Claire McCaskill, Mitch McConnell and Senate Votes to Convict

[FM123]

Claire McCaskill was talking to Stephanie Ruhle on her show earlier this morning when she said something that we all know, that the most important thing to Mitch McConnel is that he holds on to his own power as the Senate Majority Leader.

She said:
"If you want to figure out Mitch McConnell, figure out what's going to keep him in power and that's what he will do. So he wants to protect his members more than anything - forget about whether or not the president should be impeached - he wants to protect his vulnerable senators from IA, NC, CO, AZ, ME where he's got folks that could easily lose in November."

So I am wondering - does that include "letting" senators vote to convict his president as long as he gets to keep a senate majority?

While it may not be enough to convict & remove trump - we only need 4 republican senators to vote with our Dems to create the historical record of a bipartisan impeachment in which a majority of the senate voted to convict and remove.

[Raster]

1. Now it's time for all of us to do our duties...

... I live in Arizona, and you can be damned sure my two Senators will be quite familiar with me before this is all over.

[marble falls]

2. Mitch will let Trump go as soon as its conveniant.

[Auggie]

7. Exactly. You could also say, "when he's through with Trump."

That's what Congressman Schiff has been saying since 2016. Does McConnell have enough crackpot pro-corporate judges in place that he can appoint Pence as next POTUS? It has to happen soon so Pence can mount a 2020 campaign.

[marble falls]

9. Absolutely. Mitch is Mitches main and only concern. And Pence is our serious, serious concern.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

19. While I'm certainly not endorsing the idea, of course

Wouldn't Pence pretty much nominate the same Judges? Or are there Judges that Trump is nominating that are even too nutty for Pence?

[StarfishSaver]

20. Pence would be as bad as Trump, if not worse, on judges because he's a true believer

[Auggie]

26. Maybe. But if Pence is thinking ahead to 2024 ...

he could play it just a little safer. Trump has appointed the very worst.

[TheRealNorth]

30. As long As the Republican base is behind Trump

Moscow Mitch doesn't risk incurring their wrath.

Furthermore
1. Moscow Mitch has to win his re-election
2. There is also a question in my mind whether the Russians are holding compromising information over the GOP.

[Auggie]

46. I don't agree. Pence could be sold to the base just easily as Trump. Putin would agree...

provided sanctions were still on the table.

[Shanti Mama]

3. at his age I think this is shifting

I think his most important priority is to get as many judges as possible into life terms. Then his legacy lives on when he's too old to hold the reins of power directly. Or gone.

[defacto7]

6. This

[Polybius]

39. Absolutely

Trump has already had 173 of his judges confirmed in slightly under 3 years in office. Obama had 329 in 8 years, Bush had 327 and Clinton 378. While it's extremely unlikely Trump serves 8 years, his pace is far ahead of them all.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_presidents_of_the_United_States_by_judicial_appointments

[NewJeffCT]

4. I think she's a bit naive

Republicans will name Collins and Jordan as their House managers and call Adam Schiff, the Whistleblower, The Bidens, Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, Jim Comey, Alexandra Chalupa, Christopher Steele, Colin Kapernick, Meryl Streep, Robert DeNiro, the cast of Hamilton and more as witnesses to cause chaos and confusion and damage Biden for 2020.

[cbdo2007]

5. The damage to Biden is already done. They've already sewn doubt there...

so the longer we can keep Biden as a frontrunner now, the Dems real candidate will stay in the shadows until Feb-March.

Let them put all of their focus and money on beating Biden, then bring in Booker or someone as the real candidate who will show as the real deal.

[robbob]

11. You're probably right, but wow...

is that really all it takes now? A bunch of proven liars like “president” Dump slander a good man with a bunch of unproven innuendo and BAM, that’s it, you’re tainted?

It worked on Hillary but that was an operation many years/decades in the making. In a just world it would be the liars and spreaders of slander who would have their reputations ruined, but I guess if you’re a republican the lies don’t get pointed out, and if you’re a Democrat you have to defend yourself constantly.

Thanks, liberal media.

[Mars and Minerva]

18. Yes. And Bloomberg is a red herring too.

He can now freely attack Trump with a billion dollars in ads day in and day out.

I think this is going to be a team sport.

[StarfishSaver]

21. He could do that without being a candidate

[cbdo2007]

24. Again, Bloomberg is taking the heat away from our real candidates right now

I dont' think Bloomy wants to be President, though I would greatly prefer him over Trump times 1000.

But if Trump can attack Bloomberg, that's taking attacks away from some of our other real candidates and is a good thing. Worst case scenario, we have a Trump vs Bloomberg election next year, which Bloomy has a great shot at winning and I still woudl take him 1000 times over another Trump term, so either way its going to be ok.

[Mars and Minerva]

33. Or he could win. It's a win/win situation. He wants Trump out. nt

[Fiendish Thingy]

12. Does the GOP get to appoint managers?

I don't think there were any Dem house managers for Clinton's impeachment.

It wouldn't make any sense to have prosecutors making a case for acquittal.

[NewJeffCT]

28. from the Clinton impeachment:

Thirteen House Republicans from the Judiciary Committee served as "managers", the equivalent of prosecutors: Henry Hyde (chairman), Jim Sensenbrenner, Bill McCollum, George Gekas, Charles Canady, Steve Buyer, Ed Bryant, Steve Chabot, Bob Barr, Asa Hutchinson, Chris Cannon, James E. Rogan and Lindsey Graham.

Clinton was defended by Cheryl Mills. Clinton's counsel staff included Charles Ruff, David E. Kendall, Dale Bumpers, Bruce Lindsey, Nicole Seligman, Lanny A. Breuer and Gregory B. Craig.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton#Pretrial

[Fiendish Thingy]

32. So, no, only the majority can appoint managers nt

[NewJeffCT]

36. If I recall

Trey Gowdy and Pam Bondi are on his impeachment defense team, and I'm sure Bill Barr, Pat Cippolline and others will be there as well.

[EndlessWire]

44. Pam Bondi--that's

the one who was paid off, $25,000, I believe? That one? Florida?

[hedda_foil]

40. That's correct.

[Mr.Bill]

15. You forgot Jane Fonda.

[Hortensis]

35. NewJeffCT, you missed what McCaskill said. She's spot on

about a man she knows very well. The vast majority of others who do also believe it's all about his personal power for him. He's always been on the conservative side, but otherwise he's never revealed fealty to any particular ideology.

[hedda_foil]

37. Democratic Congressmen will be the House Managers -- not Republicans.

[kentuck]

8. It will be a very big deal if majority of Senate votes to convict...

Even if it is not enough to remove him from office.

Trump will fight like a rabid badger to get 51 votes to acquit. It would be a huge loss if he gets less.

[StarfishSaver]

22. This

In fact, it would be a big deal if ANY Republicans vote to convict because impeachment would then be a bipartisan effort.

But if a majority voted to convict, that would be MAJOR. The only thing that would have saved him is the same thing that allowed him to get into office in the first place - a constitutional requirement that trumps (no pun intended) the will of the majority.

[gab13by13]

10. I disagree with McCaskill

but I hope I'm wrong. If Republicans vote to convict, Trump won't be able to contain his wrath against them.

[kag]

13. Cory Gardner will absolutely vote to acquit.

He knows he won't win his seat back next year, no matter how he votes. He might as well hang on to his benefactors. He's hopeless.

[panader0]

14. I mailed a letter to McConnell yesterday on the advice of H2O Man.

The address is in this link.

https://www.democraticunderground.com/100212757109

[aggiesal]

16. Where did you get 4 Republican Senators? ...

You need 2/3rds of the Senators to convict a President of impeachment charges.

Assuming that all (D)'s and (I)'s vote to convict, we will need 20 (R) Senators to
actually have Pendejo45, removed from office.

[grantcart]

17. The OP is arguing that 4 Republicans would make a majority

Which wouldn't be enough to remove but would leave a strong historical condemnation that a majority voted for conviction but Trump was saved only by a super majority requirement

[StarfishSaver]

23. Exactly this

Pelosi and the Democrats are playing all the angles.

[aggiesal]

27. That's not how I read it ...

His last sentence reads "... bipartisan impeachment in which a majority of the senate voted to convict and remove."

We'll never be able to remove with only 4 Senators. "and Remove" should have never been included.

And yes I've already seen the response from the original poster, the last sentence in the original implies that we only need
4 Senators to Convict AND Remove.

That's how I read it.

[hedda_foil]

38. The controlling verb in the sentence is "vote" -- 51 Senators could VOTE for conviction and removal.

However, 67 votes would be needed for him to BE convicted and removed.

[grantcart]

42. He is saying that a vote of the majority to convict and remove wpuld

Be significant and useful even though it won't effect Trump's removal

[Hermit-The-Prog]

25. Moscow Mitch cares about Moscow Mitch, only

Even many of the Red cultists of Kentucky acknowledge that Moscow Mitch McConnell has been in office too long and that everything he does is for his own gain in power and money. (They just don't mind as long as he's doing things that help the cult and hurt Democrats). If McConnell believes that convicting Trump will result in more Republicans remaining in the Senate after 2020, then Trump will be gone. If he believes acquitting Trump will save more Republican seats, Trump will remain.

[Wellstone ruled]

29. McCaskill has had Moscow Mitch's number

from the get go. And everything she says about Mitch comes true at some point.

This up coming Election Cycle will been one of ready made Commercials self created in real time by the Rethugs.

The Fast response teams will just have to add a little spice to the mix.

[Eyeball_Kid]

31. A majority vote still is an acquittal, and that's still the worst that could happen.

If the Senate acquits, the result is that the Legislative Branch approves of Trumpy being above the law, and the Constitution is, from that point forward, unalterably corrupted and changed. We will no longer have separation of powers among co-equal branches. Trumpy will be above the law and will have no Constitutional restraints to accumulate all of the power he wishes. No one will or can stop him. He can cheat on elections and he can even cancel the next election, and it will all be legal.

[calimary]

34. Frankly, all I care about at this point are the history books.

All this sturm und drang will pass and be one meaningless. Few people care who was manipulating or browbeating back when Andrew Johnson was impeached. And the jackals who swarmed Bill Clinton and impeached him because he lied about a blowjob from a consenting adult will all be long forgotten. Their names are named elsewhere here but nobody’s gonna remember. Especially as those of us old enough to have watched it happen die out.

But that impeachment vote (if it goes in the House the way we all expect it to) will stick. It goes straight into the history books. On the record. Cast in stone. That will always be front row center on his so-called. legacy and in his eventual obituary. You can talk all around it and “over, under, around, and through” like TV commercials used to say. You can spin it any way, excuse it any way, downplay it in any way, but that doesn’t change OR erase OR amend the fact that he’ll have been IMPEACHED. And failure to convict in the Senate does NOT wipe it away or or reverse it or nullify it or make it any less legitimate or any less of a blot on the ol’ bio. Just ask Bill Clinton.

Straight into the history books! Where it belongs! So his grandchildren and the kids and grandkids of all his rich friends and non-wealthy supporters will read about it in school and have to study it in history class. Same when there are movies and miniseries about it, too, and books galore. Just ask Richard Nixon.

And, for that matter, ask the ghost of Andrew Johnson. For probably most of America, by now, that’s the only thing people know about him.

[Sogo]

41. However, as has been pointed out to me elsewhere:

There is no double jeopardy when it comes to impeachment.

[EndlessWire]

43. I believe he can do that now.

When he declared the so-called "emergency," that gave him the power to stop the election. That is supposed to be trotted back to the government at intervals for renewal, but it is seldom observed. No one cared because we've never seen the likes of Trump and the TP.

He seems to already be a dictator. We're going to have to be really tough and canny to get rid of these people. This isn't based on party; it's based on behavior and foul deeds.

I was stunned by their hysteria on Monday. Why do they think tantrumming like a 2 year in front of the nation does anything good? History is not going to treat them kindly, and we know their names.

[myohmy2]

45. it may be so...

...but I'm thinking many are discounting the terror and fear trump generates with republicans that may try to cross him...

...I honestly believe that many republicans goose-step behind trump because they fear for their lives and the lives of their loved ones...

...trump has shown there is no limit to how far he will go to have his way or to get an opponent...a few winks and nods and a right-wing goon squad may be sent to give you a permeant visit...and then with the help of putin,

...without 'special' protection from right-wing goon squads, terror and fear may the unwritten concern that governs the roost at the impeachment trial for many republicans...

...my opinion, but...

[mopinko]

47. all they have to do is heed the words of ben franklin, and hang together.

i saw that interview, and glad she agree w me that when the rats decide it is in their best interest, they will flee ss trump.

they can duck the vote if they want to, and it just occurred to me that perhaps that is where this whole 'refuse to participate' bs could be headed.

[FM123]

48. I am starting to wonder the same thing.....

"it just occurred to me that perhaps that is where this whole 'refuse to participate' bs could be headed"

[mopinko]

49. i mean, it gives them an eternal 'what if'

"he wouldnt have been convicted in a fair process. but we just couldnt go along w that kangaroo court."

[FM123]

50. Yep. This is exactly how they like to operate.

[mopinko]

51. all one thin ass playbook.

heard jamie raskin talking about how they plan to lay out the pattern of it all.
there are so many examples, from petty to traitorous. and petty treasons, like ronnie jackson.

[FM123]

52. Yep - playbook of treachery.

[mopinko]

54. age old. worn thin.

the dictator's playbook. new edition for the 21st century.

[Garrett78]

53. I'm not sure a vote to convict is going to help more than hurt all 5 of those Senators.

The assumption is that they can save their jobs by voting to convict. That's not necessarily a safe assumption, at least not in all 5 of those states.

Moscow Mitch will tell them to do whatever they need to do, based on internal polling. Conviction won't come anywhere close to happening, so I doubt Moscow Mitch cares a whole lot.

[DeminPennswoods]

55. IMHO, McCaskill is spot on

McConnell is about getting and keeping power, nothing more, nothing less. I think even if McConnell signals that the "vulnerable" Rs can vote their conscience, they risk Trump whipping up the cultists to oppose them and they lose anyway.

I'm interested in seeing how McConnell's desire to have a serious trial works out with Trump's desire to have a circus. McConnell might just calculate that he (and the Rs) will do just fine with a President Pence and instruct his caucus accordingly.