 and 62% aged 12-34 use FB.

So looks to me their target audience is 18 - 54.

The 12-34 age group, Millennials and Gen Z'ers, has decreased from 79% to 62% in the past 3 years. A drop of 17%.

The 35-54 age range which is comprised of Millenials and Gen X'ers has remained steady at 69-72% participation.

There has been a slight uptick (4%) in the 55+ group in 2019. Probably due to the youngest Boomers (born in 1964 turned 55 in 2019) aging into that group for the first time. Growth in that group was flat in 2017-2018.

So looks like it the it's Millennials (1977-1995) age 25-43 and Gen X'ers (1965-1976) age 44-55 who are really propping up FB.

[Bluepinky]

20. I never liked them from the beginning.

Couldn’t see the point of posting one’s activities and thoughts online for all to see.
The more popular it has become, the less I like it. It’s become cult-like.

[Fla_Democrat]

21. But, but, but, I thought....

But, but, but, I thought that was where we were suppose to keep in touch if/when the "russians" hacked DU after the November election....

https://www.facebook.com/democraticunderground/






How we gonna keep up to date if/when the page is 'hacked'?

[Dennis Donovan]

25. Before FB, we had a Yahoo! group

During the hack, I kept up with the Admins via twitter

[hlthe2b]

99. Yes... The panic room or something like that. Whoever moderated that group must have

died or at least left as Yahoo closed it down for lack of response from a "group leader." Or at least that's what they claimed.

It was very useful during the past outages and hacks.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

24. I'm good, thanks.

[Dennis Donovan]

26. I'm sure you are

[WhiskeyGrinder]

37. .

[we can do it]

31. Because participating in an admitted disinfo for cash organization is A-OK.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

35. No, it just means that I've come to terms with the risks and benefits the platform offers.

Just like I have with any website I participate on, including this one.

[Dream Girl]

42. I doubt you fully appreciate the risks. Unless you're a PhD level data scientist.

You don’t have a clue

[WhiskeyGrinder]

43. Help me out, then.

[Blue_Adept]

45. Just us dumb facebook-using folks around these parts, I guess

Hope someone can save us from ourselves!

[Dream Girl]

47. You said it, not me. And as for saving you trying to do save myself and the country form fab

They’ve done and will do a ton of damage. But it’s just so fun and convenient.

[pamela]

91. What is a "country form fab?"

Last edited Sun Feb 9, 2020, 02:05 PM - Edit history (1)

Must be one of those Ph.d data scientist terms.

[Dream Girl]

34. Cuz you're so "smart"? See my post above. Lots of folks in the valley won't go near it.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

36. Okay.

[Thekaspervote]

27. BOYCOTT FB!! It is hurting zuckerberg big time..16 billion lost over poor FB performance

https://www.livemint.com/Companies/x7cwZ2CGFAlUbSIF8roicM/16-billion-This-is-how-much-Mark-Zuckerberg-lost-in-one-da.html

[TwilightZone]

108. He hasn't lost anything.

Unless he sells the stock, it's not a loss. If the stock recovers, as it probably will over time, he'll end up losing nothing.

[FakeNoose]

155. Yes a lot of people misunderstand this

When somebody like Mark Zuckerberg says he's "worth" gazillions of dollars, it doesn't mean he has cash in the bank for that amount. Maybe it means he could sell shares in the company and get that amount, except it really doesn't mean that either. If he should start liquidating his shares, everyone else would do the same and the price would drop immediately. When the price of the shares fluctuate, it doesn't affect Zuck unless he's buying or selling them.

[Shanti Mama]

30. Just stop clicking on ANYTHING

I'm still on FB but I don't like or clock or comment on anything. They know it and it starves their advertisers. Their stats reflect this and it hurts their sales pitch.

[MineralMan]

39. You do you. I'll do me. Thanks.

[Coventina]

67. Continuing to support anti-Democratic companies is you, then. n/t

[MineralMan]

73. Nope. Using available resources that benefit me is me.

I determine how I use resources. They don't use me.

[Coventina]

77. That's what you're doing, you're supporting an anti-Democratic entity that is destroying

our democracy.

You can excuse it any way you like, but that's what you're doing.

[MineralMan]

79. Well, no doubt you know better than I do...

[Coventina]

83. Apparently I do. eom

[h2ebits]

158. I agree with you

I started using Facebook a number of years back because my son was posting pictures of my grandchildren and I wanted to see them. Being a practical sort, it was totally useless to me otherwise so I soon turned it into my political commentary, news of the day, and various and assorted scientific news--whatever I choose.

I have few "friends" on Facebook and post everything as "public" because I want everyone to have access to what truth I have to share. I think it is important for us to fight back in every way possible against the forces that are shaping our world and attempting to destroy us. Facebook is one of the tools in my arsenal of truth telling. For me, posting the truth has become one way for me to feel that I am doing something constructive.

As for Zuckerberg and his policies, he is just another one of the crappy capitalists gaming the system (who set up this particular system using their ill gotten gains, by the way.) We, the people of the world, need to elect people into office that will actually represent us rather than the corporate raiders. We, the people of the world need to take back OUR MONEY in order to take care of each other and the world we live on.
_________________________________

In the meantime, this is how I protect myself: (If you are doing something better, please let me know.)

I use Mozilla Firefox as my ISP and StartPage as my search engine rather than Google Chrome so that I can search "anonymously." Firefox also gives me the option of a number of ad blockers and I use uBlock Origin, which blocks most of the ads on Facebook, as well as most other sites. Finally, Firefox in the past few months developed a container app for Facebook that I highly recommend. It seems that Facebook tracks you around the web by the use of its icon on all the pages that you visit. If you see the Facebook share icon on a website that you are visiting, then Facebook has recorded you. The container app puts a fence around it to block that from happening.

[Magoo48]

136. Will you please stop using petroleum products, please.

Big Oil pays no taxes and they are quite literally destroying the environment our democracy exists in.

Will you all please stop watching all forms of commercial or corporate owned TV, please. It is censored by the large corporations which own it and that is destroying our democracy.

etc.. etc. etc.

[Coventina]

145. People get so defensive about their toys. n/t

[A HERETIC I AM]

206. And you and a couple others on this thread have gotten condescending in your responses.

One could say you have gotten defensive of your position because you seem to think you know what’s best for others and want to criticize them for not acquiescing to your position.

Goes both ways, don’t you think?

[Coventina]

207. I am going to be condescending to anyone helping undermine our democracy. n/t

[PatSeg]

40. Not me

Facebook is the type of experience you want to make it and I use it primarily to interact with friends and family. I don't encounter a lot of disinformation and when I do, I call it out, often posting a correction.

I post my political comments on private groups and rarely discuss politics elsewhere. I have unfriended a few people who posted something I construed as racist and I don't accept every friend request.

I have a Facebook page for my colorized vintage photos that gets far more traffic than on Flickr. This is something I'm not ready to give up.

If I canceled my Facebook account, it wouldn't hurt Facebook, but there would be one less person fact-checking the fake stories and memes. So that doesn't really help me or anyone else.

[still_one]

41. I agree, and never became part of that craze. Unfortunately, people are NOT going to drop facebook.

It is like an addiction

People complain, but it doesn't stop them

Same with Amazon. Hell, Sanders is one of the biggest critics of Amazon, but that doesn't stop him from doing business with them

[katmondoo]

44. A little more than a year ago, couldn't take neices and nephews that I loved go for Trumper

[lambchopp59]

54. 12 years ago for me, family who were vicious Obama-haters

When I requested some of them not post racist crap on my Facebook page, I got massively de-friended.
The website became useless to me so I de-activated my profile, occasionally get frustrated when some link here or elsewhere is a facebook page, requiring a log in to view.
What makes me cringe with frustration are posts from RWNJ's everywhere lamenting how terribly "them damn liberals" have divided the country. Lately I see posts from the ilk so hateful, so full of spite and rage from the Trumpers on most any comment area.
So to their ilk I say without saying:

[colsohlibgal]

46. Dropped It Already

Minus Facebook that Monstrosity would not be shredding our Laws and Constitution. The damage they’ve caused is incalculable.

[Dream Girl]

49. Yep and folks are too fuckin stupid to accept the truth

[leftstreet]

52. What exactly has Facebook done?

I'm not a Facebook user so I don't know

Does Facebook have more national influence, political connections, and financial motivation than, say, FOX news and its advertisers?

[Dream Girl]

55. Oh brother.

[leftstreet]

61. Guess I'm 'too fuckin stupid' to understand n/t

[Coventina]

70. Did you read the article in the OP? n/t

[leftstreet]

76. Yes

It seems so familiar

Like...FOX news, CNN, MSNBC refusing to remove deceptive propaganda from their programming

[Coventina]

82. For all their faults (especially Fox) there are standards that broadcasters have to adhere to

even Fox wouldn't be able to play that video without telling the viewers it is fake.

The point is that Facebook and Twitter allow AND ENCOURAGE these fakes because it makes them money.

[leftstreet]

84. LOL

[Coventina]

88. So what? Mistakes are made all the time. Saying it's the same thing is ludicrous. n/t

[leftstreet]

100. You're surely not defending FOX news?

...over interactive people's media?

Surely not

[Coventina]

104. I'm not defending Fox News, don't be silly. Every news network gets stuff wrong from time to time.

CNN had a disastrous run of blunders a few years ago.

[leftstreet]

109. Oh. The networks got Iraq wrong?

Like, they didn't help lie the US and its allies into war...they just got some stuff wrong? Made a few blunders was it?

[Coventina]

112. The entire media of this country was manipulated by the Bush Regime, it is true.

Many media outlets (NYT for example) have since admitted that they did not do their due diligence in their investigative wing on the issues.

What FB and Twitter are doing is taking what they already know is a lie, publicly admitting that it is a lie, publicly admitting that they are destroying our government institutions, because then it will prompt more lies that they can use to build out their company further.

That is NOT the model of the traditional media. It does not compare at all.

[leftstreet]

119. Whatever

I can see you are passionate about trusting and promoting corporate 'traditional' media

I'll defend interactive social media that lets the working classes communicate

[Coventina]

122. Hahahahahaha! Yeah, 'cuz Zuckerberg is all about helping the working class!!!

[leftstreet]

134. Inadvertently, he did

I think something's being overlooked here. These conversations about the outrageous social media thing-of-the-day miss the nature of social interaction AND the rise of global rightwing forces.

Most people self-censor in all social situations

Elect a Trump, a Bolsonaro, a Johnson, etc and the self-censoring fades as some people feel validated in their previously hidden views

Time and again you hear people claiming they didn't know how racist, homophobic, right leaning some of their friends and family members were until...

This is not the fault of social media itself

[Coventina]

142. Social media is where many people become radicalized, or haven't you followed the story of ISIS?

It absolutely is the fault of social media in giving these groups platforms and exposure.

[leftstreet]

161. ISIS is coming for our Grandmothers!!!111 n/t

[Coventina]

162. reductio ad absurdum n/t

[we can do it]

132. This and too damn stubborn to admit they are perpetuating the propaganda.

[xmas74]

50. The local Democrats use it to communicate

All meetings and events with members and the public. Other groups use their private group settings to discuss plans of action, rallies,etc.
I won't drop it.

[Coventina]

71. they need to find another platform n/t

[xmas74]

103. It's not going to happen.

We live in a rural red area. They use whatever is available to reach out. We've had people show up because they found a meeting on Facebook. We recently had a group of 10 bikers show up to one meeting in November. One member reached out to the club via messenger and asked a few questions. Nine of those have come back for each meeting since. Five are now volunteering on a couple of campaigns-campaigns they would know nothing about otherwise.

Eliminating what has become a big sources in smaller towns would be eliminating opportunities for members and for those interested. Our local newspaper is now at three issues a week and is known for "losing" submitted club activities. The local radio station is mostly country, high school sports and right wing hate. We send emails but that doesn't help people who've never attended. Our options are limited and our budget is even more so.

[Coventina]

105. Then I weep for our country. We apparently have to service our overlords in order to do anything.

This is freedom?

Pathetic. We are pathetic.

[xmas74]

113. We have $532.24 in our club account.

Figure out an advertising budget from there that can reach as far. Remember,we have other expenses.

Our candidates use Facebook pages to get the word out about their campaigns. Why wouldn't we have a presence to back our candidates? Should we just leave them without a presence backing them on any social media they choose?

We receive messages every day from people asking us questions. Should we eliminate that source?

I'm not making excuses. The fact is social media permeates our lives. Sometimes it makes information gathering easier and sometimes it's for nefarious purposes. Our new guests don't attend because they saw us once at a booth or read a newspaper article. Every single one has said they came to the meeting because if something we shared on Facebook or something we Tweeted that they liked or found important. Every single one since 2016 except the retiree who moved in with his daughter found us on social media.

[Coventina]

115. I'm not saying you should stop. I just find it pathetic is all. We only survive at the mercy of

our overlords.

[xmas74]

201. It is what it is.

Social media has become a necessary evil.

[womanofthehills]

183. I live outside a very small town, and the mayor uses Facebook to keep us informed

Locals post info on events, robberies, missing animals - so I feel I need to be in the loop. Our town is pretty divided politically. I would say I have about 6 town Republican friends on Facebook. They do a lot of re-posting of Republican total lies. So many of us have been asking them to explain what they are posting and usually they have no clue. Two backed down this week from their posts - a woman apologized and a man admitted he knew nothing about what he re-posted. On a positive side, our mayor is a young gay Hispanic local guy who is a Dem and is not afraid to post as a Dem online and call Trump out. He has done so much for this town compared to previous mayors that he is pretty much loved my all..

I also have to keep an eye on what my grandson is posting online.

[usaf-vet]

51. Done months ago!

[jrthin]

53. I dropped Facebook 3 years ago, when I realized they were

nefariously envolved in 2016.

[bucolic_frolic]

56. If I were an employer

I would say "We don't care about your social media at all. Our successful applicants demonstrate rigorous competence and suitability for their positions."

[Ponietz]

57. apologists and hard heads keep splashing through that sewer because they have to travel--

maintaining they only use the clean parts and never imagining there are roads above them paved of gold

[ProudMNDemocrat]

58. Facebook is key to my business...

From all over the country and world. I keep busy with Costuming commissions because of FB.

I am selective to what groups I belong to, however.

[aikoaiko]

59. Facebook is still a great way to stay in contact with friends and family.

I have been amazed at the kindness and blessings of reconnecting with old acquaintances through my 50 years of life and making new friends because they post on my friends' pages. Of course I don't like what everyone posts and I'm stunned at some of my conservative friends, but such is life in a diverse world.


The fake Pelosi video is obvious satire.

[Coventina]

75. Because apparently telephones, email, and the USPS don't exist anymore.....

[leftstreet]

81. Because you'd never get scammed or spammed that way

[Coventina]

86. Scams exist everywhere. However, it is a CRIME to defraud

through the US Mail, and telephone.
Email is also getting more tightly regulated, and it is also FAR more easy for the user to control.

Your comparison fails.

[aikoaiko]

87. Of course they do, but I don't know most of the phone number or email addresses of my FB friends.

I have about 700 FB friends and a majority of them are people who reached out to me and I never would have thought they would be interested in keeping in touch.

FB is really difficult to duplicate in real life.

[Coventina]

90. So basically you don't care. n/t

[aikoaiko]

96. Of course I care, but the pro-boycott crowd hasn't made a compelling case for boycotting.

Saying I should use the telephone, email, or mail is really missing the point of why FB is helpful.

[Coventina]

98. If the Cambridge Analytica scandal didn't move you, you're probably lost, then. n/t

[treestar]

200. They aren't as readily usable

Very few would make the effort to call.

You have to make a specific effort. On FB you can just run across them. A post on FB can communicate to all of your friends, not just one.

I have friends I had lost track of but now communicate with on FB. Or those I would not have heard from or called in years.

[Dennis Donovan]

92. No, it was edited to make it look like she tore the speech during the Tuskegee airman intro

That's NOT satire, as it's not even remotely humorous. That was intentional disinformation.

[aikoaiko]

93. Editing a video can be satire and satire doesn't have to humorous.

I get it that someone might look at it and get the wrong impression of what really happened, but that true of the Onion, too.

[Dennis Donovan]

102. Editing a video *explicitly to deceive* is considered "satire"?

sat·ire
/ˈsaˌtī ə r/

noun
the use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.

Surely, you don't think Speaker Pelosi is stupid or has many vices.

[aikoaiko]

126. The video isn't for you or me.

No, I don't think Pelosi is stupid and have no idea of her vices.

But as I said the video is not intended for you or me. Satire is funny like that.

[barbtries]

60. No.

I am in touch with my extended family, my Durham Democratic Women, My Durham Dems, and a bunch of other NC/Triangle progressive groups through fb. This is not true of any other platform and I have Twitter (where I am a resister 24/7) and Instagram (which I hate the interface) as well.

4 kids in my family. Parents long dead. Brother, OR, Sister, WA, Brother, CA, me, NC. Son and family in CA. Nieces and nephews and great nieces and nephews in AZ, OK, AR, GA, MA, WA, FL, PA, KS.

I police my timeline and block idiots liberally. I always check the source on stories even when they come from DU, and even though Twitter has made the conscientious decision to not run political ads, there are plenty of people posting stuff directly from the campaign, and a lot of bots. a LOT of bots.

On fb, I raise the consciousness of fb friends and loved ones with political posts (2 of my siblings are foxbots), but also share what I cooked today and how my little puppy is growing, as well as my grief when my old dog died. And I enjoy this same content from others.

As far as denying fb the revenue, sure I would like to do that. But let's get real, every social media platform is doing the same thing. Our data is mined to hell and back. outer space and back. it is there. Bad actors, russian bots, republicans, they're everywhere.

So no.

[totodeinhere]

65. I use Facebook for my business and our Facebook page has quite an active

community. Just dropping Facebook like a hot potato would create problems. And since my Facebook activity is mainly about my business the Facebook algorithm rarely recommends any questionable content to me.

[democratisphere]

66. Fakebook is totally drumpf corrupted..

Choose groups carefully, then dump the drumpf political ads and the rest.

[seta1950]

68. Exactly

I dropped it 3 years ago.

[volstork]

72. Did this 2 years ago.

Initially "deactivated" my account prior to the 2012 election, then deleted entirely after the 2016 election. Don't miss it one iota.

[Oldem]

74. Sounds like you're (mostly)

preaching to the choir. I dumped FB two years ago. It felt like a useless gesture at the time, a one-man boycott. From the looks of these responses, one person at a time might make a difference, but I doubt it. MZ will keep making millions from those in his bubble, and we'll have to fight harder and harder to overcome his influence in November. Come to think of it, that's another excellent reason to flip the Senate: regulate FB and break it up.

[chia]

85. "It's become 4chan for Nanas and Grampas." The absolute best description for what FB has become

[lunasun]

89. Some think they are free of all influences on FB but this article shows how deep they target

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/03/the-2020-disinformation-war/605530/
And not just fb

[Ferrets are Cool]

94. Can't unless I want my business to plummet like a rock.

I prefer to have a roof over my head. It's not as easy as you make it sound.

[Coventina]

101. This is what I truly don't understand about FB and businesses.

If I'm surfing the internet looking for a product or service, as soon as I discover their main portal is FB, I immediately eliminate them.
Up until the last election, it wasn't due to FB's policies or bad behavior, it was simply because I don't have a FB account which immediately excluded me from, say, coupons or loyalty programs or what have you.

So, my business has always gone to businesses that have their own websites. (And it will remain so).

[Ferrets are Cool]

106. Real estate agents use FB extensively to get the word out about their listings...

I share those threads when I shoot them. They appreciate the help.
There are exceptions to your "rule".

[Coventina]

114. What is my rule? I was just explaining how FB impedes my purchasing.

If you say that there are ways to use FB on the back end, non-customer-facing side I believe you.

[Ferrets are Cool]

163. "as soon as I discover their main portal is FB, I immediately eliminate them. "

I was assuming "that" was your rule. No offence meant.

[Coventina]

166. oh, yeah, I guess it's a personal rule.

Thanks, sorry I wasn't more clear.

[Blue_Adept]

107. It's more like this

A website business has multiple roads that take you by it.

Most of the roads are your standard two-line community roads in the burbs.

Facebook is the six-lane highway that drives by your front door and you have billboards on the highway highlighting your existence.

You cut that off, then you're cutting off a huge amount of access to getting people to your business.

And most of the time it's a percentage so high that you might as well just close down instead.

[Coventina]

117. I guess I'll have to take your word for it, because now I avoid FB using businesses like the plague.

(granted, there may be businesses I patronize that have FB accounts that I'm unaware of).

[Blue_Adept]

123. Yes, practically every business.

Including Democratic Underground.

Every news outlet

Every broadcast and cable network

etc etc

[Ferrets are Cool]

164. Good synopsis.

Many times we here on DU tend to forget that "we" are an exception to the rule. Most of America is not as attuned to politics or news of consequence as we are. I know that seems pretentious, but it is my opinion.

[Chemisse]

111. I've cut back.

It's still the only way I have of communicating with friends and family though.

As a family, we're thinking of making a family site outside of FB. I'm fearful it will get less attention because it won't be part of people's daily on-line travels. We'll see. We're worried about the privacy of our kids and grandkids in the future.

[WestLosAngelesGal]

116. I like Twitter a lot better

I am only on Facebook because it is a way for me to see videos and pics of my grandkids that no one ever emails me. I rarely post there, but I have also used it to message my family in an emergency when my phone was dead. I only have a few posts there.

[tinrobot]

118. Take control of your feed. Use the unfollow button liberally.

If my friends post too much political crap, they get unfollowed. I'll re-follow them next December.

If I get a stupid ad for a politician, It gets unfollowed.

I also don't post anything political.

My feed is mostly just my friends talking about normal stuff.

[Botany]

120. Theresa Hong... Trump's social media director,

"Without Facebook we couldn't have won."

Russia used Facebook relentlessly in 2016. Mark Zuckerberg was well aware of it too.

[IronLionZion]

121. You can drop it. I like to keep an eye on the other side

to see what lies they're spreading, and to see which people are dumb enough to believe it.

[John1956PA]

131. +1

I do the same.

[grantcart]

124. Never joined

[John1956PA]

129. Welcome to DU!

[dewsgirl]

128. I did three years ago, not much luck changing anyone else's

mind though. Almost everyone I know uses FB, actually that's pretty much all they use the internet for, they would be much happier without it.

[mzmolly]

135. I'm torn,

as I think some have to stay and set the record straight? On the other hand, I hate any financial gain I contribute to.

Still pondering what's best...

[LisaM]

137. Twitter is worse.

They have dangerously enabled Trump. People here post his Tweets all the time

Reddit is had, too. They spawned 4chan.

[Dennis Donovan]

143. Twitter has policies intended to curb the spread of disinfo, and works with 3rd party vendors...

...like Bot Sentinel to help make the platform more useful to those who want to weed out the shit tweets. Reddit, however, is like the wild west. There's some moderation that keeps it from becoming 4chan on steroids, but it's generally a worthless cesspool.

[LisaM]

150. Twitter gives Trump a platform.

I have never seen him use Facebook. Twitter won't enforce their own policies against Trump.

They won't take down the video either.

They also have hide functions.

[scarletwoman]

138. Easy for me, I was never on Facebook in the first place.

Somehow my life hasn't suffered one bit from the lack.

I have a telephone for keeping up with the people I care about. I also visit friends and family face-to-face where possible, and use the U.S. Mail for connecting with those who are far away. There is also plain old email for electronic communication, when suitable/needed.

The time I spend on DU is all the screen time I care to have in my life.

I appreciate your plea. I do wish people would understand that no matter how "smart" they are about using that platform, their participation is not a neutral action, it still serves to feed the Beast.

[Dennis Donovan]

140. I get the need for some to maintain a FB presence for business...

...although if they're paying FB to promote that presence, they're kinda feeding the beast.

[MartyTheGreek]

139. Fake Book is my Battle Space with MAGA's - My position Paper on FB...

in-part...

"Much like today on Fake Book. Most of you really don’t know me, but to play the game, I allow you to peer into my life like a voyeur. You create a vision in your mind of what tribe I’m from and if you want to impress your dudes and women you may want to readily call me a Snowflake, a special somebody not like any other. A term which I laugh at, because it’s really a simpleton tag and I just roll with it. So here we are many in this fake artificial room hiding behind tech and screens where we can say anything we want to, to somebody and get away with it broadcasting our positions on politics, life, and cheese cake pictures. What we don’t realize is that our hunger to be known, heard, and be somebody is at the expense of taking risk of losing an organic friend that you once knew in person maybe quickly lost because many have devoted their energy and emotions to their broadcasting network. Their own TV channel, their presence, existence and even acting as part of their being like it’s a personality attached to their hip that they can’t live without. Did you ever think about how many kids committed suicide because they were bullied on Fake Book?

That just goes to show how the power of this façade, this tech, can affect someone. The younger the mind, the greater the impact. You can be an adult and still have a very young mind unless you have been hardened in some way. Just think you can pretend to be any one you want and if it tightens your tribe and you’re into “group think” this may be the perfect place for you or not. I choose the not. I still play the game but I’m not gonna call you stupid or try to offend you while your tribe waits for your response. I like posting facts, love to debate, and when I see bullshit, I’m gonna call it out. Sorry, that’s me! I like exercising my rights too!"

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212927865

[PoindexterOglethorpe]

141. Sorry. Not going to.

I find it a useful way to keep in touch with various people. I have zero interest in Twitter, which seems to be even worse at spreading lies.

Most of the things I see on my FB page are people who are either complaining or bragging (I find it hard to figure out which is going on) about being depressed or bi-polar or unemployed or some other sad life situation. I don't get very much political content on what I see, and I tend to ignore what I do see there.

And, had it not been for FB, when a young person I knew took his own life, it would have been weeks, maybe months, before all his friends found out. FB was instrumental in organizing a memorial service for him.

So no, I'm not leaving FB.

[marybourg]

144. This nana has always refused to use it.

But— this tops it all, at least to me. I showed my next door neighbor a picture of my children taken over the holidays. They had emailed it to me as a jpeg. My neighbor said “ oh that’s your children? That appeared on my FB page a few weeks ago, under the heading “ you may know these people”.

[mshasta]

146. I had Facebook once back in the days and never need it never will

My kids don’t used it they said is for grandma

[LisaM]

147. I wish people would boycott Amazon.

They won't. Amazon has done great harm where I live (Seattle). They lock workers in warehouses.

GrubHub and Postmates and similar services have grievously harmed the restaurant industry.

Airbnb has been proven to drive up rents.

Uber and Lyft have contributed to giant increases in traffic congestion and routinely break the law.

So being all holier-than-thou about Facebook and throwing a little ageism in to boot seems a little annoying. If you tell me you also boycott Instagram, Amazon, Twitter, Hobby Lobby, any gig economy service, AirBnb, Reddit, Yelp, and MeWe, then your request might have some merit.

[Blue_Adept]

149. Pushes for proper regulation would work better than boycotts for a lot of these areas.

[marybourg]

152. Absolutely!

[LisaM]

157. Then the same is true for Facebook.

I have a friend who just left Facebook for MeWe. Then I read up a little on MeWe and how hate groups are moving there to avoid some of Facebook's restrictions!

The gig economy is seriously screwed up, yet I know lots of people who won't give up Uber. And they check Yelp for reviews, and have Prime subscriptions, even though their express delivery is toxic for the environment.

And I repeat that Twitter is worse. They enable Trump more than any other platform.

[Blue_Adept]

160. Completely agree

I'm not pro-delete facebook as it cedes too much of the social media world to those that will use it badly.

Better to regulate it like a utility.

[Kashkakat v.2.0]

167. Its not an either-or question - boycott IS a tried and true method of applying a "push" nt

[jr1118x]

151. That seems like the opposite of what should do

Facebook and Twitter are so integrated into our culture both personally and on business levels. If the RW is using it to exploitation and propaganda, all you are doing by clicking is giving ground to them to spread their hate, unchallenged. The RW already is much more successful in messaging, do we really want to concede two of the most powerful social media tools on the planet. Do you believe large enough numbers of people will really quit, their penetration shows that their not adding new members but unless something were to drive multiple millions of users away it is unlikely to decline that fast

Many Americans simply don't care about politics or news. In one study only 63% of people said they actually seek out or read the news. Is it likely that those people are going to quit FB because of fake Nancy Pelosi videos? Seems like we might be able to at least "accidentally" reach some of the people not actively looking.
http://mediainsight.org/PDFs/Journalism%202018/Americans_News_Media_Report_2018.pdf

A more concerning survey shows liberal/progressives are more likely to have stopped talking politics. https://www.journalism.org/2020/02/05/a-sore-subject-almost-half-of-americans-have-stopped-talking-politics-with-someone/ That means we are losing the messaging war even more when we shut up.

If they are using FB and Twitter for Propaganda instead of giving up the platform, I wonder why we are not using it the same way but for our side. If they can make videos why can't we? Well at least those of us that have the technical ability to.

[leftstreet]

165. +1

Nicely stated

[Polybius]

169. I can't but I'm aware of what's fake news

If the link isn't from a major news source that I've heard of, I pass.

[AncientGeezer]

170. No thanks.....I like pointing out the fake crap to posters of BS..pisses them off.

Let's say We all quit as you'd like....they will still be there..spreading crap with nobody to counter it. People will be duped......I say become more active on joints spreading BS. Quitting won't make that video go away. It's all over the 'net

And also families.....for some, that's all they have for connections and sharing stuff.

[treestar]

171. There are liberal groups

Just join some of them. I haven’t seen misinformation. There are some who troll liberal groups. But they get their asses handed to them.

[Runningdawg]

173. I go for months at a time without seeing a single person

or hearing the sound of a voice I know. Yeah FB sucks, but I'm not willing to give up the small amount of entertainment and social interaction I have left to please the PC crowd.

[pamela]

181. I'm with you.

I live thousands of miles from my family. There are weeks when my husband is the only person I speak to, other than the occasional stranger. Sure, there are other ways to keep up with family, see and share photos, but I would have to convince my family to switch to another platform. I just unfollow the people who post right wing stuff.

[Skittles]

175. they won't

they would have to actually put effort into "keeping up with family and friends"

[CaliforniaPeggy]

177. I want you to knock this off. I am staying on Facebook. PERIOD.

My family is there.

My poetry friends are there.

My photo friends are there.

My political friends are there.

We plan, talk, dream, exchange ideas, have fun, all of that and more, there.

Goddamn it, I am fucking fed up with hearing about all the sins of Facebook. I know they exist. I am not affected by them.

[pnwmom]

178. Nope. Ninety percent of my posts are political or issue related, and I'm NOT going to stop.

Some idealistic DUers dropping FB won't do a thing to change Zuckerman's mind about anything. But every day I can post articles with actual facts that occasionally do influence someone's thinking. (For example, today I posted Professor Heather Cox Richardson's great column.)

Why should I let the Trump lies people post go unanswered, when I can respond with an article from Snopes, or Politifact, or the WA Post, or whatever local newspaper I know a friend respects?

Also, I have some friends from once living in a southern state, and I keep up with them on a private group. Progressives in red states need us to network with. They need to know they're not as alone as they sometimes feel.

[Croney]

179. Nanas and Grampas are people too!

Why single us out? If you think I'm too stupid to understand clickbait and fake news, well... you might be ageist.

My 97-year-old mother loves FB and her favorite thing to share is Ellen videos.

Sure, I see people getting taken in by right-wing crap. I report things. I delete things. I support and like the good comments. I only have 40 friends, mostly relatives.

Pictures of the great-grandkids make FB worthwhile for this Nana.

[obamanut2012]

180. no

carry on

[dweller]

182. i might

when Dan Rather does, but like reading his posts there... so

✌🏼

[Different Drummer]

184. You do you; I'll do me.

That is all.

[Rhiannon12866]

185. Unfortunately, not everyone is on DU, so haven't seen the damning news articles

From recent years. And don't necessarily follow the latest news.

[Cosmocat]

186. More than simply demanding people drop FB

There needs to be a viable similar platform to move to.

With the same broad menbership, capacity to build subgroups, interoperativity with other apps and services, etc.

[Dennis Donovan]

187. No one demanded anything

[Cosmocat]

188. "A plea for all DUers who haven't already done so. Drop Facebook like a rock, please?"

The please was nice and all, but this is a direct call to action.

Look, I get it, it is now mostly a cesspool of right wing fuck wittery.

But, the point stands that there is no other broadly used platform that provides the connectivity to family, friends and community that Facebook does. At the bare minimum, most small businesses and local communities use Facebook to connect to their audience and community.

Me personally:

* Though it has been greatly diminished by purges both by me and those I know, it still is my primary connectivity to a lot of the people I know.

* It the primary social media (by far) platform for the non-profit I manage.

* It is the primary social media platform for:
Our neighborhood.
Our Township.
The Town we are adjacent to.
Dozens of other interests and groups that I am involved with or follow.

* It also is my "login" for about a dozen apps or services that I use.

I would GLADLY leave Facebook you can give the platform that does even 75% of this ...

[Dennis Donovan]

189. You understand the meaning of "plea," don't you? It's actually in the subject line...

It's actually in the subject line... Wow...

[Blue_Adept]

191. You understand how a plea can come across as a demand?

[Dennis Donovan]

192. No, please explain... n/t

[Blue_Adept]

193. Sorta the same way asking for a favor is like blackmail or extortion

[Dennis Donovan]

194. That involved a quid pro quo

Now, if I told people I would give them a DU Valentine heart if they dropped FB, then you might be onto something. However, there was no quid pro quo, only a plea.

Your argument is DOA.

[Cosmocat]

198. Whatever - the point is that there is no similar alternative

Demand, plea, pretty please, whatever, what option exists to replace it?

[Blue_Tires]

195. There's still some girlies on there I gotta talk to...

[CousinIT]

196. Done a long time ago! HIGHLY RECOMMEND it! n/t

[Proud Liberal Dem]

197. You get out of social media

pretty much what you put in. There is a lot of garbage on there to be sure, but it's not entirely like it just comes to you (some ads do but you can block/hide them). You can follow/friend whomever and whatever you want to and you can stay safe(r) from disinformation if you are using your critical thinking skills at all times. Yes, there is abuse and harassment on social media and some of the platforms don't do as good of a job as they should in some cases, but, still, there are lots of ways to ways you can fend off unwanted interactions that don't require moderators. I'm not advocating for you to get back on there if you don't want to be there, but for those of us whom enjoy it, it's not impossible to have a safe and satisfying experience on social media.

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

199. Already done... Stopped a little over a year ago now.

I never liked Facebook anyhow. Posts range from boring to upsetting. Nothing much good there.

[tritsofme]

202. It's a good way to keep in touch with family and old friends.

No more complicated than that. The self righteous indignation in this thread has been turned up to 11.

[marlakay]

203. Thats why I use it and for some private

Groups. If I quit all of them that I like to keep in touch with would still be there. I don’t know some of them enough to get phone number and I am not a phone person anyway.

[KG]

204. I lulz'd

nope.

[Dennis Donovan]

205. I lulz...

...at those so addicted to a social media platform that they cannot see how it's destroying democracy.