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Jesus, how far is this going to go? (Original Post) thegoose Jan 2020 OP
Power perverts Bucky Jan 2020 #1
It's pretty clear that "our" party isn't accepting their ridiculous assertions. TwilightZone Jan 2020 #2
read this copied from another post here. Grasswire2 Jan 2020 #3
This was always the danger of impeachment Recursion Jan 2020 #4

Bucky

(53,795 posts)
1. Power perverts
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:00 PM
Jan 2020

So it's not surprising that I powerful country in the perverted government. I'm struggling to come up with a historical examples that violate that rule of thumb.

TwilightZone

(25,342 posts)
2. It's pretty clear that "our" party isn't accepting their ridiculous assertions.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:07 PM
Jan 2020

That's been obvious since day one.

Grasswire2

(13,564 posts)
3. read this copied from another post here.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:37 PM
Jan 2020

These are the stakes.



What will be lost, legally and logically, by a Senate Acquittal?

What precedents will be set? What are the destructive actions that will be set in motion?

1. Separation of Powers, a Constitutional fundamental, will be dissolved. There will no longer be co-equal branches of government. The Senate will have approved of actions by Trump that express a "unitary executive", devoid of checks and balances. This will be a permanent precedent that the Senate will establish.

2. Congressional oversight, an Article 1 governmental underpinning, will be dissolved. The executive branch will no longer be accountable to Congress. It can ignore subpoenas, requests for records and documents, and requests for executive branch officials to appear before Congress.

3. The Article 1 clause regarding impeachment itself will be dissolved if the Senate votes to acquit. It is the Senate majority argument that the most egregious of violations of a president's oath of office (as stated in the Founders' arguments for impeachment) can be dismissed as not serious enough for removal from office. Thus, there will be NO threshold to cross that activates removal from office.

4. With all of the barriers to impeachment and removal dissolved, the president can feel unencumbered by Constitutional limitations on power. Just as Trump is currently in the hunt for foreign propaganda to influence the coming election, he'll continue to do so all the way to November, knowing that there is no institution or government entity that can stop him from cheating in any way he can to win the next election. That's because he'll know that he can NEVER be removed from office, and he can manipulate the campaign-- and the election data, in any way he sees fit.

5. With a nullified and powerless Constitution being shredded daily, the power vacuum will be filled by Trump, who will then have the option to turn this democratic republic into a dictatorship. All of the elements for a dictatorship will be in place AFTER THE ACQUITTAL.

6. Remember the Patriot Act? We'd BETTER remember the Patriot Act, because it gives Trump the power to manufacture a national security emergency in order to cancel the election. It will be within his power to do so. If you're thinking that the "manufacturing" part will make it invalid, think again. By the time Congress gets the news, it will already be too late. A dictator doesn't have to wait for approval. Besides, this Acquittal will already have rendered Congressional oversight to be impotent.

Are we following the Bouncing Ball yet?

For those who minimize the logical consequences of an Acquittal, I have a comment: the Trump Party is well aware of these logical consequences. They all support the unitary executive assertions that AG Barr loves. They all support a "permanent Republican majority" goal, set in motion by Newt Gingrich and Tom DeLay in the 1980s, which includes gerrymandering, manipulating voting machines, changing voting data in servers, and radio/TV markets saturated with right wing propaganda. And now, Trump will be given explicit permission to pull in propaganda efforts by FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS, unhindered by Congress or any other entity.

Why is this NOT part of the general discussion regarding impeachment and removal? Where are the legal scholars/celebrities who are on every news program, warning the viewers and anyone else of the logical and legal consequences of an acquittal? The most consequential decision in US History is about to be made, and the entire Fourth Estate, AND the Democratic Party, are tragically silent.

For those who are reluctant to call out the real and historic crisis that is unfolding RIGHT NOW, fearing that it might panic the population: IT IS TIME TO PANIC. It will be too late after the Acquittal.

When the Senate acquits, the Constitution dies.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212889779

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
4. This was always the danger of impeachment
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:49 PM
Jan 2020

Handing Trump a "vindicated!" news cycle never seemed like a great idea to me.

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