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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWas Jimmy Carter the most underrated president in history?
I thought this was an interesting article in the NYT. It is a review of a book about the Carter presidency by Stuart E. Eizenstat, Carter's White House domestic policy adviser. Eizenstat argues that Carter's presidency was more consequential than is typically thought.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/05/books/review/president-carter-stuart-eizenstat.html
I thought some DUers might find this interesting.
comradebillyboy
(10,142 posts)interest rate for the mortgage on my first house and the Iran hostage debacle. I really don't recall much positive from his administration.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,105 posts)What the masses heard was republican lies.
Edited for clarification:
Behind Carters back, the Reagan campaign worked out a deal with the leader of Irans radical faction Supreme Leader Ayatollah Khomeini to keep the hostages in captivity until after the 1980 Presidential election.
This was nothing short of treason. The Reagan campaigns secret negotiations with Khomeini the so-called October Surprise sabotaged Carter and Bani-Sadrs attempts to free the hostages. And as Bani-Sadr told The Christian Science Monitor in March of this year, they most certainly tipped the results of the [1980] election in Reagans favor.
More can be found here: https://truthout.org/articles/without-reagans-treason-iran-would-not-be-a-problem/
MichMary
(1,714 posts)he politicized the Olympics with the boycott, and he brought back draft registration.
I didn't like either move.
Yavin4
(35,432 posts)Nixon inflated the currency to pay for the Vietnam war and allow us to build up a global super military power to counter the Soviets. Because a majority of US labor were under union contracts, they got automatic pay raises when inflation went up. This created hyper inflation which necessitated hiking rates to over 12% to curb inflation.
When Reagan broke PATCO without any political ramifications, the message was sent that labor could be defeated. Ever since union membership has been in steep decline. Which meant that overall labor cost fell under the rate of inflation, and that allows the Fed the ability to raise/lower rates at will. This also created the great income gap that we have today.
Sophia4
(3,515 posts)of their own oil production and sales. They raised the price of crude very quickly because they felt that crude oil was a product that could be exhausted and that once it was gone, they would not have that income. OPEC, the organization for petroleum producing countries, was formed in 1960 and became very prominent demanding better compensation for oil around that time.
Again, during the Carter administration, OPEC raised crude oil prices. At the time, oil was so basic to our economy and our production, that a rise in the price of oil was very inflationary.
*****
That in addition to the need to pay down war debts for the Viet Nam War is my understanding of the cause of much of the inflation of the Carter and even Reagan administrations. The inflation continued into the Reagan era.
The formation of OPEC marked a turning point toward national sovereignty over natural resources, and OPEC decisions have come to play a prominent role in the global oil market and international relations. The effect can be particularly strong when wars or civil disorders lead to extended interruptions in supply. In the 1970s, restrictions in oil production led to a dramatic rise in oil prices and OPEC's revenue and wealth, with long-lasting and far-reaching consequences for the global economy. In the 1980s, OPEC started setting production targets for its member nations; and generally when the production targets are reduced, oil prices increase, most recently from the organization's 2008 and 2016 decisions to trim oversupply.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OPEC
The economic repercussion of excessive dependence on oil is yet another reason to seek and use alternative energy sources.
Yavin4
(35,432 posts)After WWII, these nations took back control and controlled the price of crude affecting inflation as well. To make matters even worse, American auto makers made highly fuel inefficient cars and lost considerable market share to the Japanese and Germans who made cars better suited for rising gas prices.
Carter got blamed for all of this while Reagan is celebrated, but the only tangible thing that Reagan did was effectively kill American labor's ability to affect their pay which allowed for inflation to be tamed but created the wide gap between the top 10% and everyone else.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)The problem was fixed by Paul Volcker(D) who was appointed by Carter and did such a great job even Saint Ronnie was compelled to reappoint him.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,839 posts)possible thing to do, as there would be rebound inflation. Turns out they were right, and Carter gets wrongly blamed for what Nixon created.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)His Fed Chairman, Arthur Burns, conspired with Nixon to prop up the economy prior to Nixons re-election. The long term results were disastrous and Burns knew it, but did it anyway.
Lochloosa
(16,062 posts)High Interest Rates were not Carter's fault. They had to go up to combat Nixon's inflation.
MiniMe
(21,714 posts)What they went up to then is nothing compared to what they are now, but they went up from about .35/gallon to over a dollar. Doesn't sound like much now, but it was then. And you could only get gas on certain days.
shanny
(6,709 posts)the arming of Afghan rebels and the first steps into deregulation. I like Jimmy Carter as much as anybody and he is certainly our best former president, but he made some huge mistakes.
Golden Raisin
(4,608 posts)unblock
(52,181 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Hortensis
(58,785 posts)is exemplary? If I sound like one of the many people who've crossed him off my list it's because I had several last straws from him in 2016. As it turned out, my respect for his toolbelt Christianity couldn't carry him until the grave. And that's entirely his deplorable doing.
When Bernie Sanders and his eternal, zealous badmouthing of Democrats arrived on the national stage, I thought, oh, my god, a far-left Jimmy Carter. Carter's not easy to categorize. Some have seen him as far left at times, as a Rockefeller Republican, but as president he was small-government conservative in most respects and liberal in many but not all respects.)
Carter and Sanders are both intensely arrogant and intolerant of any viewpoints but their own. It's a righteousness thing, and their superiority of both intellect and principle is illustrated (to themselves) by the inferiority of others. Read about Carter, and you'll find he's one of those people who are both very admirable in some ways and very not at all in others.
Carter's single term was a sadly wasted opportunity. He was a Democratic president with a Democratic house and senate (!!!), but he was a moderate conservative who believed in small government and that he knew better than everyone else. He was always quarreling with his Democratic-controlled congress, and a good part of what little was accomplished was done by congress, whose job also included rescuing him from the hot water he occasionally got into.
Like Sanders, Carter of course had had no support among his colleagues for running for president, but his belief in himself more than made up for the lack of respect he'd earned from others. Sanders almost certainly studied how Carter managed to get elected because there are striking similarities. Carter ran by appealing to idealism, ignorance and populist resentments. Above all, he loudly ran on what he claimed was the corruption of the (rest of the) Democratic Party and promises to fix it. Carter also funded his campaign by small donations from "the people," not because he wouldn't accept big donations but because for the most part knowledgeable donors wouldn't back him. The biggest differences between the two are that Carter was a more skilled politician and that he won.
Although Carter's presidency is considered mediocre at best, he since has always publicly criticized other presidents for not following his advice -- including badmouthing both Clinton and Obama during their campaigns against Republicans, billionaire extremists, Russia. When gathered with other presidents, he's usually wandering around the stage alone while the others chat. Carter, as we know, always also believes he alone knows how to achieve "world peace," or whatever, so he often offers his unsolicited services to heads of state, who also don't want them. Including recently both Koreas.
'Nuf said about being an underrated president? For sure, though, both his achievements and failures are very under-known. He had admirers among those who knew him in his political time. Most biographies about him are fairly quick reads for anyone who's interested.
LisaM
(27,800 posts)I think you've put your finger on much of what bothers me about him, and he was an ineffective president in a lot of ways. He was also not right for the time, being elected just as the unbridled forces of world capitalism were partnering with right-wing religious zealotry to change the world as we know it (I refer you to a book called "Strange Rebels", which discusses the politics in 1979). Carter didn't have a chance against that juggernaut, but then again, he hadn't made a hugely compelling case for himself.
I do like much of what he's done as a private citizen. I've also heard him speak, and is very, very conceited, for lack of a better word, always touting his achievements and waiting for applause lines.
But, he was a Democrat after all. What cheeses me are people I know who say now, oh, he was my favorite president ever. I have one friend in particular who really likes him, but when I asked if she'd worked on his re-election campaign (I did) or donated money to it, she had to say no. I'm not even positive she didn't vote for John Anderson in 1980.
He's definitely a mixed bag, but I'm going to re-read your thoughtful post later because I agree with a lot of it. Thank you.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)a good big-picture book, and I know I haven't read it before. Thank you for calling my post thoughtful. It's looking more like a bunch of simplistic spouting to me now that I find someone actually read it. I went from liking and respecting him for what I did like and respect to terminally ticked off in one leap, both of them together a doubled-down OD, and this is the result.
But I'd love to hear some of your thoughts on him and his era, LisaM. As you say, very much a mixed bag.
LisaM
(27,800 posts)was 1979. And it's right - it is when right-wing religion became the tool that the laissez-faire economic crowd used to force their agenda. Carter was caught up in the middle of it, but what I really agree with in your assessment is that he had a notion of small government. He deregulated the airlines. He made pointless gestures like selling off the presidential yacht (that's always bugged me, which is stupid on my part, but hey). But his criticism of the Clintons really gets me down. I don't know that either one has said a mean thing about him. I think Carter can be personally judgmental. Despite all that, how anyone could vote for Reagan over him baffles me. Carter was ineffective, but Reagan always gave me the creeps. The hair on my arms still goes up when I hear his creepy-sounding voice.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)New Deal era ended and a strongly conservative one began, and I'm looking forward to reading about the much bigger events it was part of. Carter's abortive presidency illustrated, didn't cause, an end he couldn't have prevented if he'd tried. But he didn't try. The New Deal era's last presidency, blessed with Democratic control of congress, wasn't even a last gasp of progressive liberalism.
Lol for your creeps response. I can feel-understand it, though zealots with their tunnel-visioned capacity for ruthless casting off of principles in pursuit of their supposedly higher goals, are the ones who tend to give me little chills. Even though none of that type who've risen have ever come close to cutting society's controls, usually just contributing destructive gadflyism, something in me always looks for them. I can't see Trump as capable of strong ideology, much less a zealot, whatever he is, Yeat's "rough beast" in democracy's china shop, but at best channeling the destructive ideology of others.
The only biography I've read of Reagan was Morris's authorized Dutch. Although he spent many hours over years with Reagan, he always found him cold and distant, Reagan's enormous charm something he turned on, then back off. I never came to like him while reading, but I figured that wouldn't change with authors. This reminds me of Morris specifically saying Reagan had no wit. All those humorous, good-natured comments he's noted for, like his charm and that good nature, were performances, lines he developed ahead of time.
LisaM
(27,800 posts)were very much agents of the time. I think he sees Reagan as a tool, weak at his core, easily manipulated.
My dislike of Reagan is so visceral that I really can't see why anyone could listen to him. The arm hairs know!
kentuck
(111,074 posts)Without mention of him having to follow the criminality of the Nixon years and Watergate, or the end of Vietnam War, or the First Oil Embargo under Ford and the ensuing inflation, or any of the economic mess that was left by Republicans.
Actually, the interest rates were higher under Reagan than Carter. But they were blamed on Carter. That's the way they play the game.
unblock
(52,181 posts)he appointed volcker to the fed, who promptly jacked rates up to the moon in order to stamp out the inflation that really became a problem under nixon and ford, both of whom were inept in tackling it. i mean, ford's plan, i kid you not, was to hand out "whip inflation now" buttons. get it? "w.i.n."? sheesh!
volcker killed inflation and it's been a non-problem for decades since then, and clearing the inflation problem and then returning rates to normal set the stage for the 80's expansion that reagan stole credit for.
unfortunately for carter, rates were still very high around election time, so the effectiveness of the plan wasn't yet evident to the voters in 1980.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Blame Nixon's wage and price controls. Inflation is what occurs when they are removed.
As an aside we should clone Jimmy Carter's 'I will never lie to you' and a 'government as good as its people' campaign for 2020.
unblock
(52,181 posts)republicans as a party need to pay a yuge, long-term price for inflicting donnie on us, never mind all the crimes against democracy and america and humanity that enabled him.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)unblock
(52,181 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)mopinko
(70,070 posts)yeah, he got a whooooole lot of bullshit bashing.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,105 posts)he was smart enough to understand separations of church and state. He, in hindsight, was great. I believe that Gore would have been even better as a PRESIDENT.
treestar
(82,383 posts)as a country, deciding we preferred fantasy, and electing an actor to emphasize that.
That was the age when we figured that if you kept saying something, you could make it true. It was there all the way down. I remember career advancing books and tapes that would put it in that context. You could be a millionaire if you just kept believing.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Even a Trump loving member of my family says Carter was the most honest and honorable man to ever hold the office.
KPN
(15,642 posts)The Genealogist
(4,723 posts)They think very highly of Carter as a person. He's positively shone in the years since he was in office.
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)lordsummerisle
(4,651 posts)For honesty and integrity he's in a league of his own. Possibly the anti-Trump...
mnmoderatedem
(3,722 posts)and yes, wingnuts jumped all over that.
Compare that to, uh, present day.
mnmoderatedem
(3,722 posts)and still one of the most underrated accomplishments of any presidency. Has lasted to this day.
No more significant accomplishment in the Mid East by any president, before or since.
ronatchig
(575 posts)What a crock! The reason that Carter was not a two term hero of the people is the traitorous dirty tricks the Reagan cabal pulled to steal the election!Look up Iran-Contra (Treason pure and simple).They also defined the template the pukes have used since-A slightly bumbling and stupid figurehead fronting for traitors working in the background to steal and scatter the wealth of our nation throughout the world. The whole time dumbing down the populace until they gladly accept a tyrant.
The book that is the topic of this thread will be worth reading, I would think,though I have yet to get it
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Ford and Pappa Bush installed the CIA's Team B before Carter got into office. Team B was composed of war hacks like Wolfowitz who had marching orders to contradict the CIA's internal assessment that the USSR was swirling the bowl (which was true). They leaked competing assessments which painted the Soviets as strong as ever (which they weren't) and had aggressive motivations against the US (which they didn't). Carter rightfully went with the CIA's internal assessment of the USSR and started drawing down defense programs like the B-1 bomber which was incredibly expensive and not needed. Saint Ronnie and the traitorous Team B used Carter's correct position to undermine his presidency and paint him as soft on the Soviets. The result was Cold War 2.0 under Saint Ronnie which flushed over $1 trillion 1980's dollars down the toilet and tripled the federal debt. It actually extended the Cold War by several years by feeding red meat to the Soviet hardliners.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_b
Funtatlaguy
(10,870 posts)And wrongly maligned.
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)congress and somehow failed to get healthcare which was popular even among some GOP back in the day. The economy was in shambles and interest rates were going up. The economy had weakened under Nixon, but little was done to fix it. He had no political savvy at all...and so much could have been accomplished with someone more politically skilled. Also, had he not run again, I believe we would have kept the presidency and Congress...and escaped Reagan who began the downfall of this country...so while I think Carter is a decent man, I think he was not a 'good' president. His election ushered in Reaganism. He has had a great post presidency ...one of the best. I believe the Clinton foundation has surpassed it in some ways with their work on HIV in Africa...but hey both ex-presidents have done much good.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)High inflation and interest rates were the result of Nixon and Ford's fucked up monetary policies which Carter fixed. Rather than giving him credit for this you blame him for it, which is complete bullshit. Even batshit crazy anti-fed wingnuts like Ron Fucking Paul credit Volcker with fixing the problem you describe, and Volcker was appointed by Carter.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Volcker
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)And in 1977, it appeared the economy was emerging from recession. For the most part, especially during these years, people vote their pocketbook. The prime was 6.5 in November of 1976 and by November of 1980 it was 16.06. Carter was in office for four years by then...you can't blame others. He didn't handle the economy well...he just didn't. While it may appear that unemployment was steady in terms of the level, that is misleading. We had steel failing and large numbers of unemployed people in the Midwest. My Mother talked of seeing the caravans of those leaving steel country...huge caravans leaving from steel states like Pennsylvania. And ask any steel person from Buffalo New York where people locked their doors and left the city penniless after massive layoffs. We lived in West Virginia at the time. And let's not forget the energy crisis which hurt American autos horribly and caused additional job losses. Working people were facing stagnant wages and massive inflation as well. In November of 1976 inflation was at 4.8. By November of 1980, inflation was at 12.8. That is unsustainable for any president. I can not see how Carter handled his presidency well in terms of the economy, or even foreign policy.
He was blindsided by the Iranian revolution and I can't say his response was particularly effective ...not even politically. While Carter is to be commended for the peace agreement between Egypt and Israel, he totally was caught unprepared for the Iranian revolution and the war between Iran and Iraq which caused an oil meltdown.
While Carter was a decent man, he did not handle the presidency well in my opinion, he failed to achieve health care, didn't see the Iranian revolution coming which was catastrophic in terms of oil, and he handled the economy poorly in general. both the interest rates and the inflation rates reflect this reality. I like Carter to a point ( I think he interferes with Democratic presidents and was the reason why Clinton was played in Korea , but I digress). He has done much good since his presidency. He is a wonderful humanitarian. But I can not agree that he was an effective president. And if we try to use that meme in elections, the GOP will bury us.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)The problem pre-dated Carter by only a decade. Its a bit of a mistake to only look at the effect and not consider the cause. There is no shortage of folks who credit Saint Ronnie with ending the Cold War and the economic successes in the early 80s. Both claims are specious.
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)getting out of recession... what Reagan did with his big spending. Thinks worsened considerably under Carter...and his tighten your belt philosophy was the last thing needed. You gave me an opinion...I gave you numbers. You provided no proof..and perhaps there is none. But the perception even today is of a failed presidency and as Democrats, we still pay a price for that. I do not think Carter was a good president. He is and always was a good man.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)It was all part of Volckers belt tightening. Whether you agree with it or not, Volkes is widely considered the best Fed chairman of all time by economists of all stripes. We have Carter to thank for believing in Paul Volcker.
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)simply wasn't good and this seems like rewriting history. I don't mean to offend...but I see no evidence of what you suggest. Obviously we were not in a deflationary cycle as in 08, but there are other sorts of recessions...I think the only deflationary cycle recession other than 08 was the great depression.
Major Nikon
(36,827 posts)Its in the link Ive already provided. Historical revisionism is blaming Carter for something he didnt cause and to a large degree was responsible for curing. I dont really care if you believe it or not and only care about correcting the myth you are perpetuating that just isnt true.
kmla
(4,047 posts)He was elected by a relatively slim majority, aided by the backlash of the post-Watergate pardon by Gerald Ford of Richard Nixon.
His presidency was primarily derailed due to the harbored resentment of big business and big banks who colluded to raise the interest rates to unheard of levels in order to derail his presidency and subsequently elect a "pro-business" republican president. (Ronnie...) The botched Iranian hostage rescue didn't help his re-election chances either. (And to this day I'm still not convinced there was not a back-door agreement between Reagan-Bush and the Iranian regime to delay the hostage release until after the election/inauguration.)
He failed to be re-elected in large part due to the "Misery Index" (interest rate + unemployment rate), which was a marketing ploy by the republican party that was used effectively against him during the campaign season.
The defeat of Jimmy Carter and election of Reagan in '80 election led directly to the Savings and Loan crisis of the late '80's/early '90s. You would have thought we would have learned our lesson about deregulating the banking industry. But obviously we didn't. And now the idiots are talking about relaxing banking regulations again...
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)Thanks.
kmla
(4,047 posts)More of a case of bad monetary policy by the feds, with an eager and willing banking industry that enjoyed raking in 16-18% interest rates on mortgages and even higher loan shark level rates on auto and consumer loans.
Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)impression. If there was an article available, I would have read it...long time ago.
malchickiwick
(1,474 posts)Why would you say that?
kmla
(4,047 posts)And I offered my opinion.
Your opinion may be different. YMMV.
malchickiwick
(1,474 posts)"Equally-principled" is probably the best answer here, but I look forward to your response.
logosoco
(3,208 posts)He was in office when I was between 7th and 8th grade. I was not having an easy time in life that far, but one evening I watched the President on TV and he talked about how there is an energy crisis and we need to reduce our energy use (instead of turning up the thermostat, put on a sweater). That had a major impact on how I look at the planet and the ways humans are affecting it.
He also has done amazing work with Habitat for Humanity since leaving office. He seems like a sensible person who did not let the power go to his head.
Tactical Peek
(1,208 posts)After all these years, I still experience extreme disappointment when people fall for the right-wing Republican PR hit job perpetuated against him, even unto this day, even in this thread.
duforsure
(11,885 posts)Just like many have said to me , he was to nice a guy to get much done, and didn't understand how things then really worked, and was set up many times to fail.
sandensea
(21,620 posts)The decline in oil prices - consequently, inflation and interest rates as well - would not have been possible otherwise, or would have happened much more slowly.
Ronnie took full credit, of course.
scarytomcat
(1,706 posts)the repugs made fun of his religiousness called him names
he was also denied a second term because of treason (Iran contra)
He is still a great man doing big things (unlike the bushes)
He was forces to sell his family's farm so he would not have a conflict of interest
trueblue2007
(17,203 posts)Hawaii Hiker
(3,165 posts)Demsrule86
(68,539 posts)It is my opinion that Carter should not have run for a second term...thus saving us from Reagan.
MicaelS
(8,747 posts)As others have mentioned, he had a Democratic Congress, and got little done domestically.
Then there is the Iran situation. That should have never happened. It took too long to try a rescue, and then it was a fiasco.
And when Teddy Kennedy ran against him, and the below happened, that tells you a lot.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries,_1980
Jimmy Carter
Contests won 36
Popular vote 10,043,016
Percentage 51.1%
Ted Kennedy
Contests won 12
Popular vote 7,381,693
Percentage 37.6%
Buzz cook
(2,471 posts)and backing the Afghan rebels did more to bring down the USSR than Reagan's deficit spending binge.
Not participating in the 2980 Olympics also damaged the Soviets and contributed to their fall.
malchickiwick
(1,474 posts)Tearing them down was one of the first acts of the Gipper years. Reagan did more to destroy this country than any prez since Buchanan, in my humble.
Hassler
(3,370 posts)Response to Willie Pep (Original post)
Hassler This message was self-deleted by its author.