Video games with guns are a problem,

[Eko]

but actual guns are not. SMH.

[greyl]

1. Especially in the USA, since other countries don't have violent video games. nt

[Eko]

2. Yes indeed.

[Spouting1horn]

35. Actually

Anders Breviek spent hours upon hours per day playing violent video games.

[EX500rider]

44. He spent hours a day breathing oxygen also...

[TreasonousBastard]

3. Killing murderous Nazis and hungry invading monsters teaches us to...

shoot up churches and schoolkids hiding in closets.

[Eko]

6. Wouldnt it teach us

to kill Nazis and monsters?

[TreasonousBastard]

13. In Japan it does, but we are told that here it doesn't...

Here it just makes us violent.

Another difference between us is that in Japan they don't have a gun culture, and hardly anyone has a gun. And Japan's murder rate is .31 per 100,000-- less than one tenth of ours.

Funny how that works.

[Exotica]

14. The difference is far larger if you are talking just about gun crime deaths

Japan has one of the lowest rates of gun crime in the world. In 2014 there were just six gun deaths, compared to 33599 in the US.

https://www.google.se/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/magazine-38365729

[EX500rider]

45. Even without guns the US homicide rate is larger then Japans.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

4. Violence and conflict as entertainment is THE problem.

Guns are a convenient accessory to the fact.

..............

[Eko]

5. Sure, because other countries that have the same video games

but different gun laws and don't have this problem. Also, you are arguing that the fake representation of something is worse than the real thing. Ridiculous. Preposterous.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

10. I suspect you're missing my context.

I speaking to the overall lust for violence and social controversy in all forms of entertainment, and this has worsened in my lifetime of 70 years.

My broad contention is that this has created a complacent mentality toward doing harm to others, whether by gun or by work of mouth.

This, coupled with the right-wing philosophy of every man for himself has been very destructive to our society, IMO.

[obamanut2012]

17. Again, you are totally wrong

Prove it with legit peer-reviewed studies. Guess what? You can't.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

19. I didn't join DU to...

have to provide university-level research to justify my personal opinion for every post. I expressed my opinion based on being a 70 Y.O. parent and grandparent, as well as watching the behavior of many kids of my friends and peers and the behavior of thousands of adults along the way.

I think you, like the other poster didn't understand the context of what I tried to express, or perhaps I didn't go into enough detail. I certainly in no way am defending guns. Nor was I making a statement about the psychological effects of video games alone.

I was trying to say that our entire social environment in the last 50 or so years has changed radically in a direction that encourages violence and vitriol between citizens, and I worry about the effect this has on developing children. Video games, social media, news media, and even everyday conversations between people enter into that mix. I think we all agree there's increasing divisiveness, individuality and greed (rather than community), xenophobia and isolationism in our daily dialog. This increasing daily madness has become a form of entertainment for many people - some spending hours every day sniping at faceless persons on social media.

What I meant in my original statement about guns is that they are convenient and rapid-fire tools for those that own them to express and act out that hatred and anger without a rational thought process prior to acting. Any thinking that might occur in those few moments required to pull and fire a gun is influenced significantly by a person's psychological history and current mental state. I stand by my opinion that this psychology is influenced by a person's genetics, their upbringing, and their environmental history - including exposure to violent and vitriolic media, entertainment, and even everyday conversation where there's hatred, xenophobia and racism.

Nuf Sed.....

[Dr Hobbitstein]

20. Peer reviewed studies outweigh your opinion.

[mythology]

21. Japan has all those same video games, plus have had a far longer history of violent porn

and yet they don't have the same issues we do.

Video games and other entertainment have gotten progressively more violent all over the world. And yet they don't have our problems with gun violence. Obviously video games and movies aren't the primary root cause.

[Blue_Adept]

24. And South Korea has some incredibly violent films that get heavily cut for here

And Japan does as well.

In a lot of ways, out violence is "tame" because it's played more to the action/comedy side of it where there are no stakes to it, and there's almost a cartoonishness about it.

Just seeing the differences in remakes of movies from there to here and how toned down they are is fascinating.

[NCTraveler]

34. +1

I don’t necessarily agree with every word but your thoughts are put forward in a sound manner with excellent context to what is being discussed.

You were then asked to be held to a higher standard than is required or necessary to take part here. I appreciate your thoughts that have been derived from a lifetime of experiences and education. Understanding these positions and how they come about are a very important part of the conversation.

There are a lot of people like me out here these days. People who are no longer willing to talk about the issue in a larger context. We want to dicing the issue as being nothing but guns and consider the larger context to be muddying the waters. In all fairness, our approach seems to be catching on and working.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

37. NC, I really miss those good 'ole days when....

a friend and I could sit for long periods of time and discuss almost any issue in depth as gentlemen (and/or ladies) and without a single word in anger or spite, and ZERO politics mentioned. Just a smooth, back-and-forth flow.

That was the best medicine ever for the heart, mind, and spirit.

By the way, two of my very best friends in my lifetime with whom I used to carry on those sorts of talks with (often over beers back in those days) were from NC - one mineralogist (UNC grad, now deceased) and a lady from Charlotte (feeble but still kicking at 72 and smart as a tack). Very broad base of knowledge between us made for a lot of good chats.

Thanks for your kind thoughts and understanding......

[CanSocDem]

23. Totally agree.

Same age, same analysis.


"...a complacent mentality toward doing harm to others, whether by gun or by work of mouth."

Ain't that the truth!


.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

33. Thank you.

The contentiousness and negativity I feel from many people these days in everyday conversation is not making my humble retirement and general mood any easier. I suspect you understand.

Too many people have forgotten - or never learned - how to be ladies and gentlemen to one another.

[Eko]

43. Maybe not.

FBI: US Homicide Rate at 51-Year Low
The US homicide rate in 2014, the most recent year available, was 4.5 per 100,000. The 2014 total follows a long downward trend and is the lowest homicide rate recorded since 1963 when the rate was 4.6 per 100,000. To find a lower homicide rate, we must travel back to 1957 when the total homicide rate hit 4.0 per 100,000.
https://mises.org/wire/fbi-us-homicide-rate-51-year-low

I see what you are saying, but the numbers dont really add up to it. I think its just a byproduct of the news becoming more national and global that we perceive that things are getting worse.

[Eko]

7. Or,

We should outlaw video games with guns but let those same people get real guns. Make sense? Absolutely not.

[greyl]

8. Guns aren't an accessory to anything, they're facilitators and instigators.

(Violence and conflict as entertainment is enjoyed all over Earth)

[Eko]

9. Get rid of movies like Private Ryan, Band of Brothers,

Books like Enders Game, the postman, end Tv shows like walking dead, but keep guns. Insanity. Pure insanity.

[Blue_Adept]

15. Sounds like HBO's upcoming Fahrenheit 451 movie is gonna be timely

[KY_EnviroGuy]

39. Eko, I'm very sorry you misunderstood my intent.

I should have worded it better for context. My statement was not in reference to commercial entertainment or any form of entertainment media.

Also, I fully support strict gun control laws - more strict than many people here would support. And, did I say a single word about ridding society of any type or item of entertainment? No, I did not, and in fact enjoy many of those myself on occasion.

I probably am insane in some fashion, but not for that reason.......

[obamanut2012]

16. 100% wrong -- prove it

[Locrian]

18. I think it contributes

to the gun "culture" absolutely.

I don't think it's causation for people that are already unhinged. They are "outliers" already.

What I really think tv, movies, games etc do is ADVERTISE guns as solutions and make them attractive to people.
Its 24/7 advertising. Same way that cigarettes were advertised in the old days.

I work with people who have bought specific models based on movie, tv etc. They see them more like "accessories" and "cool" things.

So contribute to mass shootings - probably not direct cause.
Contribute to the proliferation - and hence tendency to *have* a gun around (suicide, domestic abuse etc) absolutely.

Don't get me wrong - the right "move" is to follow other countries and make them unavailable. But in the US where there's a gun store or online store for easy availability, the free advertising undoubtedly helps business.

[KY_EnviroGuy]

22. Thanks - good points.

I feel we're in serious denial as a society as to where we're headed collectively in a psychological sense. If it's not being done already, I think we should be doing very serious coordinated (and funded) research in our government and universities as to the causes of mental degradation resulting in mass shootings. Having had some exposure to our mental health industry, I have little faith in that system.

People these days are increasingly filled with division, fear and anger, yet some are suggesting more guns? Not to mention that mental illness is on the upswing due to societal stress. And yet, the Repugs want to de-fund medical and mental health programs and research? These are not good trends.

I see a loaded gun as an instrument of instant death, and only a 1/4" flinch of a finger away - usually driven by a brain that's racked by fear or anger. I would rather live in a society that returns to sticks and stones. Bruises are easy to treat, and to forgive.

[Locrian]

42. thanks

I know, I know, I know.... its the availability.

But what are the reasons people like them? Why (fear, advertising, etc) do they buy them? What "solution" is being marketed as being "solved" by a gun(s)?

And I know some people have it as a hobby. But a shit-ton DONT. They buy them, never train, never do ANYTHING but treat it as a magic talisman to protect against "evil". Until they shoot their eye out or ???

We need some serious research and approach to counter the appeal.

[dchill]

28. My grandkids and I agree that they're just games...

and we agree that it's a good thing there aren't really any Nazi Zombies.

[misanthrope]

11. The more accurate response to the proposition is

what percentage of those who play said games commit these mass shootings?

[nocalflea]

12. Why is Bazooka Joe getting a pass ?

Not fair !

[Blue_Adept]

26. Garfield encouraged a generation of laziness

Which is why people are now more productive than ever!

[Lee-Lee]

25. Honestly, here is the effect I have seen first hand

I don’t think it promotes violence in people not predisposed to it.

I do, however, think that it promotes a very unhealthy attitude about firearms and a very out of touch with reality understanding of them and attitude about them.

In the past most people got their exposure to firearms at an early age at home, at summer camp, even in schools. Tharp learned safety rules, they saw what firearms realistically are. They developed a healthy respect for them. They were just another part of life in the USA.

But in the same period where this safe, responsible introduction to firearms has dinisnsihed the rise of videos game and movies that more and more protray unrealis and unhealthy images of what firearms are have replaced that.

So now, for most youth, all the know about guns is what they have learned in video games.

I see it first hand when I teach firearms safety to 13-25 year olds. The ones who had someone introduce them to firearms responsibility are generally safe and have realistic ideas. The ones who only know video games tend to handle firearms in a much less safe and more flippant manner, as if they are just toys and anything they do isn’t actually harmful- just like it isn’t in the games where you just hit a reset button. They seem awed by large guns based on nothing but size, they think you don’t have to aim. They want to do the usafe crap the see in movies and on games like turn a pistol sideways or shoot two at once. They will argue with me about what a firearm can do or what it’s specs are based on what it can do in the video game, because they assume it’s realistic.

For those who get it, if I hear a student say “Deagle” I know they are going to take extra effort.

This hasn’t just affected the attitudes of people who are already predisposed to violence or sociopathing behavior. It’s also affected the attitude of people who never handle a gun but want gun control and are basing much of their ideas on what moves and games have shown them since they lack any knowledge that is based on actual experience or training.

A good analogy is to imagine if almost all our teens got all of their sex education only from watching hardcore porn, with nobody teaching them about safe sex, consent, etc. How messed up with their knowledge of sex be and what should result from that?

[Paladin]

29. "Deagle": Short for "Desert Eagle," a flashy, large-caliber pistol.

Thought I'd take a quick look at Urban Dictionary, for those of us who didn't get it......

[Lee-Lee]

36. And its a term that came from a video game

After the manufacturer wouldn’t allow the use of the trademarked name they made a smashed up slang version.

[Paladin]

40. Ah, yes. Those awful, awful, awful video games.

No need to look up "ricochet," I recognize one of those when I come across one, literally or figuratively.

[EX500rider]

46. lol, you should keep a Desert Eagle around and let them break their wrist with it..

...just kidding, but a .50 cal pistol is not for the faint of heart or slight of frame.

[dchill]

27. THERE'S your meme!

[Blue_Tires]

30. Even the GOP doesn't believe that, but the NRA owns them

and like loyal little toadies when the NRA tells them to reach into the grab bag of "Post mass shooting distractions to shift the discussion away from gun control" they follow orders...

[Va Lefty]

31. "thoughts and prayers" to the victims of Grand Theft Auto

[RainCaster]

32. Especially in Australia, UK, Sweden...

Yeah those countries are really having a hard time with all that gun violence.

[MicaelS]

38. Even if video games were linked to violence...

With peer-reviewed studies, IMO many people would reject blaming games, the same way the NRA rejects blaming guns.

[workinclasszero]

41. Also.....

Thoughts and prayers are all we can do to stop the slaughter of our children.