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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe Roseanne revival is incredibly honest about life in Trump's America
Source: Vox, by Todd VanDerWerff
*****
What makes Roseanne Conners Trump support such an interesting idea to build an episode of television around is the way it blissfully wanders into one of 2018 pop cultures demilitarized zones: Entertainment can be for Trump supporters or for those who dont like Trump, but its not supposed to be for both.
And for both white progressives and white conservatives who share a family (yes, there are people of color struggling with these political divides in their own families, but this is overwhelmingly an issue for white families), this is a constant fact of life in 2018 America: Can we still love each other? Can we work this out? Should we work this out? The answers are as varied as these families are, but Roseanne takes the simple idea of living in 2018 without killing your family members or even just dying yourself and builds a whole season of a TV show around it.
*****
Roseanne has always been about the big gap between the American dream and the American reality for too many people. When I cite the original series vague progressivism, I dont really mean that it had a coherent political framework so much as it believed in the idea that the American dream was too often hoarded by those who least needed access to it, who then parceled it out in little chunks to those further down the ladders of economic, racial, and social privilege. It called, week after week, not for revolution but for understanding that people like the Conners were out there and just trying their best.
*****
That makes Roseanne sound like some sort of dark elegy for a forgotten America, I realize, and maybe it is that. But its also funny and vibrant and warm. It takes a little while to rediscover its rhythms, but once it does, it feels tuned in to its world and its country in a way few sitcoms are anymore. There are punchlines in these episodes that dont land because the audience seems scared to laugh at how raw they are. Good, I think. This show has always been better when the humor comes peppered with fear.
Read it all at: https://www.vox.com/culture/2018/3/27/17165928/roseanne-review-revival-abc-trump
Twenty years later - none of us are the same.
MFM008
(19,808 posts)Maggot supporters in my family...
That we associate with.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)But then, you never get to greet your relatives with, "Hello, Deplorables!"
nolabear
(41,963 posts)And its hard. I love those people. I loved them for 60 years before he showed up. Weve disagreed and argued and gotten mad and weve also tried to talk and understand one another. Sometimes we just tolerate one another because giving up our whole lives out of rage and fear is a loss too great to bear.
Id be giving up sharing their joys and sorrows and sharing mine. Were family. We act like family; we take care of one another and provide for one another. And its HARD.
If you wall yourself off when you are angry at someone whos been important in your life I think you also wall off any path forward. And thats unthinkable for me, as much as I despise 45.
Hekate
(90,681 posts)Thanks
TNLib
(1,819 posts)I hate watching them turn into angry old deplorables and they are starting to get to the point they may need my help soon.
and it's the same for my inlaws who have always been ultra conservative. But they are now so bad off one is on hospice and they are both in assisted living. When they get to this point, politics just doesn't matter.
nolabear
(41,963 posts)Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)No one was supposed to like Archie Bunker, either!
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)If he was I would have never watched the series.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Everything today is sales and marketing. EVERYTHING!
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)I don't know what the hell happened to her. I'm sure I'll get slammed for saying this, but I think developed some sort of mental illness at some point. She did suffer a head injury from being hit by a car when she was a teenager, and one has to wonder if it has been manifesting itself in her behavior. I can't hate her the way most people here seem to. I abhor her support for Spanky the Ass Clown, but outside of that, I rather feel bad for her. She seems extremely messed up.
poboy2
(2,078 posts)Hekate
(90,681 posts)Or do you not know that alt-right is synonymous with Neo-Nazi and White Nationalist?
I am not getting that from the new Rosanne Conner at all.
wellst0nev0ter
(7,509 posts)Context: She insisted on wearing that outfit for a photo shoot with millennial Jewish magazine HEEB. And she is of Jewish heritage.
VOX
(22,976 posts)Not blaming you in the slightest, wellst0nev0ter. (Actually glad you posted those, I haven't seen them until now.) I'm blaming her for pushing that image. It's going where thoughtful people shouldn't go.
But there's the catch: "thoughtful."
RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)She is beyond just voting for Trump she is full blown deplorable.
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)Apparently, they don't matter, even though at least a couple of them are most certainly NOT Deplorables.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Seems no one wants to answer you.
B2G
(9,766 posts)Love them both.
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)Tikki
(14,557 posts)It's not like there isn't.
Tikki
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)Especially if one doesn't have cable, which I don't. I'm not a fan of "NCIS" or shit like "The Voice." That was pretty much the best of the line-up, which tells you how bad it was.
Tikki
(14,557 posts)Nothing on PBS, it is online? There are some free online classic movie sites.
We, also, don't have cable.
Tikki
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)Too hard on the eyes.
Tikki
(14,557 posts)We run the internet shows on our TV.
Tikki
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)You have a nice day as well.
GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)rzemanfl
(29,557 posts)GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)But, somehow, it's being conflated into a cable politics show?
GusBob
(7,286 posts)I honestly don't know how I would be able to conduct my life without such a wonderful creation
Jesus fucking christ
SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)ProfessorGAC
(65,031 posts)That article seemed like pedantic gibberish.
poboy2
(2,078 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)dalton99a
(81,485 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)The comparisons between her and Archie Bunker are flawed because Carroll O'Connor wasn't a Deplorable in real life. I might have watched the show if Roseanne wasn't a Deplorable in real life.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)not to help the country better understand bigots.
Archie was the joke.
zipplewrath
(16,646 posts)The most admirable character was supposed to be Edith, not Meathead. She was to be the rational voice. Archie was to be the over the top lower middle class character, but Meathead was to be the over the top left winger.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)Archie Bunker was deliberately made to look like a modern day deplorable of low intelligence and shallow reasoning, if even that. He was not there to normalize racism and sexism. He was there to show the stupidity and ignorance of it. To blow it up by taking it out of the shadows and put an unblinking spotlight on it. The humor was pure genius. It was the sugar which made it easier to face.
BannonsLiver
(16,386 posts)ismnotwasm
(41,979 posts)Freelancer
(2,107 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)But you'd have to watch it to know that.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Having a black grandkid doesn't mean someone's not racist. A lot of my male ancestors had black children and grandchildren. They were still racist as hell.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)overseas as was he, and that is their child.
There is nothing here that is strange or remarkable. This is family today.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)the black adult who could actually push back on Rosanne is conveniently out of sight and silent?
All the better to show how supposedly not-racist Trump supporters are without having to actually confront any difficult race issues face to face with an actual black person over the age of 10.
I guess DJ can occasionally speak up for black folk since he is, after all, he has proven how so not racist he is because he married an invisible black woman and can be our voice when he so chooses. And since having an actual real live grown-assed black woman speaking for herself would be divisive.
Still totally not impressed.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)It's only a "thirty minute" show - and a comedy.
Aren't we past 'token' yet?
I dream of the day this doesn't even cross one's mind.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Okaaay.
Happy viewing.
ismnotwasm
(41,979 posts)I dated a black person for 3 years
I have a half black grandchild
My best friend from high school is black AND Native American
Insert spurious or legit relationship to person(s) of color here, all the while blithely ignoring the racism of privilege and the existence of white supremacy
uponit7771
(90,336 posts)WhiskeyGrinder
(22,338 posts)That's not vague progressivism, that's populism, which is exactly what gave us Trump. Calling for "understanding" about "people like the Connors" out there who are "just trying their best" is lazily coded dogwhistling and a full-on excuse for any racial, gender or other class scapegoating "people like the Connors" might do.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)He was a construction worker, Not all blue collar people are rubes.
leftstreet
(36,108 posts)+1 a million times
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)You want to apply how we feel today back to when we were transitioning from Bush 2.0 to the hopeful promise of Clinton?
I guess you can.
I just remember it different.
WhiskeyGrinder
(22,338 posts)Demit
(11,238 posts)what the original show was trying to do back then ("It called, week after week, not for revolution but for understanding that people like the Conners were out there and just trying their best." )
Not sure I agree with that, myself. I just remember the show being built around Roseanne Barr's shtick: the "domestic goddess," as she jokingly called herself in her standup routine, who was anything but. She relied a lot on shocking people's expectations. I never saw that as social commentary, exactly.
MountCleaners
(1,148 posts)Dealt with class issues, race issues, queer issues. That's why I watched the show.
Obviously she's nutso now, but if you read interviews with her back then, she was very progressive.
I'm going to watch it anyway. I think it's good for Trumpies to see other Trumpies interacting with civility toward left-wingers. The fact that Roseanne is a Trumpie on the show only opens her up to criticism from all of the other characters.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Its a goddamned TV show. They probably said the same thing about Duck Dynasty.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Atticus
(15,124 posts)dalton99a
(81,485 posts)Hmm no - I see enough of them in real life
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)She had an "I'd Still Vote for President Nixon" bumper sticker on her car after he left office, while I was still in school. She spent 40 years with the Republican
I have family members who visit us - and some who don't visit us.
Maybe this isn't a laughing matter.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"Maybe this isn't a laughing matter..."
Unless it's billed as a sit-com. Which it is. So it is.
I get it... it's fun to pretend so much tolerance for the sake of self-righteousness at the expense of others for simply not watching a sitcom.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)I knew what was comin' - I started watchin' this show in late '80's!
I don't care if anyone doesn't watch the show. Just don't review it if you don't!
Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)I thought it was disgraceful. Will never tune in again.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Its entertainment for everybody!
Gawd this review is so fricking gag worthy. Its almost offensive
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)They'll give Scott Baio a platform and brings back Joanie Loves Chachi ?
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)That's the point.
Knowing the Roseanne character, both are pretty true to the previous 9 years depicted - 20 years ago. It was great social commentary back then, and has the makings to be that now.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Its all made-up. actors, writers, scripts, producers, stages, props. a week time frame compressed into 30 minutes
There is no social feedback loop. You sit there and watch it
The point is not to get you to think, respond or interact
The point is to get you to watch commercials
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)We bring something to everything we see.
Commercials, subscription fees, tickets, pay for what we want to see. If it fails, we don't see it anymore.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Do you think this sit-com represents an "incredibly honest" portrayal of America under Donald Trump?
How in any way is it accurate?
If it was honest and accurate ABC would not be deleting the lead characters tweets. They would in fact be part of the show
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)I don't see life through one single lens. It's too limiting.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)Do you think that the show is an incredibly honest portrayal of life in Trumps America
You posted the piece. Is it fact or fiction?
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)If you read the article/review, you will understand what the writer is conveying.
But you don't have to!
Come with what you got before you saw the show you will never watch!
nolabear
(41,963 posts)I'm fascinated by the responses. Some respond out of the politics of Roseanne Barr herself. Some watch and don't like the depiction of one character that they identify with. Some see it as a class issue. Some resonate because they have relatives like the characters and wrestle with dealing with them too. Some cheer for the sides like they do teams.
I welcome that.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)In both categories, Roseanne was the top regularly scheduled broadcast this season, and the premiere even outpaced (by 10%) the 16.6 million recorded for its May 1997 series finale.
Roseanne towered over tough competition, CBS's NCIS and NBC's The Voice, and delivered ABC's best results in the time period since 2006. It scored the highest rating for a comedy since The Big Bang Theory's 2014 fall premiere.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/tv/2018/03/28/roseanne-makes-huge-ratings-noise-much-awaited-abc-return/466083002/
nolabear
(41,963 posts)Her cast members havent gone on to such major careers so seeing them will be more of a surprise.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)'cause 'old fahts' like me are the only one's left watching TV!
nolabear
(41,963 posts)I was surprised that the first ad last night, in what must have been an expensive slot, was Haribo gummy bears!
John Fante
(3,479 posts)suspect in the murder of his girlfriend.
nolabear
(41,963 posts)Well now I have to go look up the salacious details. How sad. And creepy.
rurallib
(62,414 posts)and for us here a repeat "Antiques Roadshow." So it was the only thing new on "regular" TV at the time.
I opted for Chris Hayes and an NIT game.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)For CBS, NCIS (1.3, 11.8 million) was down in both measures while Bull (1.2, 10.7 million) and NCIS: New Orleans (0.9, 8.6 million) held steady.
New episodes of LA to Vegas (0.6, 2 million) and The Mick (0.6, 1.8 million) were down on Fox.
On The CW, Black Lightning (0.5, 1.5 million) was even.
http://variety.com/2018/tv/news/roseanne-revival-abc-ratings-1202738237/
GusBob
(7,286 posts)I take issue with the fawning approach this article presents.
This fucking sit com is not an honest portrayal of life in Donald Trumps America
There's no laugh track out here. No goddamned punch lines for ratings
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)The two sisters hadn't spoken to each other in a year over the 2016 election. The two oldsters have to portion out half their prescriptions, all they could afford. The kids are back in the house to watch the aging parents, for job issues, for money issues, for help with kids. On and on.
These aren't punchlines.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)I didn't know that they had so many problems. I hope things work out for the Connell family.
Looks like Trump, our TV president, is a big fan as well
MountCleaners
(1,148 posts)People on Twitter are talking about it. That's a good thing.
poboy2
(2,078 posts)kacekwl
(7,017 posts)liberal loon. Did not find the show itself funny at all.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)If you watched the previous 9 seasons you'd recognize this was her character.
Va Lefty
(6,252 posts)PatSeg
(47,430 posts)was always a bit off-the-wall publicly. Some of her antics were really outrageous and off-putting, but people watched the show anyway, as it had an excellent ensemble cast and top notch writing. They covered topics that few shows addressed and the family was more realistic than most sitcoms.
Of course, I thought Roseanne's support of Trump was a real turnoff, but I watched the show, because I wanted to see John Goodman as Dan and Laurie Metcalf as Jackie again. Though the show was named after Roseanne, she was not necessarily the strongest or most convincing actor. I never felt like she transitioned well from standup comedian to actor all that well. Without that extraordinary cast and writers, the show would have bombed I'm sure.
Meanwhile, prior to the show's debut, Roseanne started showing up in the news because of her extreme Tweets about politics. Maybe it was just Roseanne, being Roseanne, or maybe she was intentionally drawing attention to herself and as such, to her new show.
I will watch again, in support of the entire cast and writers.
MountCleaners
(1,148 posts)I think some people here are just cynical about tv in general.
The constant negativity gets me down sometimes. I found the show a relief from that. It wasn't as good as the old show, but it wasn't bad. I'm not gonna die because I listened to a Trumpie character. It still portrays a working-class family, which is how I grew up. I could relate to a lot of the stuff that was in the original show.
PatSeg
(47,430 posts)I agree, it wasn't as good as the original - I still watch reruns of it now and then - but it was actually better than I was expecting. Reboots rarely recapture the magic of the originals, but it is good to see so many cast members back together. They really do capture working class families. I was raised in the Chicago area and so much of the show rings true.
I am looking forward to the reboot of Murphy Brown. With today's politics, that should be very interesting.
Response to yallerdawg (Original post)
Freelancer This message was self-deleted by its author.
ecstatic
(32,703 posts)I was a kid when it aired before, but I watched, despite not relating to the characters (except for the daughter) or lifestyle. Most likely I watched because of the time slot and proximity to other shows that I had a stronger interest in.
Response to ecstatic (Reply #85)
Freelancer This message was self-deleted by its author.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)If you have excellent firewall and anti-virus, the episodes are "shared" all over the internet.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)Revanchist
(1,375 posts)lunamagica
(9,967 posts)mreilly
(2,120 posts)... 3 reasons why:
1. I don't watch television at all since it's all mind-numbingly stupid and dull. There isn't a single show out there which captures my interest.
2. Roseanne is literally one of the most annoying celebrities out there, regardless of politics.
3. I refuse to watch anything from a piece of shit Trump supporter.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Looks like a lot of families in the USA today.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)But then add their votes to the votes of people who hate them to give them the numbers they need to elect people whose mission it is to make it government policy to take away their rights, dehumanize them and return to a time when it was fine to treat them like shit.
So, forgive me if I'm not impressed that they let the black kid and the kid with skirt stay in the family picture.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)That's fine.
Watch or don't watch.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)ProfessorGAC
(65,031 posts)Totally get your point.
frogmarch
(12,153 posts)how come she didn't commit suicide at age 60 like she'd said years ago that everyone should?
I can't stand her. Never could, not even before I knew what a piece of shit she is.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Laurie Metcalf, Sara Gilbert, others?
All tainted, too?
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)frogmarch
(12,153 posts)Just Roseanne. She's enough to keep me from watching the show.
RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)You seem insistent everyone needs to watch this goddamn show.
Plenty of good people work at Walmart. I choose not to shop there regardless.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)I shopped at Walmart. I learned about Walmart. I worked at Walmart.
I choose not to shop at Walmart because I know Walmart.
MineralMan
(146,307 posts)I refuse to support that woman in any way. She's toxic.
Va Lefty
(6,252 posts)GoCubsGo
(32,083 posts)Could have been a decent show had the left out the politics, and tried not to shoe-horn every social issue on the planet into it. They went waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay overboard to a point where it was just one big cliche. Wish they had stuck closer to the original show. I watched because there wasn't much else on that interested me. I don't know if I'll watch again.
CentralMass
(15,265 posts)vlyons
(10,252 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)As I said elsewhere, Im just thrilled that this DU tempest about a sitcom has knocked Stormy off the front page in GD.
ecstatic
(32,703 posts)I had zero interest in Roseanne or her show. I didn't realize it was a reboot of the old show, with many of the same characters. There's no more room on my DVR, but I might check it out on demand (if time ever permits).
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,182 posts)The old show was okay, had its good moments, slacked off towards the end, and that should have been that.
Not rushing to watch it all again.
Honestly, we haven't run out of original ideas that entertaining brand new shows can't still be made.
I just finished binge watching Season 2 of Santa Clarita Diet on Netflix. Absolutely hysterical.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Broadcast TV. Cord cutting. Internet. Smart phones.
Who are the only people who have a digital antenna hooked up to their TV? People who watched all these old shows!
NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)They cut the cord and use the TV reception for morning news and sports. In fact, OTA (over the air) receiving is growing every year as people realize they can get their HD TV without a $200 cable bill. That said, I spend far more time watching Netflix for shows, but an antenna is a one time only cost vs monthly and I like my weather/traffic in the morning.
As for antennas themselves, there is no such thing as a digital antenna. It's a marketing gimmick - most people in a major city can use rabbit ears and ring to great effect. The old antennas still work, though some were optimized for VHF (54-88MHz and 174-216 MHz), and most TV stations were moved into the UHF bands (470 - 806 MHz). With a digital format they can broadcast on a higher frequency channel and still show up on the TV as their original channel. For example, WFSB CBS Channel 3, in Connecticut broadcasts on UHF channel 33 (584-590 MHz), but appears on my TV as channel 3. The lower band of VHF was mostly eliminated during the switch to open these frequencies up for emergency communications.
The examples people cite of losing a channel with the digital switch are likely caused by either having a VHF optimized antenna and the frequency changed to UHF, or the UHF being even more "line of sight" sensitive and terrain blocks the new signal.
B2G
(9,766 posts)Adding to my queue.
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,182 posts)Someone said let's combine the premises of The Walking Dead, Dexter, and Desperate Housewives, and just mix in a bunch of absurdist humor, and run with it.
And it works.
LAS14
(13,783 posts)... it was back on the air. Got on 'On Demand'. It's just as smart and funny as ever.
Adenoid_Hynkel
(14,093 posts)And is trying to hide her vile racism and Alex Jonesery of the past two years in order to market a warm and fuzzy kind of Trumpism
ananda
(28,859 posts)I watched the much earlier version some because
Laurie Metcalf was so funny.
Response to yallerdawg (Original post)
.99center This message was self-deleted by its author.