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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsFiring McCabe would be unfathomable cruelty which could have major blowback
I think people underestimate the amount of blowback and hostility that would be generated by firing McCabe. I'm pretty sure that ordinary people would see it as unimaginable cruelty. It would be portrayed (rightly) as the rich and powerful guy screwing the working man out of his pension. Don't underestimate the reaction to such a mean spirited move.
I also wonder what kind of unintended consequences it could unleash from the FBI.
SHRED
(28,136 posts)...who is still a Republican needs to reevaluate that association.
shanny
(6,709 posts)There's never even been a Democratic Director (and why is that, exactly, one wonders). I doubt if even tRump could have changed the culture that fast.
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otoh maybe he could
Seriously though, seeing Democrats as the defenders of the CIA and the FBI and intelligence agencies in general is a little surreal.
Hekate
(90,202 posts)...and what Trump is doing is howlingly wrong.
peggysue2
(10,811 posts)Yes, it is wa-a-ay into ironyville that the Boomers, the generation that pushed back against authority figures--The Man, Law Enforcement, the Military--is now standing shoulder-to-shoulder with those organizations to save the Republic.
But as you said: right is right, wrong is wrong. Trump and his odious acolytes are toxic, reprehensible, treasonous.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)it could really unleash some nasty stuff. They have access to "fbi files", those juicy bits of personal, business and professional acts that can embarrass people. I wouldn't be surprised to see some "leaks" about this administration start making their way into the public eye.
Eyeball_Kid
(7,410 posts)It really does fit with everything we've seen and heard about him. One of the obsessions he has during his long fidgety nights is to plot ways of exacting revenge on those who displease him. McCabe's in his sights and he will believe it to be a sign of weakness if he doesn't destroy McCabe. Trumpy must have a steady diet of this kind of "cleansing." Look for more. There will always be more, just as there will always be suckers who think they'll be able to extract from Trumpy more than he'll extract from them.
democratisphere
(17,235 posts)The Friday sh't show is on deck.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)And if so, he won't do it, because McCabe could sue for retaliation based solely on Trump's public statements, let alone what he probably said in private.
regnaD kciN
(26,035 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)So that makes me think Sessions is not involved because McCabe is a witness for Mueller.
herding cats
(19,549 posts)Thats what everything Ive read today has said, at least.
The Wielding Truth
(11,411 posts)dawg day
(7,947 posts)Trump's nasty tweets will be used against him. McCabe would be able quickly to prove malice, and in fact, Trump a few months ago even tweeted about McCabe's plan to retire.
Anyway, anyone who fires someone a few days before retirement is clearly malicious.
But Trump's minions are already in force-- "Well, he SHOULD be fired!"
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)He would certainly be a very wealthy man after he and his lawyers gets through with them ...
*Thats a joke ... I wouldnt wish this on anyone. But at least he could have the last laugh in the end.
tblue37
(64,982 posts)regnaD kciN
(26,035 posts)...and, thus, right up Trump's alley.
MontanaMama
(23,242 posts)Expect it.
Cicada
(4,533 posts)He is 49 or 50. His forced exit will probably be followed by partnership in a top firm. He will probably make an extra 15 million or so before he turns 65. So stealing his 1.8 million pension is typical Trump cruelty but we need not worry about Mr McCabes finances.
Hekate
(90,202 posts)If Trump gets away with this, it is one more rip in the fabric of the Civil Service and in the idea of a career in government service. These are the people who hold the institutional memory; these are the people who actually believe they are serving their country. In some career categories, they actually put their lives on the line.
Remember when Dick Cheney outed Valerie Plame? This is in the same category of heinous betrayal.
I'm old enough that I have had my issues with the sometimes-behavior of the FBI, CIA, US military, and so on. But while I profoundly believe in oversight, while I believe there is great room for improvement, I never doubt the necessity for these agencies nor do I doubt the sense of service most of their personnel have. You don't go into it for the money.
SunSeeker
(51,377 posts)His only option for making good money (but nothing like $15M, more like $200k to $400k/year) is to become a white collar criminal defense attorney. I don't see him wanting to do that. He'd see that as going to the dark side. He's been a prosecutor his entire 20-year career.
However, maybe he could get a job with a state Attorney General office. That pays only about $75k to $150k/ year.
Cicada
(4,533 posts)Rudy left and became a partner at a firm where profit per partner is now 1.7 million per year. Mary Jo White works as a partner for a firm where per partner profit is more than 2 million per year. 40 US firms have profits per partner over 1.5 million per year. In my thirties my girl friend also in her thirties made between one and three million per year in Los Angeles. I think the prestige of a guy at the deep throat level of the FBI (Felt was also #2) should be worth a lot to a firm. His net worth is already 11 million I read, so it is creepy that Trump may steal his 1.8 million present value pension but I am relieved that this is not a major issue for him, financially. His wife is a doctor who probably makes several hundred thousand per year. Look, I dont condone Trumps cruelty, but I was relieved to find out the damage is not grave. I am just trying to lessen the pain of those worried for him, as I was before I thought it through.
SunSeeker
(51,377 posts)Otherwise, he would not have fought for his pension.
Cicada
(4,533 posts)Though I certainly agree Rudy is reptilian. Maybe that is unfair to reptiles. Mary Jo White represented a journalist sued by Trump because the reporter said Trump lied. There is a wonderful 170 page transcript of a deposition in which Trump was forced to face many many many off his lies, based on his own documents contrasted with his dishonest statements. But maybe I am naive. Maybe working for such firms is immoral. I chose to bail out after only a couple years as a mere associate so I am not an expert. And my girlfriend who persisted was in fact kind of creepy.
SunSeeker
(51,377 posts)You weren't money-focused enough to stay. Billing 2500 hours a year in a corporate firm is really hard if you have a soul.
must be nice, getting a fat pension after just 20 years
hvn_nbr_2
(6,481 posts)We might not see it publicly for awhile, but that would be a direct attack on the institutions that Mueller reveres. Mueller would definitely react.
Nasruddin
(741 posts)"I'm pretty sure that ordinary people would see it as unimaginable cruelty."
I don't think so. Maybe if you emphasized his law enforcement career.
There are a lot of people who bitterly resent government workers receiving any benefits, and pensions make them hyperbolic. You'll get remarks like, "It's a good start!".
Skittles
(152,964 posts)OnDoutside
(19,908 posts)happens next, before it would go to Sessions ?
lindysalsagal
(20,444 posts)Sure. Go ahead with future hirings after that. See what kind of applicants you get.
BlueTsunami2018
(3,461 posts)For authorizing the disclosure of financial information to the press during an investigation of the Clinton Foundation and then lying about it to the IG.
It was on their editorial page yesterday. I dont know if its ok to link it here so Im not. But Id like to know if anyone can knock down this spin or if theres any validity to it.
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)Trump is a cruel SOB and this is something ordinary folks will understand. Fuck Trump and I hope McCabe doesn't lose his pension...the jerks in the White House are trying to get us pile on by pretending it is about Hillary...it is not.
BlueTsunami2018
(3,461 posts)I need some ammo to shoot down the Тяцмр humpers.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)And that he followed procedure to clear conflict of interest. (On phone can't link)
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)Trump is Potter in 'Its a wonderful life' only not as smart.
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)This is classic asshole Trumpie. Trump we are going to say soon...'your fired'...take your orange ass home or better yet to prison. You will die in prison I hear...Trump.
BlueTsunami2018
(3,461 posts)I was hoping someone could help me out here.
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)this way. We won't gang up on McCabe...and using Hillary in order to bait us won't work and is to clever by half. What 'they' are doing is bullshit and unlike Russiagate, ordinary people get going after a person's pension and it shows what an mean spiteful person Trump is...not good for this loser who bleeds supporters on a daily basis.
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)BlueTsunami2018
(3,461 posts)Nothing really debunks the story. The Washington Post seems to legitimize it. The FBI office of professional responsibility recommends firing McCabe. I was hoping someone could help me argue the point beyond the he said/she said aspect but instead theres just a lot of hostility for simply asking.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"but instead theres just a lot of hostility for simply asking. .."
No, I think the hostility is due to your minimizing and dismissal of valid responses.
BlueTsunami2018
(3,461 posts)Just some variations of its obvious that Тяцмр is simply being a vindictive asshole.
Of course he is, I know that, you know that. But thats not going to fly in a debate with the opposition. Did McCabe lie to these people or not? Are these allegations plausible?
There are some people on this site who are really good at making the arguments based on facts and are able to cite where those facts come from. I was merely looking for help. Everything I turn up makes it seem as if there actually is a case to fire the guy.
Theres no need to be hostile about it. Were on the same side.
Demsrule86
(68,352 posts)I don't know if he voted Trump in 16, we don't usually discuss it, but he is disgusted now.
no_hypocrisy
(45,774 posts)He is a nihilist at heart. He tears down versus building and strengthening. His DNA.
njhoneybadger
(3,910 posts)Last edited Fri Mar 16, 2018, 08:53 AM - Edit history (1)
Uncle Fester's daughter referred to Putin as a bad actor and then put McCabe in the same
Category calling him a "bad actor"
A more offensive remark I cannot recall!
peggysue2
(10,811 posts)could be significant, ramping up unintended consequences. Trump will reap the whirlwind for his vindictiveness. One thing Americans understand is fairness/unfairness in the work place, being cheated by the boss on paychecks, tips, sick pay, overtime, pensions, etc..
If Trump follows through, he will be very sorry for his spiteful short-sightedness.
Vinca
(50,170 posts)That would unleash "fire and fury like the world has never seen" from the FBI. Every crime from pocketing a Tootsie Roll at age 5 to treason would then be uncovered by the FBI and their cohorts at other law enforcement agencies nationwide.
njhoneybadger
(3,910 posts)Holy shit
Freaking gangsters
dembotoz
(16,739 posts)round here mostly attended by seniors....it is just who shows up...
point at the congressman an say...this bastard took away mc cabes pension with nary a tear....
how much should you trust him with your social security and medicare.....
great fun
aikoaiko
(34,127 posts)Most people dont know or dont care about McCabe either.
I dont think its possible for Trump to act shamelessly enough to wake up his supporters.
MichMary
(1,714 posts)He is 49 years old and can retire with a $1.8M pension after only 18 years. What working person can relate to that?
Renew Deal
(81,802 posts)Its the civil service model that many choose. Doesnt matter if youre a meter maid or an FBI Director.
MichMary
(1,714 posts)can get a $1.8M pension after only 18 years? I bet not.
Renew Deal
(81,802 posts)Do you know what the civil service pay model is and how it works? Can you name three jobs that it applies to? I'm happy to teach you if necessary.
MichMary
(1,714 posts)over 40 years ago at our county Dept. of Social Services, and I remember that it was virtually impossible to fire a CS employee. You had to do something pretty extreme.
I also know what it's like to work in the private sector and be subject to employment-at-will, to be in a non-union position and have seniority rendered meaningless when it comes to downsizing, and to have pension plans disappear and be replaced by 401k plans. Dh's promised retiree insurance went poof one year, shortly before he retired.
I stand by my original comment that most people can't relate to the sweet deal McCabe seems to have had.
Renew Deal
(81,802 posts)He got paid more relative to his skill and ability.
MichMary
(1,714 posts)with a $1.8M pension. That's NOT a sweet deal?!?
Renew Deal
(81,802 posts)It's the same deal the military, police officers, and many others make.
How much is he getting annually? How much is salary and how much is benefits?
Ms. Toad
(33,915 posts)I will retire at age 72 with a defined benefit plan of around $46,000 after 30 years of public service. Most people these days have almost nothing saved, and nothing more than social security as retirement income.
Millions is beyond sweet.
You are correct that he might have been able to make more in the private secretary - but even his civil service income is well beyond an income level most Trump supporters can imagine. I don't think they will be inclined to feel too sorry for him.
Renew Deal
(81,802 posts)MichMary
(1,714 posts)I just disagreed that there would be the backlash you seem to think there will be. McCabe is only 49. He can still put in 20 years elsewhere and retire at an age most of us think is reasonable.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)Between this and the whole State Department thing. Government is supposed to be staffed by professionals who are experts in their fields. Now, I know that McCabe is a political appointee right now, but firing him and taking away his pension that he earned by being a professional will have a chilling affect at all levels.
This and the political witch hunt at State will destroy the Civil Service system and return us to the bad old days of cronyism. Say what you will about government employees, but this current system is a whole lot better than the old one.
wishstar
(5,267 posts)Some posters seem to think he was set to receive over a million per year. His current salary has been just over $160,000 per year.
People in law enforcement careers both federally and in state and local jobs are usually able to retire after 20 years unlike the rest of us.
From everything I have read, Andrew McCabe just happened to have misfortune of being in position as Comey's assistant where he ended up in crosshairs as convenient target of a Trumpian politically motivated rightwing scheme for a fall guy to be attacked in order to discredit the FBI and the Mueller probe.
Very demoralizing for civil servants and definitely a disincentive for anyone to accept a higher management post offered by a political appointment when taking a leadership position can destroy a lengthy career and take away an expected pension.
Gothmog
(143,999 posts)tblue37
(64,982 posts)susanna
(5,231 posts)Anyone - ANYONE - in the real world who can't see the flagrant obstruction of justice that this (cough) administration engages in, constantly, is just hell-bent on drinking the koolaid and ignoring reality.
Deplorable seems kind in retrospect.
oasis
(49,152 posts)With this move on McCabe, Trump has really rocked the hornet's nest.