House Dems Say Trump Made 'Chilling Assertion' In Senate Summons Response

[deminks]

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/house-democrats-response-trump-senate-summons

In response to the White House arguing in a filing Saturday that the impeachment articles are “constitutionally invalid,” House impeachment managers wrote in a formal response Monday that President Trump made a “chilling assertion” by arguing that the Senate cannot remove him from office even if the House validates the articles of impeachment.

The nine-page response released Monday reiterates the House Democrats’ argument in a trial brief sent Saturday evening that Trump “jeopardized our national security and our democratic self-governance” and “used his Presidential powers to orchestrate a cover-up.”

“President Trump maintains that the Senate cannot remove him even if the House proves every claim in the Articles of impeachment. That is a chilling assertion. It is also dead wrong,” the impeachment managers wrote. “The Framers deliberately drafted a Constitution that allows the Senate to remove Presidents who, like President Trump, abuse their power to cheat in elections, betray our national security, and ignore checks and balances. That President Trump believes otherwise, and insists he is free to engage in such conduct again, only highlights the continuing threat he poses to the Nation if allowed to remain in office. ”

(end snip)

So, the Orange Jesus won't leave even if the Senate votes to remove him.

[pbmus]

1. Bill Maher has been saying this for 2 years..

[Grasswire2]

3. Cohen and Deutsch pretty much say the same thing.

Buckle up.

[Cosmocat]

55. Yeah, I said/posted this the night of the election

nm

[guillaumeb]

2. Recommended.

Will he order his followers to build a big, beautiful wall around the White House?

[pangaia]

28. no they will do much, much worse..

[monmouth4]

4. The Marshals may step in and change his mind for him..nt

[pangaia]

29. uhh.. I really don;t think so....

[monmouth4]

37. The moment the new President states "So help me God" on the

steps of the Capital, Trump will become a trespasser in the White House and the Secret Service guys will pick him up bodily if necessary, and carry him out to the corner of Pennsylvania Avenue and Lafayette Park, drop him and close the gate to the property behind them.

This from a poster further down the thread.

[paleotn]

38. Yes, actually, they will.

[StarfishSaver]

44. Yes, they would

[pangaia]

65. you are much more knowledgable than i am

.. and much better at expressing what you think is going on.

BUT. I would be willing to bet you an omakase meal at SUSHI SO in West L A that if trump loses he will NOT be gone.

[StarfishSaver]

66. He may not be gone right away

But when a court orders him off the premises, the marshals will haul him out.

[pangaia]

68. My typo-- SUSHI ZO !!

[NewJeffCT]

5. In the unlikely event he is convicted

he is no longer president. End of story. Pence would be Commander in Chief, and if he doesn't leave, US marshalls get to drag him out

[2naSalit]

10. +1

And a couple-few million of us to back them up.

[shanti]

25. I would volunteer

in a heartbeat.

[Wednesdays]

12. Pence would be commander in chief then, right?

If so, rump would be removed only upon Pence's orders, correct?

Just a thought: what if Pence refuses to remove him, then becomes president in name only, deferring all decision making to rump?

[NewJeffCT]

13. I doubt it -I think pence wants power as well

more likley, he'd pardon Trump for any and all federal crimes.

[Nasruddin]

16. Why would he bother?

Why would Pence feel any need or interest in pardoning Mr Trump? He's been dragged thru it just as much as any other Republican ... his personal ethics surely aren't in concordance with the the way Mr Trump has led his life. I just don't see it.

If he was another psychopath, he would of course make any kind of deal necessary to get rid of Mr Trump, & then completely renege on it. (See Gerald Ford in Wikipedia.)

So either way, what's the benefit?

[dajoki]

19. The benefit is...

that he keeps the nut jobs riled up.

[Nasruddin]

22. The Irishman

For review, see the recent movie "The Irishman", & consider the history of Jimmy Hoffa & Frank Fitzsimmons.

Pence has no chance of capturing the nut jobs. I think Mr Trump is sui generis & that's it. Pence does have a better shot with evangelicals (since he really is one). If he's up to it (probably not - I hear he didn't run Indiana very well) he could set up as a conservative reformer, clean house a little, & let Mr Trump twist & solve his own problems. You know, a return to normalcy. Worked before for Republicans.

[pangaia]

30. may i ask, why do you call him mr trump?

Of course you are a Mullah, so you are always respectful.

[Thunderbeast]

31. Pence is a co-conspirator in the same damn crime!

If the constitution really worked, his removal would happen ten minutes before the vote to remove Trump!

I have been saying for years that the House should elect Hillary Clinton as House Speaker (does not need to be a member) before removing Trump AND Pence.

Let me have my fantasy of a just world.

[Nasruddin]

35. Sure, they all need to go

[jmowreader]

42. You can't pardon an impeached person, according to the Constitution

Trump will be either locked up in New York State Prison or whacked by his Russian business associates if he’s thrown out of office. I would NOT be surprised if the New York Attorney General has people at the impeachment hearing to take Trump into custody if the Senate does the right thing.

[StarfishSaver]

46. Yes, you can

The Constitution doesn't prohibit an impeached person from being pardoned. It simply prohibits a president from using the pardon power to prevent someone from being impeached. For example, if the House decided to impeach Barr, Trump couldn't protect him from being impeached by pardoning him. He could still pardon him from being charged on federal court for committing federal crimes. But even if Trump pardoned him, Barr could still be impeached.

Capisce?

[Pacifist Patriot]

60. This gets really confusing at times with the overlap in vocabulary.

I thought the person above was saying you cannot pardon the impeachment conviction (which would be correct as the concept of a pardon doesn't even apply to impeachment), not that you cannot pardon someone who has been impeached from criminal charges. That would be incorrect. If Trump is convicted of impeachment and removed from office, Pence could indeed pardon Trump of all federal charges. In which case, the NY AG could still proceed with criminal charges at the state level.

My brain hurts.

[Pacifist Patriot]

59. Indeed. A pardon is a judicial term while impeachment is a political one.

The one and only penalty for being convicted of impeachment is removal from office. The concept of a pardon does not apply in any way whatsoever to an impeachment.

But a conviction in an impeachment trial would render him extremely vulnerable to criminal prosecution. Pence could pardon him for all federal crimes, but the NY AG could certainly charge him with state crimes.

Yep, if the Senate does the right thing, ideally the NY AG would step in at that point.

Now if the Senate would just do the right thing. Sigh.

[Zolorp]

34. Riddle me this. What if Pence refuses to take the oath claiming the Senate could not remove?

He may fear turning on Trump if they remove and may claim Trump is still president so he cannot take the oath.

[gristy]

41. All hell would certainly break loose at that point

The dems may assert that if Pence refuses the presidency, then Pelosi will take it.

But I think Pence would take the oath. At what distance he would keep tRump I have no idea.

[sprinkleeninow]

51. I don't feel pounce is that far gone screwy even if he is a

reptilican.

[Cosmocat]

56. Dude, hes spent tgree years

Gazing lovingly at 45 and dutifully doing the dirt for him.

[sprinkleeninow]

57. Ah, yes, but the mere thought of him snagging the office of

el presidente could go to his pasty stepford head.

he say donald who? never met the guy, don't know nuthin about him...

[Cosmocat]

58. possibly

As low as my regard was for him, it has been remarkable how he has been completely servile to the POS.

He is twisted enough that I can see where he would recognize how this would further our decent into a chrisofascist state and continue to be Robin to 45s batman toward moving us into a long standing, Russian style balls out corrupt state government.

[sprinkleeninow]

69. Watch. Surprise, surprise. Enuff repubes vote to oust

orangeous and pounce fills the void.

Everbody (r's) do happy dance.
Yippy-yi-oh-kai-yay!

[I have virtually no clue how this'll all play out.]

[lastlib]

70. He can leave on his own peacefully,,,

or he can be dragged out BODILY by me and a few million of my friends.

[handmade34]

6. starting at 1 minute mark

[FirstLight]

7. ...well...I have always envisioned him being dragged from the premises in some form...

Likely in a straightjacket & strapped to a gurney, foaming fully a` la King George III, screaming intelligibly "covefe!!" knbfoksjbhfpiaijbf "emails" ihndfoiuhsfnhjaslkj "Perfect!!!!"

[Evolve Dammit]

8. Rules are for SUCKERS! All dictators say it in one form or another..

We don't need no stinkin' (fill in the blank), rules, laws, policies, guidance, precedent, morals, scruples, commandments, etc., etc.

[mahina]

9. Imagine if you were of the R Senators and you had a chance

To get rid of this bully.

We know they are cowards but in this situation the have a chance to get rid of him. He bullies them as much as or more than anyone.

Wouldn’t you take a shot when you knew it was your last?

I bet Mitch isn’t the only one counting. I bet Mitt’s counting too.

[NJCher]

11. agreed

Last edited Tue Jan 21, 2020, 12:39 PM - Edit history (1)

and as far as refusing to vacate the White House, that would be laughable. In truth he will slink out the back door. He's a bully and at the heart of every bully is a coward.

And don't think it hasn't happened before, just in the reverse. When bush stole the WH the first time around, we protesters pelted him and Cheney with tomatoes and eggs as they attempted to walk down PA Ave. They only walked about 500' and couldn't take it anymore. They didn't walk into the Capitol, they snuck in the back door.

[Nasruddin]

17. Maybe

"In truth he will slink out the back door. He's a bully ... a coward."
True, but there are a great many other people without his vote - getting charm, whose livelihoods & maybe life depends on Mr Trump staying in place & keeping the grift and Naziism going. Mr Trump is in a trap & he's not going to go anywhere willingly.

[beveeheart]

61. Don't you mean Bush and Cheney?

[NJCher]

64. thnx

will correct that

[leftieNanner]

23. Oh, yes, Mitt is counting!

Anne still has her prom dress pressed and ready (the one she wore on election night 2012).

They could boot Trump, install Pence as President, and put Mitt in as VP.

[LudwigPastorius]

14. The entirety of Trump's defense:

[gab13by13]

15. If Trump loses the 2020 election he will not leave.

Who is going to remove him?

He owns the DOJ, looks like he owns the NSA and CIA, and is putting his people in the military.

I repeat, who is going to remove him?

[Perseus]

20. You are giving the con too much power

A new president will order whoever he/she sees fit to remove both, the con and his lapdog Barr.

The con doesn't have magic powers, he is no Superman, or Harry Potter (hehe), he is just a buffoon, and I bet a lot of people in the military will salivate at the thought of carrying that asshole out of the WH.

Stop giving the con so much power, he doesn't have it, I bet that 98% of the people in the administration hate his guts, I would not be surprised if they dream with kicking the bastard all they way out the WH like a soccer ball.

[A HERETIC I AM]

21. The Secret Service

If anyone actually thinks he is going to succeed in refusing to leave, I’m sorry, but you don’t understand how dedicated to the constitution most that work in government really are.

Once the joint session counts the electoral college votes in early January, the election is official and if those results show Trump lost, he can whine all he wants for the next two weeks, but it won’t matter.

If he refuses to participate in any of the formalities of Inauguration Day and sequesters himself in the residence, the INSTANT the president elect says the words “So Help Me God” on the steps of the Capital, Trump will become a trespasser in the White House and the Secret Service guys will pick him up bodily if necessary, and carry him out to the corner of Pennsylvania Avenue and Lafayette Park, drop him and close the gate to the property behind them.

His followers can whine all they want as well, but I absolutely guarantee that if he loses the election fair and square, he will not be in the White House at 1 PM on the 20th of January.

[leftieNanner]

24. Thank you. I agree.

But it's the "fair and square" part that gives me the willies.

[louis-t]

26. Better bring 4 really strong guys.

He weighs a ton.

[jmowreader]

43. That's what electric pallet jacks are for

If Trump refuses to leave the White House when he’s supposed to, the head of the Secret Service will pull out his P. Barnes Signature Series Taser at 12:01 p.m. on January 20, 2021, and pump so much electricity into Trump’s criminal ass you could turn on a streetlight bulb from five feet away. Then they’ll strap him to an electric pallet jack and give him his last ride out of the People’s House.

Reality time: If Trump loses the election, his handlers will explain to him exactly how much damage throwing a temper tantrum will do to his financial situation. People will no longer stay in Trump hotels or play golf at Trump courses. Ivanka won’t be able to find a new manufacturer for her restarted women’s wear line, or women who will want to buy it. Jared will have his loans called in. He will probably just slink out of Washington a few days before the election without telling anyone, skip all the inaugural festivities, and send a nasty tweet about how we didn’t want America to be great. Trump cares about three things: his money, himself and his daughter. He will NOT do anything to endanger any of them.

[Nasruddin]

33. Dedication shmedication

He (or his "team&quot would file lawsuits about the validity of the vote in every possible jurisdiction in every possible way, and do whatever they can to make it impossible to certify the vote.

Meanwhile, they will stir up as much trouble as they possibly can, so if the legal system goes against them, the civil unrest they will have incited will cause a system breakdown. If that doesn't appear to be working, he will declare martial law anyway. Sorry, can't hold the inauguration of that pretender. Maybe later.

Eventually the whole system will probably collapse & he'll be out, because despite his obvious charisma with some, he doesn't inspire enough loyalty in non-believers to make it work. There are plenty of other sociopaths around who think they should be president, & they will take their chances. It will be ugly.

I'm hoping it doesn't go that far. Mr Trump doesn't look or sound well and he can't handle the stress of what's coming on his side. On the other hand, maybe that's the fuel he needs.

[pangaia]

39. We will have to disagree.

That is not how dictatorships work...

[Perseus]

18. Sorry but I have to think this to be an outrageous comment

"So, the Orange Jesus won't leave even if the Senate votes to remove him."

Of course he will, maybe not willingly, but if the Senate does its duty and votes to remove him, he will automatically be disposed of his title, he will no longer have power over the military or anyone else, so HE WILL BE REMOVED.

[pangaia]

40. "automatically be disposed of his title, he will no longer have power over the military ...'

he already has power over almost every functioning government entity.. and it looks like he is little by little (or large by large) taking over the military as well...

[yuiyoshida]

27. I bet he will leave if security grabs him by the back of the neck

and tosses his ass to the sidewalk.

[Aussie105]

32. At which point would Trump's security detail say:

'Yep, ok, fair enough. You can have him.' and then stand back while he is manhandled out the rear door?

[jmowreader]

45. The second the Senate removes him, he doesn't have a security detail

Blackwater Mercenaries do not count.

[StarfishSaver]

47. He would still have a detail, but it wouldn't be a presidential detail

The presidential detail would switch to the new president and he'd get a former presidential detail, which is considerably scaled back.

[jmowreader]

48. Quick question: does a removed president rate a security detail?

IIRC all the benefits of being a president end if you’re kicked out of office.

[StarfishSaver]

49. Yes

There's no distinction in the law providing Secret Service protection of former presidents between retired, resigned or removed presidents.

[turbinetree]

36. His response from his "legal team' shows what he will do if he loses the election.................

he will not leave..............................

[NiteOwl1]

50. I'll call his bluffing idiotic ramblings

I'd say DC would see protests the likes of which nobody could ever imagine.

i'd also say he probably should be very worried about his well being. There's going to be a true patriot somewhere...

[sprinkleeninow]

52. "....the likes of which..."

hahah. one of dumpty's famous phrases. 🤣

Good job! 👊

[NiteOwl1]

53. ... Good catch

You caught that

[sprinkleeninow]

54. And you were fashionably elegant to use it!

[AtheistCrusader]

62. I wonder if this might flip a vote or two?

Nothing like telling the Senate that they don't matter, to get them to do something. Narcissists love being told how little they are worth.

[Javaman]

63. i was called crazy and shouted down a few months back here on DU for saying

that the only way trump leaves the white house, if he loses the election, is via a swat team.

doesn't sound so crazy now, does it?

[notdarkyet]

67. He won't have af1 anymore.