Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Sancho

(9,065 posts)
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 09:24 AM Jan 2020

Hackers may have gained 'almost total control' of an election server in Georgia, report says

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/hackers-may-have-gained-e2-80-98almost-total-control-e2-80-99-of-an-election-server-in-georgia-report-says/ar-BBZ5W5g?fbclid=IwAR1iehh9pbkdpTYyOs_beGNm2PYkVUcmvzWZhx7ZPgpsrDLqKIvKbwHg3Ro

An election security report has revealed evidence of a possible hacking on a Georgia server that may have compromised the state’s voting machines in both 2016 and 2018.

The alleged attack on a Georgia election server was first discovered by Logan Lamb, an election security expert who suggested that hackers may have been able to significantly interfere with state voting data.

If the hackers successfully broke into the server, Mr Lamb said in his report that they likely obtained “almost total control of the server, including abilities to modify files, delete data, and install malware”.

Multiple activist groups have filed a lawsuit arguing that the vulnerabilities would have allowed hackers to manipulate the results of the state’s most recent elections.


More versions of this story continue to come out. In my view, the GOP/Russians/etc. have been hacking DREs, tabulators, and election results as far back as 2000.
83 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Hackers may have gained 'almost total control' of an election server in Georgia, report says (Original Post) Sancho Jan 2020 OP
Very difficult to hack pen and paper.... mwooldri Jan 2020 #1
Check out this shit! Texas is the new Ohio. TheBlackAdder Jan 2020 #4
Texas. Ohio. Mississippi.... the_sly_pig Jan 2020 #43
Oh really,? flying_wahini Jan 2020 #54
I remember when they found the ballot box lids floating in hughee99 Jan 2020 #62
People can see, guard, and count paper ballots Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2020 #59
the chain of custody is one reason to get it right election night questionseverything Jan 2020 #71
Someone still has to program the paper vote counting machine......n/c DENVERPOPS Jan 2020 #55
Hand count? mwooldri Jan 2020 #57
People should count ballots. Elections are more precious than groceries. Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2020 #60
I don't know - soldierant Jan 2020 #64
of course officials would have to gaurd against ballot "stuffing but questionseverything Jan 2020 #72
It only takes one person to "lose" a whole box of ballots. soldierant Jan 2020 #79
well how many voted and what is recorded would need to jive questionseverything Jan 2020 #83
Everybody should remember that Russia attacked all 50 states in 2016 Botany Jan 2020 #2
So True Farmer-Rick Jan 2020 #7
True, but there is another way. aggiesal Jan 2020 #25
TRUE ahlnord Jan 2020 #45
+1 oasis Jan 2020 #51
Yeah, but is that going to happen before the next presidential election? Farmer-Rick Jan 2020 #78
exactly bdamomma Jan 2020 #77
I believe the 2000 SCOTUS decision was the planned beginning of the GOP long range intentions ... usaf-vet Jan 2020 #10
Georgia 2002 was very dirty Botany Jan 2020 #11
I always thought HAVA was "Hack All Votes in America" lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #15
+1 uponit7771 Jan 2020 #17
THIS! cilla4progress Jan 2020 #21
If I remember right, exit polls start deviating with W's 2000 Coup. rickyhall Jan 2020 #24
And explained as faulty polling due to wnylib Jan 2020 #31
When we voted with these machines the exit polls matched the vote Botany Jan 2020 #35
Not necessarily! Back in the 1980's an election was completely screwed up csziggy Jan 2020 #49
Doors Locked fwvinson Jan 2020 #28
Like Jimmy Carter says, Trump did not win in 2016. Hillary is rightful POTUS. triron Jan 2020 #36
And the media has all but killed Jimmy Carter's statement on the 2016 election and ... Botany Jan 2020 #38
The media are complicit in the demise of the republic. But what the hell, more money! triron Jan 2020 #52
We HAVE to return to paper ballots. Yes, we are a big country but WTF. We have to have CurtEastPoint Jan 2020 #3
VA has all paper ballots. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #16
So does Oregon. calimary Jan 2020 #20
What about machine-recorded votes that give wnylib Jan 2020 #33
Pointless. A real recount would require everybody to bring in their receipts. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #44
A recount, if requested or necessary by law wnylib Jan 2020 #56
There is no recount when the primary data storage method is electronic. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #58
Receipts would not be kept by the voter. 56miSSie Jan 2020 #69
That's a very Rube Goldberg way of avoiding real ballots. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #75
hand counted ahlnord Jan 2020 #41
Wasn't that the plan of then sos kemp all along? Kurt V. Jan 2020 #5
I knew it! nt ecstatic Jan 2020 #6
Thank goodness hackers messed up and let Lucy McBath take Newt Gingrich's and Tom Price's Hoyt Jan 2020 #8
+1 padah513 Jan 2020 #39
We must consider this is why republicans are sticking with tRump rainin Jan 2020 #9
some of us have said since jump: THEY HACKED THE VOTES. Baltimike Jan 2020 #12
They hacked the vote but not sure we will ever know the truth. triron Jan 2020 #37
This is so discouraging. llmart Jan 2020 #13
Agree. ananda Jan 2020 #14
Back as far as 2000... 2naSalit Jan 2020 #18
Sounds like we have to do paper counts and wont know the winner till the next day. I'm OK with that uponit7771 Jan 2020 #19
Especially when you consider Horse with no Name Jan 2020 #23
Read my post #25. We don't have to wait unti the next day! n/t aggiesal Jan 2020 #26
Good point, even if its double the time due to increase in voters that's OK with me. Right now there uponit7771 Jan 2020 #29
SCARY part to me is BILL BARR!!! bluestarone Jan 2020 #22
And the GOP doesn't want our election to be secure sakabatou Jan 2020 #27
+1, they're not interested in liberal democracy for the republic any longer and don't know ... uponit7771 Jan 2020 #30
Where are our hackers evertonfc Jan 2020 #32
No doubt in my mind Stacey Abrams won. sarcasmo Jan 2020 #34
Minnesota uses paper ballots. the_sly_pig Jan 2020 #40
Does anyone really think the Russian hackers were just "snooping around"? DonaldsRump Jan 2020 #42
+1. Putin doesn't shell out money for a maybe. This is the psycho who kills a critic. 58Sunliner Jan 2020 #47
No serious person would suggest that. Nt hughee99 Jan 2020 #63
Yes because it creates distrust and loss of faith in the system. nt UniteFightBack Jan 2020 #65
No I call bullshit. It was to get Trump and republicans in office. triron Jan 2020 #66
I'm talking about tampering with votes. They did plenty of other shit to help him get into UniteFightBack Jan 2020 #67
So am I. I know there are lots whp believe like you. triron Jan 2020 #70
Where the fuck are the Hackers for Democracy? CrispyQ Jan 2020 #46
I have no doubt they have been altering elections in more than one state. 58Sunliner Jan 2020 #48
K&R for exposure. Also, read about alarming problems with LA County's new touchscreen "voting" diva77 Jan 2020 #50
Will we hear anything about this (except maybe some BS spin) from MSNBC or CNN? triron Jan 2020 #53
kick diva77 Jan 2020 #61
K&R burrowowl Jan 2020 #68
hand counted paper ballots please questionseverything Jan 2020 #73
So...wouldn't you think that since this has come out, EVERYONE in any PatrickforO Jan 2020 #74
We still need to get out to vote bdamomma Jan 2020 #76
As long as we have elections. triron Jan 2020 #80
knr triron Jan 2020 #81
kick for visibility triron Jan 2020 #82

TheBlackAdder

(28,076 posts)
4. Check out this shit! Texas is the new Ohio.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 09:33 AM
Jan 2020

.

A ballot box found weeks after Election Day has flipped a $569 million school bond vote in Midland, Texas


After much flip-flopping, a $569 million Midland ISD school bond election failed Friday by 26 votes now that county workers have taken into account ballots found in a missing box located weeks after Election Day.

The local election had drawn the attention of the Texas secretary of state’s office and some lawmakers due to the numerous twists and turns. On election night, Midland voters watching the polls initially believed the bond passed by 18 votes because of the results posted on Midland County’s election website. But a week after the posting, officials clarified to reporters that the election night tally didn’t include mail-in votes. Once those numbers were taken into account, officials believed the bond failed by 25 votes, according to Deborah Land, elections administrator for the Midland County Elections Office.

We Choose Our Future, a specific-purpose political action committee in favor of the bond, quickly called for a recount. That recount, which wrapped up before the county found the missing box, flipped the results back again. With county officials believing that the bond had passed by 11 votes, the result of the manual recount was canvassed — or made official — Nov. 15, when it was signed by County Judge Terry Johnson.
.
.
County officials found the missing box in early December. Taking into account those 836 votes, plus one stray ticket found separately from the box that had also been misplaced, the results flipped again. The new version of final results, which Land said should finally lay the issue to rest, was 11,800 votes in favor of the bond and 11,826 against. The result means that Midland ISD will not receive the authority to build two new high schools.


https://www.rawstory.com/2020/01/a-ballot-box-found-weeks-after-election-day-has-flipped-a-569-million-school-bond-vote-in-midland-texas/


.

Hermit-The-Prog

(33,039 posts)
59. People can see, guard, and count paper ballots
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 04:01 PM
Jan 2020

That Texas story is an example of a failure to maintain chain of custody; the election officials blocked the public's ability to guard the ballots.

questionseverything

(9,631 posts)
71. the chain of custody is one reason to get it right election night
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 03:00 AM
Jan 2020

easier for citizens to oversee

with the proper transparency everyone at the precinct should know whr and how many ab ballots there are

paper ballots are the answer!

mwooldri

(10,291 posts)
57. Hand count?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:52 PM
Jan 2020

It's how it is done in the UK. Government employees (career, not political) are pulled to do the counting. Count is observed by the candidates and their representatives.

I admit it would be more complicated in America with many races going on at once compared to the one or two in the UK. Yes, a Scantron machine can be hacked but the paper backup makes it possible to dispute the count and do a hand count.

soldierant

(6,648 posts)
64. I don't know -
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 07:24 PM
Jan 2020

There was ballot-stuffing for a long time in the US before mechanical and digital systems came in to use. I would not be surprised to learn that there was ballot-stuffing with potsherds and styluses.

But I certainly do agree that i like there to be a paper trail. My state has all-mail voting, which guarantees a paper trail.

questionseverything

(9,631 posts)
72. of course officials would have to gaurd against ballot "stuffing but
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 03:02 AM
Jan 2020

hand stuffing takes many peops or someone in power to change a few ballots with electronics 10s of thousands of ballots can shift with the click of a button

soldierant

(6,648 posts)
79. It only takes one person to "lose" a whole box of ballots.
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 06:09 PM
Jan 2020

And the electronics can change the count of scanned paper ballots, so those must be audited.

I don't know that I fear large changes as much as I fear highly strategic small changes actually.

questionseverything

(9,631 posts)
83. well how many voted and what is recorded would need to jive
Fri Jan 24, 2020, 04:18 AM
Jan 2020

but it is harder to "lose" a box full if they are counted election night in the precinct with the precinct watching

you are correct scanners can be fixed to give an inaccurate result too, which is why I want hand counted paper ballots and a tight ,transparent chain of custody

I don't want just "audited" at least the federal elections need to be hand counted.

Botany

(70,291 posts)
2. Everybody should remember that Russia attacked all 50 states in 2016
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 09:32 AM
Jan 2020

Putin wasn't there just "to look around." Ever since "they" pushed through HAVA (help America vote Act)
in 2002 the exit polls have not matched the vote in a large # of cases and states.

Farmer-Rick

(10,072 posts)
7. So True
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:06 AM
Jan 2020

This rigging of our voting machines can only be overcome if we overwhelm the voting system by getting everyone out to vote.

aggiesal

(8,864 posts)
25. True, but there is another way.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:59 AM
Jan 2020

Prior to computers,
ballots were paper ballots, and at the close of polls, the poll workers would count
the ballots for EACH, and I mean EACH, race within 3-4 hours.

The results were written down on a form and a copy was posted at the precinct
that same night so you could see the outcomes for your precinct and if there
were any issues.

All precincts did this and by usually 1 am, all the numbers from the ballots from
each precinct were tallied at the Registrar of Voters office so that the media
could post/announce the results by morning.

Using these computers, some races, take days to count!
Gore .vs. Bush is the one example that sticks out like a sore thumb.

One last note, I never use mail in ballots. Back in the early 2000's in San Diego
County, mail in ballots had a spoilage rate of around 17%, while spoilage at
the polls were around 2-3%.

In either case, there is no way to determine if your ballot was counted as you
voted, but mail-in's have a much lower chance of being counted at all.

First, all ballots should be on paper, no computer screen ballots.
Second, if we are going to use computers to count ballots, we should hand
count every ballot as well. We should go back to originally counting ballots
at all precincts and posting the results prior to counting via a computer
tabulator. If vote count is off by 1 vote, that precinct's votes should be
investigated to determine why there was a discrepancy.

ahlnord

(91 posts)
45. TRUE
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:02 PM
Jan 2020

This is most certainly true! I have counted ballots on election night and thrilled to sign the seals over the ballot boxes and posted the results on the door to the polling place. We were usually done by midnight or 1:00. People, it is our DUTY to vote and to count the ballots, just as it is our duty to serve on a jury. But we have privatized our elections, letting corporations control the machinery and outcomes, so that we can get the results a few hours earlier (and so we don't have to be bothered with the work of counting). Yes, it is disturbing how the exit polls no longer match up with the results. And I second your complaint about mail-in ballots. You never know what happens/can happen to the mail. (And the Republicans want to privatize our Post Office now, too!)

Farmer-Rick

(10,072 posts)
78. Yeah, but is that going to happen before the next presidential election?
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 10:36 AM
Jan 2020

I agree paper and pen his harder to rig then these silly ass computers that are always malfunctioning as planned.

Until we fix our voting system, or should I call it our cheating system, we need to overwhelm it with votes.



bdamomma

(63,658 posts)
77. exactly
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 10:02 AM
Jan 2020

everyone needs to vote, and NOT sit this one out, unless they want to live in dictatorship.

usaf-vet

(6,094 posts)
10. I believe the 2000 SCOTUS decision was the planned beginning of the GOP long range intentions ...
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:37 AM
Jan 2020

... to set in place a hackable election system to include remotely hackable electronic voting machines.

Paired with Citizen United, gerrymandering, voter suppression, voter ID and other dirty tricks designed to consistently steal elections by cheating.

They see the demographics are not moving in there favor and fear that they will lose their majority status sometime in the future. The projections range from 2040 to 2060.

You can certainly disagree with my belief that this is what we are seeing unfold piece by piece. I find it hard to imagine that these changes we have seen since 2000 are just coincidental random events that clearly allowed the presidential 2016 election to be hacked with the 2020 election already under attack.

Botany

(70,291 posts)
11. Georgia 2002 was very dirty
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:41 AM
Jan 2020

The loss of the Senate seat by Max Cleland and the loss of the Governor's race were
"Diebold Specials" and after the election Diebold workers came in and changed the time
stamps on the voting data so they would agree w/the data.

cilla4progress

(24,589 posts)
21. THIS!
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:29 AM
Jan 2020

drumpfs 2016 vote totals and EC win highly improbable: <1% in 3 states.

Is this the real story???!

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
31. And explained as faulty polling due to
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:08 PM
Jan 2020

cell phones vs landlines, changing demographics, outdated methods, etc.

Some of those factors probably do affect pre-election polls, but what about post election polls? Are voters lying about whom they voted for? Or is the dicrepancy due to interference in counting votes?

Botany

(70,291 posts)
35. When we voted with these machines the exit polls matched the vote
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:18 PM
Jan 2020


and after flipping down the tabs and you voted by opening the curtain.

csziggy

(34,120 posts)
49. Not necessarily! Back in the 1980's an election was completely screwed up
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:56 PM
Jan 2020

With lever machines. Long story.

Leon County, Florida had had the same supervisor of elections for twenty or thirty years. In 1984 just minutes before the deadline for candidates to register she announced her retirement. The only candidate to register was her son, who had been working in her office for years. While some tried to run as write ins, with the lever system it was not easy and the son won. In the first major election after he took office, the machines were not properly set up. It was hard to tell which lever was for which candidate and many complained that they were not sure if they voted for their choice. The ensuing court case set the precedent in Florida that an election could not be re-done (which was important in 2000).

ELECTIONS CHIEF GETS JOB BACK
SUN-SENTINEL

May 29, 1987

TALLAHASSEE -- The Senate voted Thursday to reinstate Leon County Elections Supervisor Jan Pietrzyk, who was ousted by former Gov. Bob Graham over a botched primary election last year.

The 36-3 vote in favor of reinstatement was in direct opposition to a special master's recommendation that Pietrzyk be removed from office because he was responsible for widespread voting problems in Leon County Sept. 2, 1986.

Malfunctioning voting machines caused the entire election to be challenged in court. An undetermined number of people were unable to vote at all. Some people voted for one candidate, and the machine registered the vote for another, while other voters were given incorrect instructions by poll workers.

Senators said they felt it was a poor precedent to remove an elected official just because the official made errors in judgment. The voters put Pietrzyk in office, and they should be the ones to judge his performance, lawmakers said.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-xpm-1987-05-29-8702180627-story.html


After a bid as county commissioner in 1986 {Ion} Sancho took courses in election machine management and became certified in their use. In November 1988, Sancho was elected to his first term as the Supervisor of Elections for Leon County, Florida. He ran and was re-elected in 1992, 1996, 2000, and 2004, serving his fifth term as of January 2, 2005. He was unopposed in each election since 1992.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_Sancho#Supervisor_of_Elections


The saga went on when it turned out that the opti-scan system that Sancho introduced to the county turned out to be hackable (see the HBO documentary Hacking America).

Sancho retired a couple of years ago, but he endorsed a man who had worked in his office for years and the elections since have been without problems.
 

fwvinson

(488 posts)
28. Doors Locked
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:04 PM
Jan 2020

In 2016 we had the doors locked, the lights out, guards out front and Russia got in. Now, the doors wide open, the lights are on and guards welcoming Russia back. How do you think this (2020 election) is going to work out?

triron

(21,916 posts)
36. Like Jimmy Carter says, Trump did not win in 2016. Hillary is rightful POTUS.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:18 PM
Jan 2020

So tragic that U.S. can be so easily manipulated by Russia.

Botany

(70,291 posts)
38. And the media has all but killed Jimmy Carter's statement on the 2016 election and ...
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:22 PM
Jan 2020

... are busy pushing the can, "Trump win re-election?" meme.

triron

(21,916 posts)
52. The media are complicit in the demise of the republic. But what the hell, more money!
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 02:09 PM
Jan 2020

Media beware! Your time may be coming soon.

CurtEastPoint

(18,552 posts)
3. We HAVE to return to paper ballots. Yes, we are a big country but WTF. We have to have
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 09:33 AM
Jan 2020

elections that are true.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
16. VA has all paper ballots.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:01 AM
Jan 2020

Of course, that doesn't completely prevent "lost" ballot boxes and other old-fashioned shenanigans. But it makes recovery more likely.

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
33. What about machine-recorded votes that give
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:15 PM
Jan 2020

voters a printout of how they voted, like a receipt, to save for verification in dubious counting results?

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
44. Pointless. A real recount would require everybody to bring in their receipts.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:58 PM
Jan 2020

And in real life, it's impossible to get everybody to bring in their receipts, thus sparing the potential embarrassment of discovering a stolen election.

That "receipt" option is proposed as a placebo so they won't have to actually make accountable voting systems.

wnylib

(21,146 posts)
56. A recount, if requested or necessary by law
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:36 PM
Jan 2020

in some states when the difference is under a certain percent, would be the method of accountability, as it is now. I was just wondering if printed 'receipts' would allow people to come forward in cases of disputed recounts. The idea occurred to me only because last November, a poster here reported taking a cell phone photo of his/her ballot before sliding it into a scanner, due to mistrust of the system.

But I agree that a more accountable system is needed. As for 'receipts,' one flaw is that not everyone would save theirs. Another is that not everyone would want to reveal how they voted in a disputed outcome.

I'm not sure what an accountable system would be. In any system, there is the possibility of people interfering at some point, whether at the polls or with absentee ballots, or the design and/or programming of machinery. We can and should come up with the best system we can, but nothing is foolproof so long as there are people motivated to find ways around it.

lagomorph777

(30,613 posts)
58. There is no recount when the primary data storage method is electronic.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 03:57 PM
Jan 2020

They can call it anything they like, but it's not a recount.

The only purpose of "receipts" is to give people a false sense of security.

56miSSie

(48 posts)
69. Receipts would not be kept by the voter.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:56 PM
Jan 2020

Receipt would be checked by the voter to verify it is recorded correctly. It would then be deposited in a locked box to be retained by the election board. The locked box would be opened and "receipts" counted in the event of a recount. Voters would not take their receipt with them.

ahlnord

(91 posts)
41. hand counted
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:49 PM
Jan 2020

Not only paper ballots, but hand counted. It takes a few hours longer, but it is the gold standard that would restore faith in the results. As an election judge I myself used to hand count ballots. It is hard to describe the patriotic feeling it gave me to complete the count and sign my name along with the other judges over the seals on the boxes. (Maybe similar to the civic satisfaction of completing jury duty? Something I have never done). Once I even got to accompany the boxes (together with a judge from the other party) in the back of a squad car with lights flashing down to the Secretary of State's office late on election night. Other "first world" countries - such as Canada and Germany - hand count, rather than relying on the unsafe electronic voting machinery. The count is completely do-able when conducted in each precinct on election night. Our precinct usually had around 1500-1700 votes cast, so you could compare the "burden" of counting to that of an election in a large high school. Completely transparent process with judges from both parties and election observers able to witness the counting. Everything verified backwards and forwards. Now we have tabulating machines that take the paper ballots in and spit out a ticker tape with the results. I do not trust that the tabulating machines are un-hackable. In fact, I am certain that they are hackable. So, paper ballots alone without hand-counting are still vulnerable to hacking.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
8. Thank goodness hackers messed up and let Lucy McBath take Newt Gingrich's and Tom Price's
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:17 AM
Jan 2020

old seat in the House.

Also, glad they didn't prevent Obama from being elected, or Democrats reclaiming House in 2018.

GOTV and we WIN.

rainin

(3,010 posts)
9. We must consider this is why republicans are sticking with tRump
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:28 AM
Jan 2020

They know the election systems are hacked to guarantee victory. They know even the primaries can't be won without tRumps approval. They are kissing the ring to keep their jobs.

llmart

(15,501 posts)
13. This is so discouraging.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 10:48 AM
Jan 2020

Ever since Gore v Bush, we've seen how shady our elections have become. That's the year I lost all faith in our system of voting and the impartiality of the Supreme Court.

2naSalit

(86,061 posts)
18. Back as far as 2000...
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:04 AM
Jan 2020

If not that election, surely 2004 after electronic voting machines became almost mandatory after the "hanging chads" of 2000. And even then the manufacturers had malicious intent. So I think there need to be demands, really loud demands, for paper ballots everywhere.

uponit7771

(90,225 posts)
29. Good point, even if its double the time due to increase in voters that's OK with me. Right now there
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:06 PM
Jan 2020

... is not a system that should be trusted at all.

Republicans don't mind elected kings Americans do

bluestarone

(16,722 posts)
22. SCARY part to me is BILL BARR!!!
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 11:31 AM
Jan 2020

After the election HE will be in charge to investigate everything! (it's a state thing BUT) They (DOJ) will decide. That's the way i see it!

uponit7771

(90,225 posts)
30. +1, they're not interested in liberal democracy for the republic any longer and don't know ...
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:08 PM
Jan 2020

... why anyone would want to deal with them as they are.

 

evertonfc

(1,713 posts)
32. Where are our hackers
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:11 PM
Jan 2020

If it's going to come down to hacking, let's get the best hackers. I can't imagine all hackers and those willing to alter a Democratic system of voting are all Trump supporters or conservatives.

the_sly_pig

(740 posts)
40. Minnesota uses paper ballots.
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:48 PM
Jan 2020

Why is this story prominent now? Moscow Mitch and Lubyanka Lindsay won’t do anything to protect our elections for a reason (or should I say treason).

Likely the die have been cast.

DonaldsRump

(7,715 posts)
42. Does anyone really think the Russian hackers were just "snooping around"?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 12:52 PM
Jan 2020

Does anyone really think the Russian hackers were just "snooping around" the many election agencies they hacked? '

Why exactly would they do that? Why would they snoop for a bit and then go away? None of that makes a bit of sense, unless these were really smart Russian kids who were hacking US election agencies for the fun of it (kinda' like Matthew Broderick in Wargames!)

There was clearly something more to this. Occam's Razor, IMHO, would say that the intrusions were done to change the votes. I appreciate there is allegedly "no evidence" of vote changes. I also appreciate the many, many times our federal and state governments have lied to us.

I'm going with Occam and my gut.

 

UniteFightBack

(8,231 posts)
67. I'm talking about tampering with votes. They did plenty of other shit to help him get into
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 07:36 PM
Jan 2020

office.

CrispyQ

(36,231 posts)
46. Where the fuck are the Hackers for Democracy?
Mon Jan 20, 2020, 01:05 PM
Jan 2020


I know that's not a solution to a secure election system, but WTF?

questionseverything

(9,631 posts)
73. hand counted paper ballots please
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 03:13 AM
Jan 2020

in full public view

is the only way a citizen can trust the outcome...if we oversee it with our own eyes

PatrickforO

(14,516 posts)
74. So...wouldn't you think that since this has come out, EVERYONE in any
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 03:31 AM
Jan 2020

political office in GA, as well as its media, and it's citizens, would be committed to getting rid of the hacks, and perhaps those voting machines in favor of a less hack-able method of voting and tallying votes?

I mean, you would think that, right?

But let me guess who will be opposing the lawsuits - could it be the party of Trump?

And if this is the case, maybe Stacey Abrams actually IS the governor.

bdamomma

(63,658 posts)
76. We still need to get out to vote
Tue Jan 21, 2020, 09:59 AM
Jan 2020

Never give up.

A backup paper ballot would be necessary and needed in this case.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Hackers may have gained '...